Translation controversy

Many news sources repeated the Islamic Republic of Iran Broadcasting statement by Ahmadinejad that "Israel must be wiped off the map",[5][6] an English idiom which means to "cause a place to stop existing",[7] or to "obliterate totally",[8] or "destroy completely".[9]

Ahmadinejad's phrase was "???? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ???" according to the text published on the President's Office's website.[10]

The translation presented by the official Islamic Republic News Agency has been challenged by Arash Norouzi, who says the statement "wiped off the map" was never made and that Ahmadinejad did not refer to the nation or land mass of Israel, but to the "regime occupying Jerusalem". Norouzi translated the original Persian to English, with the result, "the Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."[11] Juan Cole, a University of Michigan Professor of Modern Middle East and South Asian History, agrees that Ahmadinejad's statement should be translated as, "the Imam said that this regime occupying Jerusalem (een rezhim-e eshghalgar-e qods) must [vanish from] the page of time (bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad).[12] According to Cole, "Ahmadinejad did not say he was going to 'wipe Israel off the map' because no such idiom exists in Persian." Instead, "he did say he hoped its regime, i.e., a Jewish-Zionist state occupying Jerusalem, would collapse."[13] The Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) translated the phrase similarly, as "this regime" must be "eliminated from the pages of history."[14]

Iranian government sources denied that Ahmadinejad issued any sort of threat. On 20 February 2006, Iran's foreign minister Manouchehr Mottaki told a news conference: "How is it possible to remove a country from the map? He is talking about the regime. We do not recognize legally this regime."[15][16][17]

Shiraz Dossa, a professor of Political Science at St. Francis Xavier University in Nova Scotia, Canada, also believes the text is a mistranslation.[18]

Ahmadinejad was quoting the Ayatollah Khomeini in the specific speech under discussion: what he said was that "the occupation regime over Jerusalem should vanish from the page of time." No state action is envisaged in this lament; it denotes a spiritual wish, whereas the erroneous translation – "wipe Israel off the map" – suggests a military threat. There is a huge chasm between the correct and the incorrect translations. The notion that Iran can "wipe out" U.S.-backed, nuclear-armed Israel is ludicrous.[19][20][21]

Bowlartz posted:

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"Ahmadinejad did not refer to the nation or land mass of Israel, but to the "regime occupying Jerusalem". "



Is that really the story you want to use as your "rebuttal"?


"We didn't say we wanted the "Land" to leave the map, we just want all the people dead. Duh, stupid Americans".

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Asked if he objected to the government of Israel or Jewish people, he said that "creating an objection against the Zionists doesn't mean that there are objections against the Jewish". He added that Jews lived in Iran and were represented in the country's parliament.

illmyrin posted:

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Translation controversy

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Corky_Aloof posted:

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FOXNEWS says he did, so there you go.

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Altra_Shadowstalker posted:

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Wow, six years behind the times on this one illy. There's a whole new "controversy" about the same sort of thing in the news earlier this or last month.

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Koneg posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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Translation controversy

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What controversy? It was Iran's own translation posted on their own damn web site? Hell it was the title headline of the story:

Ahmadinejad: Israel must be wiped off the map.

How much more definitive do you need?? And who's doing the lying? The revisionists or the apologists?

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Fist_de_Yuma posted:

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Strange that conservatives will work their spin on such a story. What is sad is some really believe it.

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illmyrin posted:

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No Koneg- Wiped off the map was a NY times translation from the same CIA spy promoting today's news story.

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On October 26, 2005, IRIB News, an English-language subsidiary of the state-controlled Islamic Republic of Iran Broadcasting (IRIB), filed a story on Ahmadinejad's speech to the "World Without Zionism" conference in Asia, entitled: Ahmadinejad: Israel must be wiped off the map

eodoll posted:

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According to garth iraq had lots of WMD too. except at the last minute with all eyes watching iraq the WMD were loaded on trucks and sent to syria.. Possibly iran too.

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SirGarth posted:

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eodoll posted:

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According to garth iraq had lots of WMD too. except at the last minute with all eyes watching iraq the WMD were loaded on trucks and sent to syria.. Possibly iran too.

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that's exactly what i said in the wake of the Iraq invasion - i believed Colin Powell and others before, it seemed plausible at the time since Iraq had actually used WMDs against Iran in the past.

in this case, i don't care what the translations say - Iran's actions speak far louder than their words. although it's very telling who around here finds Iran's government to be more credible and straightforward than the United States.

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SirGarth posted:

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lol who's talking about stripping you of your citizenship?

i think you have the US and Iran confused.

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SirGarth posted:

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your rants are becoming increasingly coherent. have you considered moving to the safe haven that is Iran?
i'm not sure why you'd stick around someplace like the US if you really think it's that bad.

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Garthy posted:

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are you seriously considering "engaging in or supporting hostilities against the United States"?

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"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you, then you win."

Tych2 posted:

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Normally I don't get personal with people here except to mock them in good fun, but I have to ask a question illmyrin and you can choose to ignore it and I won't badger you about it.

Aren't you having a bunch of personal problems? Are you in a position to actually call someone else out? Wouldn't your time be better spent fixing your issues rather than wasting your time on such nonsense? It just seems to me you are wasting an awful lot of energies on frivolous things.

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the_great_intex posted:

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"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you, then you win."

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illmyrin posted:

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Sorry? Personal problems? Did someone send you a memo or something? My cats are happy, I'm working, my rent is paid, my father is dying, my grandfather is dying, my daughter has her first big show tomorrow night for Drama club and I'm sipping a Dr.Pepper. Things are great.

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Tych2 posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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Sorry? Personal problems? Did someone send you a memo or something? My cats are happy, I'm working, my rent is paid, my father is dying, my grandfather is dying, my daughter has her first big show tomorrow night for Drama club and I'm sipping a Dr.Pepper. Things are great.

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Sorry, I must be thinking of someone else. Ignore my post.

Good luck on your daughter's show and sorry to hear about your dad and grandfather.

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Tych2 posted:

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the_great_intex posted:

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"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they attack you, then you win."

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I know why you didn't attribute that to anyone.

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illmyrin posted:

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What you don't like Dr.Pepper?

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the_great_intex posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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What you don't like Dr.Pepper?

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illmyrin posted:

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Altra_Shadowstalker posted:

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Wow, six years behind the times on this one illy. There's a whole new "controversy" about the same sort of thing in the news earlier this or last month.

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I'm 6 years behind the times? lol Both of these instances are based on the same quote from the same religious figure which, 6 years ago, I posted about and remembered. Same headlines, same quote, same lies about what it means.

Wiped off the map = Vanish from the page of history


Silly Iranians for speaking in metaphors.

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SirGarth posted:

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You're unhinged...

You said you were concerned about being stripped of your citizenship because of a bill that is very specific in its language about American citizens who choose to become enemy combatants...
I also hate to burst your bubble, but my salary is paid by you, assuming you still pay federal taxes.

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SirGarth posted:

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You're unhinged...

You said you were concerned about being stripped of your citizenship because of a bill that is very specific in its language about American citizens who choose to become enemy combatants... But not paranoid conspiracy nuts condemning the US while seemingly swallowing the propaganda of another hostile nation, you're still covered by the 1st amendment.

I also hate to burst your bubble, but my salary is paid by you, assuming you still pay federal taxes.

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SirGarth posted:

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You're unhinged...

You said you were concerned about being stripped of your citizenship because of a bill that is very specific in its language about American citizens who choose to become enemy combatants... But not paranoid conspiracy nuts condemning the US while seemingly swallowing the propaganda of another hostile nation, you're still covered by the 1st amendment.

I also hate to burst your bubble, but my salary is paid by you, assuming you still pay federal taxes.

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IMHO posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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What you don't like Dr.Pepper?

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I thought DrPepper was a laxative.

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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SirGarth posted:

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You're unhinged...

You said you were concerned about being stripped of your citizenship because of a bill that is very specific in its language about American citizens who choose to become enemy combatants... But not paranoid conspiracy nuts condemning the US while seemingly swallowing the propaganda of another hostile nation, you're still covered by the 1st amendment.

I also hate to burst your bubble, but my salary is paid by you, assuming you still pay federal taxes.

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Also who are you to call anyone unhinged ?


They don't agree with your convinient lies, therefore they are crazy ?

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SirGarth posted:

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IMHO posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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What you don't like Dr.Pepper?

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I thought DrPepper was a laxative.

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Apparently it is a very effective one.

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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Why'd you clam up ?

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illmyrin posted:

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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SirGarth posted:

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You're unhinged...

You said you were concerned about being stripped of your citizenship because of a bill that is very specific in its language about American citizens who choose to become enemy combatants... But not paranoid conspiracy nuts condemning the US while seemingly swallowing the propaganda of another hostile nation, you're still covered by the 1st amendment.

I also hate to burst your bubble, but my salary is paid by you, assuming you still pay federal taxes.

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Also who are you to call anyone unhinged ?


They don't agree with your convinient lies, therefore they are crazy ?

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He is calling me Unhinged. It's a cheap shot because everyone already knows it's true

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illmyrin posted:

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He is calling me Unhinged. It's a cheap shot because everyone already knows it's true

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Rosaria posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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He is calling me Unhinged. It's a cheap shot because everyone already knows it's true

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But its a unique and interesting unhinged and we love you anyway.

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Rosaria posted:

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What specifically are you worried about Illy? If it is that we will execute a 'police action' against Iran I can put that worry to rest - yes, we are.

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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WHy no response to my posts Garth ?




Why'd you clam up ?

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illmyrin posted:

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Rosaria posted:

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What specifically are you worried about Illy? If it is that we will execute a 'police action' against Iran I can put that worry to rest - yes, we are.

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Mutual defense agreements with Russia and China for a start. Remember, for me, all these current events will eventuate into a pre-emptive attack against our country that will remove us from the global stage prior to the next set of horrors facing the world.

I don't trust our leadership's visionary muscle.

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SirGarth posted:

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Orwyn, when you say something interesting i'll respond to you. Until then, have you considered AC Friends?

ill, i owe you an apology - by unhinged i just meant to say you were getting a little melty, i'm sorry that it came across as anything else. i like and enjoy your posts here.

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Rosaria posted:

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Its inevitable at this point, and I usually don't worry about things like that although I know you do. Iran's economy is nose-diving, their currency is crashing, even their black market which is usually thriving is crashing. Their gold market which is world renown is suffering badly because people are hoarding precious metals against high inflation and an increasingly worthless currency. Other Middle Eastern countries are refusing to accept payment for goods/services in the Iranian Rial and are slowly closing avenues of trade. So, they blame Israel and ratchet up inflammatory rhetoric. I don't think this translates to a strike against the US but I could be wrong. I don't think they can afford it, literally.

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Koneg posted:

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Orwyn_Blackheart posted:

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Why'd you clam up ?

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Isn't it obvious?

Not enough Dr. Pepper.

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illmyrin posted:

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I think he is from Sweden.

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Bobvillas posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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I think he is from Sweden.

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English Muslim.

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imaloon1 posted:

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Rosaria posted:

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Its inevitable at this point, and I usually don't worry about things like that although I know you do. Iran's economy is nose-diving, their currency is crashing, even their black market which is usually thriving is crashing. Their gold market which is world renown is suffering badly because people are hoarding precious metals against high inflation and an increasingly worthless currency. Other Middle Eastern countries are refusing to accept payment for goods/services in the Iranian Rial and are slowly closing avenues of trade. So, they blame Israel and ratchet up inflammatory rhetoric. I don't think this translates to a strike against the US but I could be wrong. I don't think they can afford it, literally.

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I was unaware of their tenuous currency situation. Is it really that bad? And how can their economy be in a proverbial nose dive when they are a net energy exporter still? Mismanagement?

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Bobvillas posted:

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illmyrin posted:

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I think he is from Sweden.

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English Muslim.

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