Amendial
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hmmm interesting story here.......
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Former Miami player accusing the Jets of forming a wall to deter the gunner from Miami. The article makes a some vaild points, that was a very curious soccer like wall they had formed there, and it does appear another guy leans a shoulder out to hit the gunner also. If this true and they were ordered to be there, then I would be very pissed off about my punishment and being thrown under the bus by the Jets if I was Alosi. I truly believe no on would order him to intentionally trip a player, but by ordering him to be there in the first place the Jets are atleast half responsible for this horrible event. The NFL needs to look into this.
http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=5919573
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Amendial
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hmmm interesting story here.......
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So now the plot thickens:
http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=5922926
Jets are admitting that the wall was infact ordered to be put there, but get this, they are saying that Alosi ordered it to be there. This smells like a cover up if you ask me, that definitely sounds like a coach trying to cover his own behind by throwing someone already hated by the media under the bus. The NFL needs to do some further digging into this if they really care about player safety, and if the Jets are found responsible they should lose a draft pick just as New England did with the spygate scandel.
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.Juzam.
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hmmm interesting story here.......
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Personally, I have no problem with the wall being there. Its perfectly legal for them to be on their own sideline as long as they are within that drawn line. If it impedes the gunner, then so be it. (Now the tripping - or moving in front of the gunner - I would have a problem with. But if you are there before the ball is snapped, why should you have to move out from a perfectly legal place to stand on your own sidelines to help out the other team?)
If you are running up the field to get to the return guy, why run 5 yards out of bounds in the first place... I know the gunners get pushed around by the defenders, but seriously, if they put 2 defenders on each gunner, then split another guy out wide. You still have the advantage blocking for the kick.
Again, the tripping was wrong. But I don't see the big deal about the line itself.
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Amendial
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I think the issue is in the fact that the wall was intentionally put there to mess with the gunner, and that because it was there this incident ended up happening. If the NY Jets ordered Alosi to be there, then they have to share some of the responsiblity of what happened. By being ordered to be there you are installing a focus to disrupt the gunner, which can lead to the next step in disrupting the gunner: tripping him. There is a big difference between minding your own business on your sideline, and intentionally making a wall to impeed on an opposing player trying to make a play. Yes they were in their legal spot and everything else was within the rules, but they were not just casually minding their own business, they were there with the intent to distrupt that gunner, and that is exactally what happened and almost got him hurt. Intent is the real issue here.
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.Juzam.
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While I agree about the intent factor, in the video I watched of this particular play, the wall was 10-15 feet off the field of play. You absolutely should be able to tell your own players to stand in any order or form any walls you want that far from the field of play on your own bench.
If you devote 2 defenders to force one gunner that far out of bounds, then the opposing team should have a second gunner lined up to the inside. If you are a gunner who gets pushed that far out of bounds, you don't deserve to be in on the tackle anyway.
There absolutely should be repercussions for the coach that stuck his knee out. That crosses the line for me - but only because in the video he knew he was coming. Had he been talking with his back to the gunner and stepped back at the right/wrong time, that would be different as well. Either way, having all the players lined up there because it was a punt in the first place is fine by me.
I dunno, I guess its shades of grey when you are trying to get an advantage. Whats fair, and whats legal are not always the same thing.
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Amendial
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Apparently the wall formation that the NY Jets employed is in fact illegal in the NFL. That makes this all the more interesting. Also I love how the Jets are trying to throw the Patriots under the bus in this article. I have lost almost all respect for the Jets organization over this incident, even more so than I did for New England over spygate.
http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/columns/story?columnist=cimini_rich&id=5924363
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.Juzam.
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I have no love for the Jets, or the Patriots for that matter. But it seems odd to me that there is a rule against where your guys can stand that far away from the playing field. I remember back in the day, my coaches made sure we stood behind the outline (Equivalent of the big white sideline box in the NFL) and between the coaches boxes. That was about it - but I am the first to admit I never played in the NFL. Of course, I also never got run out of bounds on a punt either...
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I cant believe you do not see what the big deal is. Sure they have a white line, but forming a wall with your toes to the very edge of that white line is just asking for touble. If they were just standing around, casually talking behind the white line somewhere this wouldnt be an issue. But they were intentionally trying to have some kind of impact on the play by forming that wall, and that has to be illegal. When you set up a wall with the intent of having an impact on the play stuff like what Alosi did happens. If that wall is never ordered to be there, than I doubt that incident ever happens. Thats why you restrict stuff like that, to prevent the potential for it to happen.
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Amendial
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Look at it this way, the kid who goes to the playground looking for a fight usually finds one.
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Stiger
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Alosi sticking his knee out and interfering with the play was wrong and he deserved to be suspended.
That said...
If they've been doing this for a long time and this is the first time we're even mentioning the practice then I guess I don't see it as a big deal either. Nobody has complained until Alosi got overzealous and stupid. They're behind the line. You're saying they can stand there casually, but not lined up? Now we're legislating the stance of the coaching staff? Will the team get a 5 yard penalty for giving the gunner the "Evil Eye" as he runs by?
So what if the wall is designed to intimidate the player as he runs down the line? It's pro football. Everything these coaches do is planned to mess with the opposing players' minds. That's part of the game.
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Liquid741
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i thought the play was JV, and i dont like the Jets.
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I don't see what the big deal is mainly because this was done so far from the field of play. If they Jets were 'cheating' in forming a wall on their own bench 5 yards off the field, then the gunner was most definitely 'cheating' by leaving the field of play to gain an advantage over the defense in the first place. Why on earth are the gunners allowed to run up the sidelines that far off the field in the first place?
That gunner was much further off the field than the wall and the wall forced him to come back to the field quicker than he wanted. If nothing else, the wall was funneling him back into the field of play where I think he should be playing the game anyway. I would think that there would have been a penalty if the defense 'shoved him' out of bounds 10 yards. While possible, that seems awful excessive for being pushed out of bounds.
Maybe its because I don't care about either team involved that I don't really care about this wall thing.
Again though, actively tripping the guy with his knee is wrong. But think of this, had he tripped the guy and he gotten back up and kept running, no one would have said a thing about this.
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Amendial
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Five yards, come on. Watch it again that is maybe two yards off the field of play at most. To say he has no right out there is ignorant. Let me put two guy on you and have them both push you toward the sideline and lets see what happens to you. If the gunner is staying out of bounds too long let the refs handle it by throwing a flag, because there are rules to restrict that. But dont be using an approach saying they are clear way from the field of play, they were not that far away from the boundry.
I just watched it again and I would say they were probably only a yard out of the field of play, maybe 1.25 yards out. Not far at all, and the runner did appear to be following NFL rules.
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