Liquid741
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Subject:
The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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i was listening to Mike and Mike in the Morning on ESPN radio and they were talking about the pass that will haunt Brett's career. so it made me think...do you think that terrible pass rates up with Bill Buckner ball between the wickets, Chris Webbers timeout? do you think his pass rates up their with those terrible mistakes?
granted there were other things to take into consideration for the loss..such as the penalty that pushed them back and other plays throughout the game. but he had the opportunity to run and slide, putting them back into field goal range for Longwell...its not a gimme, but well within his range to make. and it wasnt the Super Bowl...
i honestly think that Brett felt the pressure to put them into position, and his ego came out and his hero complex won over.
so, what do you guys think about the pass and does it rate with some of the worst mistakes in sports history?
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Pariahwulfen
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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I believe part of this has to do with the fact that it JUST happened, five or ten years from now it won't be viewed as such a big mistake.
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Ynisfre
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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There are plays that led more directly to a team losing a championship, so no, I wouldn't put it up as one of the worst necessarily.
I have gone into this in some detail in other threads, but something about the play (I guess that fact that everyone was talking about it) made me really consider the reality vs. the perception. I've come to the conclusion that if a guy like Kyle Orton makes this play, he's not getting killed for it the next day. Even a great QB like Kurt Warner wouldn't be taking as much heat. In this case, the fact that Favre is Favre, and his pass (err, past) history is what it is, is influencing the narrative.
If you look at the play, Brett is not getting past the 35 yard line. He is rolling at around the 41, there's a guy to his left who may or may not close on him, and a linebacker waiting to charge him at the 30 yard line.
Obviously the coaches wanted them to be closer in, which is why they were scrambling for the right play, why they got a five yard penalty, and why the pressure was even more on Favre. They went conservative for two downs, and then it blew up in their face on third.
Favre made an error, but it was one borne not only of his hero mentality (which I think is a good call on your part) but also just the circumstance. The coaches wanted to get inside 50 yards (the original LOS was the 33) and Favre's calculation was that the throw was a better risk than, say, a 52 yarder. He was wrong. However, since it didn't take certain points off the board, didn't lead to Saints points, and there was still an overtime period to play- I think that all adds up to less than a Buckner between the legs mistake.
And that doesn't even take into consideration how beat up he was, and how many fumbles the Vikings as a team had. They easily could have been leading going itno that drive.
Favre's bad INT in the previous NFC championship game he was in, and his history of making a bad throw for every two great ones is what's defining this, moreso than what actually happened. At least imo.
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.Juzam.
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Subject:
The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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I see that as just the worst turnover of a LOT of turnovers that cost Minnesota the game. They needed another 20 yards to get a reasonable chance at a field goal and he tried to do too much. But that loss cannot be blamed on Farve alone, even with all the fumbles and interceptions, they still scored 37 points... The offense had opportunities to score more and did not, but the defense also gave up a lot of scores. They also could have won the game in overtime after that interception, they just did not.
Edit- what Ynisfre said too! 
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Amendial
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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I would not put it on the level of the Buckner play. That was for a World Championship. This was just for a NFC Championship, and nothing was guarenteed even if he doesn't throw that pass. I do think the deserves the blame for that loss though. Right after the play was over my friend from New Orleans and I looked at each other and said at the same time, "why didn't he run?" He could have picked up 5-10 yards easily. That would have put them into Longwell FG range easily. Don't forget he made a 55+ yarder the year before to get them into the playoffs and win a Division title. It was certianly in his range to make that kick. What makes the Farve INT worse than the fumbles is the fact that is was the last offensive play they would run. With the fumbles they got a chance to make up for those mistakes, the INT they did not. It was the nail in their Superbowl coffin. The bigger thing is that the mistake he made was a rookie mistake, you do not throw across you body while rolling out right, that is just asking for a pic.
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Liquid741
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Subject:
The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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i love all the responses, and agree with a lot of them...i do however that Farve being Farve in this game...might have cost them a repeat chance at obtaining a championship. but also the Vikes got what they paid for...this year was amazing for Farve, his low interceptions and the ability to control the game. the Vikes got a hell of a deal this year, and was put in the position they thought they would be in by getting Farve.
just that ol'boy mentality sneaks its ugly head around sometimes and you see the Farve from the past...
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Pariahwulfen
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Subject:
The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Ynisfre posted:
There are plays that led more directly to a team losing a championship...
As a Browns fan I can think of a few plays against the Broncos that fit this description.
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Sprakjr_Sybau
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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I don't know if that one pass will haunt him... he's done that crap a thousand times in his career.
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Bernion
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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As a Packers fan all I can say to the Vikings losing by shooting themselves in the foot.....YEAH DOESN'T SO WELL WHEN THE SHOE'S ON THE OTHER FOOT NOW DOES IT!?!?!?!?!
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Boone-Eldar
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Even with all the turnovers the Vikings still should have won the game. The officiating crew gave the game to the Saints with the lack of calls on blatant holds on the Jared Allen and Kevin Williams (I counted at least 5 times where jerseys were blatantly pulled, 2 on TD passes by Brees), the no call on the low hit on Favre (where he threw one of his Ints) and most importantly the horribly blown reviews in OT (That was an obvious non catch).
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Amendial
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Im just messing around with the Farve thing, but blaming the officals? Come on, get over it. For ever supposed "blown call" against the Vikings you can find a "blown call" against the Saints. It works both ways. At the end of the day the Vikings had the ball in field goal range with a chance to win. Farve threw a pic and that is why they are not playing in the Superbowl. If you want to go even more to the extreme count the two redzone fumbles. The refs did not blow this game, the Vikings did.
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Slaval
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Sadly this would probably not have been a loss for the Vikings if it had not been for the the lousy overtime system he NFL has. In no other major sport do you go the whole time in regulation relying on all aspects of your team to preform and win the game. To only go to overtime and potentially have it comedown to one aspect of your team to win or lose the game. Have never and will never like the NFL OT.
I understand the stats associated with winning the coin toss and the fact they don't want a game to last forever. So here is what I suggest. Both team must get the ball on offense at least once (like college). If neither team scores then it comes down to whoever scores first. If one team scores and the other doesn't its over. If both teams score identical points (FG vs FG or TD vs TD) it then comes down to Time of Possession. The fast team to have scored wins. This will make sure no game drags out forever, and that all aspects of the team are tested to win. Even more so then the current system because now it becomes a factor whether your defense can force them to slow down and score slower or if your offense can run a fast offense. It also challenges coaches to call the plays that will accurately and quickly score against their opponents. Just my thoughts.
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Amendial
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That isnt all that great of a system either. Tell me that a good Offensive team doesnt have an advantage over a bad offensive or run oriented team in that situation Slavel. A run team should almost always have longer TOP scoring drives than teams like the Colts and Saints. That is like saying here you go high powered passing teams here is the win, even if you do not play defense then can still win because your offense is built to score quickly unlike the opponets offense. There is not 100% fair way to do the overtime system. I like the NFL OT system, you want to win the game, play a little defense.
I have proposed one alternate system. College rules but score it similar to an NHL shootout. You score two points for every TD, and one for a FG. The team who has the most overtime points wins the game, and gets one point added to the end of regulation score to make them the winner. None of the overtime stats count toward game stats, season stats, team stats, or career stats; it is like the overtime never even happened. That would be the only way I can see NCAA type of overtime in the NFL. There is no way I could support the NFL if a game ended 49-48, after being tied 17-17 after regulation.
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Slaval
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Amendial posted:
That isnt all that great of a system either. Tell me that a good Offensive team doesnt have an advantage over a bad offensive or run oriented team in that situation Slavel. A run team should almost always have longer TOP scoring drives than teams like the Colts and Saints. That is like saying here you go high powered passing teams here is the win, even if you do not play defense then can still win because your offense is built to score quickly unlike the opponets offense. There is not 100% fair way to do the overtime system. I like the NFL OT system, you want to win the game, play a little defense.
Not necessarily because most teams will go to a prevent (2 minute) defense where all they are doing is trying to not give up the big throwing play. This could open up a good running team to run fairly fast down the field. Where as a throwing team is going to slowly move down the field as well eating up the clock somewhat with smaller passes.
As for you liking it you contradict yourself right in that paragraph. My system isnt fair because it gives an advantage to the good offensive team. Under the current system it does the same or should I say it gives a disadvantage to the not so good defensive team. How anyone can like a system where after 60 minutes of play and all aspects of your team can be won or loss by a coin toss and one aspect of your team is beyond me but ok, its your opinion. 
Edit: Also under my system several new and fun scenarios could come out of it. If Team A scores a TD and Team B scores one but knows it took more time it is then forced to try the 2 point conversion.
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Amendial
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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That is a huge assumption that teams will play prevent defense. What if the opposing offense goes on a one play touchdown to start the OT with. Now your offense gets a one play hail mary, the opposing team can stick all its defenders in the endzone. Sure your offense got a one play chance, but the coin flip let your opponets score really nullify your offensive chance with the ball. The second things is when would you end the game? The second your TOP exceeds your opponets or would you let the opposing team play it out. The going for two thing can be a very unfair to. Lets say a team is going second and scores, they know they are going to lose the TOP battle. They go for two and get it, they won because the coin flip put them in a position to know they had to convert that two point conversion. Your system does not make it anymore fair, it just takes the burden of responsiblity off the defense and puts it on the offense. Instead of it being the defense job to get a stop, it is just their job to slow them down. That does not sound like an appealing system to me, I would rather keep it the way it is.
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stevenonfire
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I would suggest the Vikings figure out who will be taking over for him in 2012.
Helpful Hint: Its not Sage Rosenfels or Tarvarus Jackson
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Ynisfre
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The Brett Farve Pass....and History.
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Ouch
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