Lil-Blub
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Feb LTTP:
So let's talk about this new part of the rare item system. You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' before, but a more accurate name would be 'real time rare system' because finding these rares is based on real time, not on the number of creatures killed. In short, every character with the Throne of Destiny expansion is guaranteed the chance to find at least one rare item every two months, in addition to the rare items that they might have found in that time in the old way.
What do you have to do to benefit from this new system? Nothing special! You will still find rare items by killing eligible creatures. The real time rare system just makes sure that regardless of how limited your play time is, and even if you have a streak of bad luck, as long as you can get out and do a little killing, you will find at least one rare item every two months.
In addition, we've had time to collate the data about how many rare items players are finding so far. Even with the addition of the real time rare system, this number is a bit low, especially for the highest tiers of rare items. What good are all these super-cool rare items if no one ever finds them? So also in the February update we will be making your chances of finding a high tier rare item just a smidgeon higher.
Get ready for a SLEW of ACTOOL/SKUNKWORKS macros for logging in and out! It will be down to delays and everything, unless Turbine has a detection system in place!
Great move. Screw the economy over once again by allowing people to cheat the system. 
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I don't think that logging in and out will trigger it, from what I see it is based on time.
Basically all this means is that my Trade Bot and Buff Bot will be gathering rares.
Maybe.
Either way, it just makes "Commons" (Sorry, I don't call them Rares, because they aren't, I have 2 packs full), even more common.
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kgober
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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trolling. or alarmist. or both.
I see nothing in that text to imply that logging on and off will speed up your timer, or indeed that there is any way to 'game' the system at all.
-ken
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Drakier
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I think you mis-read what it said..
as I understand it, you can only get the rares by killing creatures, and this is to hopefully get people to log in more toons more often to get rares. You don't get the rare just by logging in and out. In fact.. I don't think logging in or out in any amount would really affect the rare drop rate..
I could be wrong, but after reading it, I just think that this system is created to get more people to play more of the toons on their account rather than just a main character. I think this just helps guarantee people more rares who play more characters rather than the rares only going to the people who kill a LOT of rare-eligible creatures.
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Drakier posted:
I think you mis-read what it said..
as I understand it, you can only get the rares by killing creatures, and this is to hopefully get people to log in more toons more often to get rares. You don't get the rare just by logging in and out. In fact.. I don't think logging in or out in any amount would really affect the rare drop rate..
I could be wrong, but after reading it, I just think that this system is created to get more people to play more of the toons on their account rather than just a main character. I think this just helps guarantee people more rares who play more characters rather than the rares only going to the people who kill a LOT of rare-eligible creatures.
I would say you are wrong, mainly because of this line ... "NOT on the number of creatures killed"
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Drixen
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you still have to kill creatures to get these rares.. its just a that i have known ppl that have played for months and if lucky have found one rare.. they are just allowing those ppl to find rares too.. cause it was based on how much you kill.. so now all you need to do is aput a little time in hunting durning say a 2months basis.. and your chance of getting a rare goes up.. say you log in to hunt like once a day for an hour.. your garenteed in 2months to find at least 1 rare now
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Lord_Anton
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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nm
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Drixen posted:
you still have to kill creatures to get these rares.. its just a that i have known ppl that have played for months and if lucky have found one rare.. they are just allowing those ppl to find rares too.. cause it was based on how much you kill.. so now all you need to do is aput a little time in hunting durning say a 2months basis.. and your chance of getting a rare goes up.. say you log in to hunt like once a day for an hour.. your garenteed in 2months to find at least 1 rare now
True, guess I'll have to take run my Buff Bot and Trade Bot to to Pincers and Tusker Tusks once every month or two so I can get more XPs and Rares.
Bottom line, Turbine is trying to adopt what Blizzard did years ago with WoW (except with a twist), Blizzard has a system where you will get bonus XPs if you don't CONSTANTLY play the game. The system caters to the "casual player" ... With AC, it has always been about loot (AC's loot system is far and away, the best of any MMORPG out there) and this is just a logical extension of it.
No matter how it actually works, people will figure it out and the old motto will once again be done ... Exploit Early, Exploit Often.
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Drakier
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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how am I wrong Arch?
The only way to get rares is to kill creatures. This login rare system is meant to get more people to log in and hunt with more toons than just one. The whole point is that it UPS the percentage of chance you have of receiving a drop over that 2 month period basically guaranteeing that you'll receive at least one rare every 2 months.
And as usual, the more creatures you kill in general, the better your chances of pulling a rare are, just the number of creatures isn't as much of a factor in this new system.
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Hamfast
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I think that the requirement is to kill an Eligable MOB with a Character, in otherwords, my buffbot (level 109 or so) with no real combat skill, will need to kill a level 100+ MOB every 2 months to find a Rare... I hope it's a Dagger Rare, that will help her in 2 months...
We will see...until then, we are only guessing
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Hamfast posted:
I think that the requirement is to kill an Eligable MOB with a Character, in otherwords, my buffbot (level 109 or so) with no real combat skill, will need to kill a level 100+ MOB every 2 months to find a Rare... I hope it's a Dagger Rare, that will help her in 2 months...
We will see...until then, we are only guessing
Yeah, just dual log the toon with a real toon to imp/vuln the monsters and while they are chewing on them, have the gimp bot walk up and nail them.
Gonna be easy to exploit this one.
Complete waste of Turbines time IMO. I mean come on, "Rares" weren't exactly rare to begin with already.
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Zegeger
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Your confusing rare on the global sense over rare on an individuals point of view. They may not be "rare" but they are certainly not common for every player. The reason you say they are not rare is because some people hunt 6 hours a day every day. Those people will most likely find many more rares, but that only does me any good if I have the trade notes to buy it from them. If I don't then its just as rare to me as it was before.
I like this because it will provide some benifit to casual players who can't or don't want to hunt all that much all the time, and allow them to experiance rares. Those killing lots should still get more, so they aren't losing all that much out of the deal.
Yes it will cause players to break out their alts and kill some monsters every 2 months, but I don't see that as a bad thing. People might find they enjoy playing that char abit more and do more with them. Either way, what is the problem with there being more rares, besides the economy on them?
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Arch_Magi
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If Turbine really wants to overhaul the rare system for the benefit of the "casual player", then they can start with getting rid of the vast majority of completely worthless Rares that are out there ... Like +250 to Person Assess and +250 to Monster Assess. Same for Tessera on those same skills. Then they can address the fact that people are still finding Major War cantrips on Shields and weapons.
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Zegeger
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With completeness in mind, I don't think removing them would be the answer, however I wouldn't mind seeing some sort of Rare Collector NPC, where you can turn in (useless) rares for something in return (XP, or some other kind of gem thats not as good as most rares, but would be useful, etc.)
Then even finding a rare thats useless would be interesting because you still can get something out of it.
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Midnite-FF
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Every time Turbine does something nice for us, someone has to bitterly complain.
My take on it is that I gotta kill stuff to experience the improved percentage possibility, but they aren't gonna count the critters to determine how much killing I did.
Either way, it helps me cause I haven't been able to play as much lately.
I think that anything Turbine does to try to make things better is a good thing. They oughtta give me a Wi Cannon and allow me to shoot the complainers from any server. Then the complainers would experience about a week or two of their online time with a severe Wi flag.
I'm gonna go pout now.
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BlueScreenOfDeath
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You will stil have to kill a creature to find the rare, it will not just pop up in your pack. The more time you play the higher the odds of finding a rare.
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Electric_Amish
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In the converse, I suppose if Turbine can force a player to receive a rare every two months, I suppose they could also prevent it??
Just a thought for those considering the pharming potential...
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kinslayer271
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are they talking about the higher teir rares? or just rares over all?
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asheron86
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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they're talking about all rares in general
ooh geez all arch_magi does is complain
he must be a bitter bitter person irl
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Gdinero_FF
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It's really not a big deal. People who hunt a lot are finding them far, far more often than once every two months.
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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asheron86 posted:
they're talking about all rares in general
ooh geez all arch_magi does is complain
he must be a bitter bitter person irl
Save it, I just THINK alot.
I have been playing computer games since 1984 and have been online shortly there after. I have just seen alot in my time. One thing that I see alot of, starting with my playing of "pencil and paper" games in the 70's was .... There are people who will seek out and exploit any possible "weakness" in a system.
It doesn't take much thought to design something right the first time, when you compare the amount of time that it will take to correct something afterwards.
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Maddy_ACEDL
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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<< I have been playing computer games since 1984 >>
newbie
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Lokkie_the_Fierce
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kgober posted:
trolling. or alarmist. or both.
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Tiviee
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I've logged on characters from other servers and hunted and zero rares - so sounds like your blowing wind with this theory.
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Maglett_of_FF
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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The new addition to the Rare system STARTS with Feb patch.
You *STILL* have to hunt stuff that meets the requiements for generating a rare, it's not a 'Login rare system', it's a 'Increased odds over Time' system.
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vellus
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day 1 will be Feb 15, let's say the patch in April is April 15. So you will be guaranteed a rare by April 14, on one of your kills.
They somehow managed to have your personal chance of finding a rare increase over time, for the duration you do not find one. The minute you find one, the two month thing starts over.
OR at least that is how I read it.
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pookybear348
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as it is now some dungies are better then others for rares. 1 i find a lot in and often and some will go days without.i have had 100s so far. 1 dungie they are not rare at all and yields like 1 an hour to 1 of the fellow members.
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Paraduck
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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pookybear348 posted:
as it is now some dungies are better then others for rares. 1 i find a lot in and often and some will go days without.i have had 100s so far. 1 dungie they are not rare at all and yields like 1 an hour to 1 of the fellow members.
Myth. The chance of finding a rare is 1:2500 for each eligible kill. The game doesn't give a crap where you're at or what you're killing as long as you meet the eligibility requirements (level and AC: TD owner.)
Vellus' understanding of the change is in line with mine as well. There's not much to worry about here.
As for drop rate increases, the higher tier -- 4+ -- drop rates are increasing. Tiers 1 - 3 aren't being touched
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Well, technically it isn't a total myth.
As long as you meet the conditions for finding rares (your level vs the monster level, etc), there are monsters and dungeons that are much easier to kill, and where you can kill them faster, thus the percentage chance of finding a rare increases.
If it takes you 20 seconds to kill monster A, and 10 seconds to kill monster B, and you meet the conditions for finding rares on both, given the same spawn rate, you will get more rares (on average) off monster B than monster A.
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Paraduck
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That's a good point.
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Sif_al_Taak
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"...If it takes you 20 seconds to kill monster A, and 10 seconds to kill monster B, and you meet the conditions for finding rares on both, given the same spawn rate, you will get more rares (on average) off monster B than monster A..."
In general thats wrong. If you are able to clear all monsters of type A before respawn the chance of finding rares is the same as killing monsters of type B. You will only wait longer for monsters of type B after clearing *grin*
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Chazcon
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Do you get 1 'guaranteed' rare per character, or per account, every 2 months?
Think they will increment up the rare drop rate during each 2-month period, making it 100% on the last day of the second month? At what point during this 2-month period will they begin to increase the drop rate? Gradually over the month? Halfway through? Only on the last day?
What determines this 2-month period? Does it begin for all characters on 2/15/06? Is it different for each character, i.e. does it start the first time you get a rare? Can we get multiple rares at the existing drop rate, and one rare on the new 'guaranteed' drop rate? Or does the new drop rate system only kick in if you haven't received a rare in the 2-month period?
They will have to track each character's rares - perhaps they already do. Once the answers to these questions regarding the mechanics of the new rare system are determined, it will be simple to maximize pharming of rares with all of your toons. Soon every tinker will have a bag of each type of tinker rares. Leadership rares will be handed around like a bowl of nuts at a party.
One request Turbine - lose the 'Rare' moniker and re-name these 'Enhancement Gems' or somesuch.
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Arch_Magi
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I got Rare #67 (Tier 2) last night ... what a completely worthless PoS rare.
One use, restores 500 health.
I guess I'll piss off my neighbors and hook it on a villa.
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vellus
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Chaz, to maximize farming of rares, you have to hunt a lot.
Or do you see in your crystal ball, people buying hundreds of ToD accounts, to make 6 level 1 characters and killing a single rabbit every two months to get their rare?
So to maximize rares, you need one level 200 character and 5 level 1's. Hunt 24/7 with the big guy, and kill as many level 100 creatures as possible, to maximize that toon geting rares. And log in each level 1 character, kill a rabbit, get a rare, and repeat every two months....
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Drakier
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I don't think rabbits are "rare eligible" creatures.
the key thing to think about here is that this only increases the chances over time for rares.. it doesn't change the creatures that can drop rares.
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vellus
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They are if you are level 1 Drak. Rabbits are level 2 and would therefore be higher level than you. And the XP they give means you could use the same character for quite a few two month waiting periods.
So if you so desired, you could log in that level 1 toon every week or two, kill a rabbit. If lucky you would get your rare before the two months are up. Transfer the rare, delete and re create in an hour and repeat...
If you keep the character, move up to a little shreth or drudge. Skulkers are level 4 (with full level 7 buffs, quite easy). Same idea with the level 4 carrion or gnawer shreths.
the key thing to think about here is ... the creature only has to be higher level than your little lowbie to drop a rare.
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Drakier
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I guess I know nothing of the rare system
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Lil-Blub
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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So you think it's possible they could make a macro? 
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vellus
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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possible. but someone would have to be quite bored and/or lazy when all you have to do is log in, kill one little creature and change characters...all to get a rare, and likely a crappy little 15 minute crystal one at that.
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vitaefree
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I hunt 1 toon only and get a rare once every 3-4 days
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Neet_knight
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Rares need to be renamed 'commons'.
I have a pack full of useless ones (baning, monster attune, etc), and have prolly used another couple packs of good ones.
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Lil-Blub
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I think we should be able to turn the stupid ones in for good ones! 
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kgober
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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i disagree that you should be able to turn in a 'bad' one for a 'good' one. it's part of the rareness of rares that the rares you want are *really* rare, compared to the rares you don't want, which seem to be very common. such a situation leads to a thriving in-game trade economy, which is a good thing for an MMO.
though i do agree that we need some useful way to get rid of 'bad' rares. maybe turn them in somewhere for an xp reward?
-ken
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vellus
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Mana stone and an instantly recharge focussing stone or mage armor (or any other of those high mana items)
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Hazridi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I'm reasonably sure that this is another one of your crack-addled ideas and is not macroable. Not that you could write the macro for it, anyway 
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Hazridi of WE, VT, HG, SC Decal Core Dev - http://www.decaldev.com - Beta at http://www.decaldev.com/beta
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Lil-Blub
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Haz. I value your opinion and expertise. Thank you.
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Mage_Of_Freedom
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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major mana stones i use on the rares that are worthless no idea why but i like 30k of mana on some stones more usefull that a access rare
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Sneaky-Snake
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Subject:
You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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well within in 30 minutes of logging in on 2 of my chars, i got rares(sprint and staff yippieeeee) so i decided to try for a third, logged in with a different toon and hunted for 2.5-3 hours and got.............................................. no rares
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Sneaky Snake
"You know, I've usually thought Turbine should listen to its players more, but after reading this thread, I'm glad they don't  " -Deconus
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Lil-Blub
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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So logging in got you rares?
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vellus
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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not unless it takes him 30 minutes to log in....
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Sneaky-Snake
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Subject:
You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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lol no logging in didnt get me rares, i was hunting.
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Sneaky Snake
"You know, I've usually thought Turbine should listen to its players more, but after reading this thread, I'm glad they don't " -Deconus
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cptcruch
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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this will be a classic debate forever like which came first the chicken or the egg............did i log on or did i hunt for a rare?
lol this is a classic indeed!
if ppl think by loggin on you get a rare so be it........same for if ya hunt to get a rare so be it!!!
The problem is the numbers dont explain still how 1 toon can hunt for 1 buff cycle get 2 rares and i log on for 12 hrs and get 0 rares! (This is since the patch cameout)....even if it was an alchy rare and a armor tink rare!
it just amazes the hell outta me!
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Maddy_ACEDL
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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<< lol this is a classic indeed! >>
Maybe if I hit myself in the head a dozen tiems with a hammer I might think that.
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Danner_SC
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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I have logged in 6 characters that I took hunting. 5 got rares in the first spawn group they killed. All Eaters. The 6th went to EO and it took about 15 minutes.
I haven't tried with a sub level 90 character yet since most of them are to loaded down with crap to hunt.
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Arch_Magi
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You've heard us call it the 'login rare system' = Login/Off Macros!
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Yup, even my buff bot is getting rares when I take them to the Eaters dungeons for Jaws.
Just got 4 more ... basically, every toon of mine capable of killing a level 90+ monster has gotten one ... which is just about every toon I have.
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