Author Topic: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
archived from daoc/general

Since their is official threads for so many classes right now, and their is none for theurgists... then this is the one. Its a long read, but I think it will be worth it.

in light of the 1.62, and the massive amounts of class improvements, updates, additions, and a few nerfs, I was (and im not alone in this notion) wondering why almost every single class in the game got something new, except Theurgists. Not only are they the most endangered species of albs, but that cripples albion since we are the only source of PBT. Furthermore, theurgists Earth line is pretty much one of the most unsatisfying lines in the game across any realm. The ice line is completely useless (yes I will go as far to say that it is by a long shot the most useless line in the game, even worse then old spell lines that got buffed up). The theurgist TL has documented plenty of logs, some more extensive then the logs hunters created that helped them get fixed up. And (correct me if I am wrong please) theurgists are the ONLY class in the game that has not gotten a new class unique ability, outside of RA's and caster absorve buffs. NEW CONTENT IS WHAT KEEPS PEOPLE PLAYING, and this is why Theurgists are a dieing class. Even on populated servers, finding an earth theurgist is like hitting gold. If you look at www.camelot-seer.com you will see the population/realm point ratio is one of the lowest in existance. Also if you look you will see theurgists have a very high decline in population compared to other classes. There is plenty of evidence out there, you hardly even have to look.

Some might say "well if all your going to do is complain and not make suggestions, then get off the dev boards", so I will make suggestions, and point out the different weak points of the class. Keep in mind that I am not asking for nerfs of other classes, and I am not going to mention any other classes period.

Earth: Problems
Pets: Mythic gave our pets an immunity to CC, thats nice and all, but since they still only last 29 seconds, if you cast them at anywhere over half range, they are almost dead before they reach the target. And with sprint, they can be easily out ran. since they cost a fixed 12% mana each, to take someone out you need to waste about a full mana bar (at around 80-100ish dmg per swing). after you are out of mana, the target only needs to run away for a few seconds, and your mana was wasted. Some people might say the air pet stun is too cheap. First, most people who say this base it on either 1v1 circumstances, or the pvp servers. Not only is the end game of the normal servers not anything close to 1v1, but Mythic clearly stated when they came out with the pvp servers that they would not make any nerfs or buffs to classes according to their preformance on the pvp servers. Earth pets are like a weak version of Dot's.
PBT: its nice, but lets face it, no one plays earth theurgists to 45 earth, hence, there is almost no 6spbt in albion. Besides that, the expensive cost of pets combined with pbt which drains tons of mana basicly makes a theurgist a "sit back and watch" class. you can cast some pets, put on pbt, and wait. Your pets, on a regular basis will be useless, and you get the honor of watching the enemies single you out and kill you, then you get to become neighbors with the worms in the ground. (those worms are nice, spent so much time with them I have made good friends with them). Putting pbt in a useless line on a paperarmor class that burns mana very fast is a bad Idea. Something needs to be done with mana consumption for theurgists. The only reason I see that this has not been fixed is because many people think Mythic does not want albion to have a PBT class, so they wont fix the earth line.

Earth: Fixes
1)add some sort of damage. the Ice nukes suck, making your only damage your pets, which we have already said are very useless. Maybe something SIEGE orientated? I dont know, but it is in the class description (and yes I know many classes are different then their description) but I hardly thing siege bolt is enough to consider us siege mages.
2)Pet and/or PBT mana reduction, or some sort of self mana regen buff. (maybe better then the sorcs, but wont stack with sorcs so not to bee too good? its an idea)


ICE: Problems
Well, not much I have to go over with ice. At least earth is used in combo with wind, but ice really is dead. the worst pets by far, easily resisted nukes and they do not have the run speed of the other 2 pets. Besides that they have the same problems as the earth pets. The ice nuke, which adds a meisly snare, is still useless because it has been proven with logs that high spec in ice does not have high payoff in damage like in other spell lines. So it retains the same crappiness as the normal ice nukes. the only decent thing in the ice line is the AOE root, but root is not enough to spec ice, at least not for me and most other people.

ICE: Fixes
1)Maybe increase the damage on the ice nukes? or give them a debuff? They need to be at least decent like other spell line nukes. Its not like ice adds so many other benefits that good dmg will be too cheap..
2)Fix those ice pets. I dont care how you do it, but do it. Maybe get them less resisted, up damage, have their damage based on your ice spec, give them run speed, faster casting... anyone of those.

WIND: ina nuttshell
Wind is the most popular line for theurgists. Usually it comes with a minor spec in earth, for the 10spbt. Not a totally bad line, better then lines on some other classes, but unlike other classes, Theurgists have only one line that is usefull at all, and wind is still not that great. The mez range is 1250, when every other mez range is 1500. Why its like this, I dont know. No one answeres why.. why is a dumb question to answere for Mythic. The main fix for the wind line is to just increase the mez range to 1500. Easy, painless, not too cheap, no /nerfs.


This is by no means a complete list... if you want one, look at the many well written Theurgist TL reports. When over 90% of the player base of Theurgists are wind, it says one of either 2 things.

1) The other 2 lines suck too much to use
or
2) Wind is real cheap.

I dont think it is #2.. there are far more cheap lines in the game, and in Albion to play. And all the evidence points to #1.

Another thing to mention, since the archer changes made grp pbt more useless then before (not that archers did not need changes, not saying /nerf), this makes the earth line even more useless. I am aware that other classes also got hit with this, but other classes have more then 1 usefull spell line, and other classes also have a more even split of population between their spell lines. Theurgists are wondering, is their a grudge vs them? Did someone on Mythic get unlucky enough to get killed by one? I don't know, but I can't put any other reason into it.

You agree with me /bump
You disagree with me then show some evidence against theurgist improvements.
You want to troll for no reason, please dont. Thanks for reading this, hopefully 1.63 will bring some changes, or at least some changes sometime in the near future.

 

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{old}Suess_TheLowbie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
<< Furthermore, theurgists Earth line is pretty much one of the most unsatisfying lines in the game across any realm >>

I can see how this line wouldln't be the most exciting to play.

<< NEW CONTENT IS WHAT KEEPS PEOPLE PLAYING >>

Yes, but new class content is lame, imo. This is especially true since leveling take so long. I say, create a class, balance, then leave it alone.

<< if you cast them at anywhere over half range, they are almost dead before they reach the target. And with sprint, they can be easily out ran>>

Ok this is where you are going to have to do some explaining. Everyone complains about nearsight. How it makes them useless because they don't have range. And to take someone out of a battle for one minute is taking them out of most of the battle.
Ok that's fine, but Theurgs always cast those damn pets on my caster and I end up running from those for about 15+ seconds. Unlike nearsight, I can't do anything for those 15+ seconds. Usually, some tank sees me running in circles and just whacks me anyways. I can't do anything about it, since I can't stop to cast. At least with nearsight, I could still root the tank when he gets close enough.

<< Theurgists have only one line that is usefull at all, and wind is still not that great. The mez range is 1250, when every other mez range is 1500. Why its like this, I dont know >>

Maybe because albs so much range already? 2000+ range mezz (including radius) + quick cast > all most of the time. Scounts have the range advantage, and theugs have the range on pets.

Having said all this, I play to plan a Theurg. Always interested me and when the /level command is available, I will be creating one.

 

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Kaolla_Nut 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have to agree with the original poster, earth thuergs need fixing. When I have a Thuerg in my group I wonder if I did something right that day to deserve it... if I have a pure Earth Thuerg I look out the window to see if there are any pigs flying.

/bump

 

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Huntsekker-Pellinor 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
hey so does just about all of mid, get in line

 

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Fingoniel 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
earth theurgists might actually be improved by 1.62h - they'll no longer be running pbt so they'll have mana to use their base ice nukes (half-specced from minidings)

so be afraid! you might hear some earth-theurgist death messages, shortly before they /respec all to air (both of them)

 

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soccervh 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I want gtae dots highest level dot = 57.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for much needed theurgist love

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Abaddon is at the E3, he has may be charmed Sanya tongue .

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
true, sorcs do have a very long ranged mez, but this is a new change. Theurgists have been asking for a 1500 mez for a very very very very long time, and instead of fixing ours they boosted sorcs. And their are other lines in the game with qc and 1500range nukes, albs not the only ones, but like I said I dont want to get into class naming, thats why I didnt mention the sorcs before this (and yes sorcs did need loving, not say /nerf sorcs)

oh yeah, bump it up

 

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Grizlon 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Abaddon getting some soox.... love

 

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{old}VeyHolyT 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
lol earth theurgies...good times. Its really easy to play one in a group, just punch in the earth chant and sit. Didn't the mythic instruction booklet that came with daoc say earth theurgies were good for sieges? bahahahahhahah

 

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Sarumz 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Good post Demonic
I agree. I'm a hybrid ice/earth theurg so yeah I'm biased a bit but esp with this latest patch Earth Theurgs are incredibly lame. I ONLY went to 35 earth so I could find grps that wanted a theurgist so after a year I could finally ding 50. That line is the biggest joke. I play around with other toons in all 3 realms and at lvl 7 every single one has more versitility than my earth line. And I thought we were suppossed to be utility. heh I feel bad for full earth and ice theurgys. I try not to complain but the only thing I hope Mythic will do is look at the last 3-4 earth theurgys who respec over to wind. In fact I'm prolly going to dump mine and go that way as well...oh well....thanks again Mythic for syphoning 14 months of my life and $245 for my gimped toon that was suppossed to be a "powerful utility caster and seige master extraordinaire" rofl...

 

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_CuD_ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Does the new pet runspeed fix work on Theurg pets too?

If so this could be a huge boost for the class.

Has anyone tested it out?

 

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Xasdf 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I saw some freak Theurg asking for a powertap line for Earth ROFL. I think the whole temp pet stuff is flawed.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Legendadry 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
stun, give em hibbies stun
its a really easy cut and paste, not even too complicated for Mythic

 

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Seles2 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Just give thergs "i win" spells like chanters.

 

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SkraelingShortbus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
newsflash sorc aoe mez is not 2k its bolt range 1875.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Well, with the proposed free respec, Earth/Ice theurgists will be getting some love: they can all go Air. No need for PBT anymore, now they can just only partially suck as the more-effective crappy caster of Albion. ^_^

 

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{old}Gentle2 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have earth theurgist with 45 earth happy


I would kinda love receive some siege-helping spells on that earth line .. be it gtaoe, or those soft of "wave" spell that someone posted as suggestion time ago, or spells to affect doors and such, whatever happy

 

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soccervh 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
any three of these ideas would be fine with me.

gtae dots
cold debuff 15%/30%/50%
ae stun

all would be great. just one would be fine.

 

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Heladus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Had it exactly right .... free single line respec now means I will be going the standard 45 Air route. Just getting too tired of shelving my 50 and hoping for something down the line.

 

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Axauv 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
oh do theurgists cast spells? didn't know they had any

/bump

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump anyone?

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
cold debuff 15%/30%/50% love love love

 

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Nibien 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"I saw some freak Theurg asking for a powertap line for Earth ROFL. I think the whole temp pet stuff is flawed."

Thats exactly what I want

30spec - 35 Delve Damage
40spec - 70Delve Damage
50Spec - 100Delve damage.

Even if this was deemed "overpowered" It could be made instant on a 20 or 30 second timer. Jesus, I just want to beable to cast a spell every one in awhile.

This would help solve the power problem, also give a bit of extra damage output, something sorely needed.

 

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KnumbKnuts 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
TWF would be a nice RA....

Another prob with earth theurg pets is that the target gets lit up with the earth buff graphic when the pet is launched, which gives the target a nice early warning.

 

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{old}Suess_TheLowbie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
<< newsflash sorc aoe mez is not 2k its bolt range 1875. >>

Wait this just in off the presses. There is something called a radius.

 

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Sarumz 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Unfortunatly now with this respec I think the last remaining earth theurgs will disappear to air...I'm pondering it but I'm screwed at 41 ice and 35 earth. Be interesting to see the repercussions of this patch. I think Mythic is trying to do away with the entire earth theurg line myself. If noone is speced in it then why do they need to fix it seems pretty logical to me...Thanks Mythic yet again.

Sarumz 50 Theurgist <DoA> Lancelot

 

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{old}Kaswyn 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump because there just AINT ENOUGH ACTIVE THEURGISTS TO MAKE THE NOISE.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
buuuump

 

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ManowareZ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Fix chain stunning pets

 

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zertam 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I see some theurgs around, sometimes, so they must be fine.

Same with armsmen, mercenaries, scouts, paladins, cabalists, minstrels, and clerics.. Well, most of the clerics I see are hanging out at the PK--buffbotting--but that's ok, right?

 

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veleuk 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Fix chain stunning pets "

If you are chain stunned by theurgist pets, it's becuase you deserve it.......it takes quite a nice amount of power and time for you to be standing in the casters range for them to "chain stun" you.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
zertam-
"I see some theurgs around, sometimes, so they must be fine.

Same with armsmen, mercenaries, scouts, paladins, cabalists, minstrels, and clerics.. Well, most of the clerics I see are hanging out at the PK--buffbotting--but that's ok, right? "

not sure if your being sarcastic or what, but first of all you may see some theurgists, sometimes, but you wont see earth theurgists or ice theurgists. That is what this is about. There is 30-1 of each of those classes for each earth/ice theurg. Thats if your lucky enough to find one on.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
And you thought they were rare before...wait until after 1.62. With PBT = crap and the free line respec, do you think the remaining Earth theurgists are going to hang around another year or so, praying for a fix? HELL NO. They're going to go Wind, or quit in frustration. The last remaining Earth theurgists after 1.62 will be guild bots, taken out only in certain PvE encouters.

Oh, and to the Mythic morons who can't read...

Earth Theurgist + Respec != Class Fix (equasion borrowed from Caliwyrm)

 

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Heladus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/e counts the days until he can finally become a ghetto bubble blowin' wind wizard ... go go single line respec happy

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
if(Mythic.fixTheurgists())
for(int i = Mythic.Population(Theurgists); i < 14,000); i++)

else
Mythic.Population(Theurgists) = 0;

 

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eridani1 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
ive got a 50 theurg. 47 earth/26 ice. its really sad he is just a bot now:( i really like the gtae dot idea. just that spell alone would be awesome for sieges. insta mez/stun and a cold debuff is a terrible idea though. the last thing this game needs is a new mana chanter or more insta cc.

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump happy

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumps r us

 

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The_Kierdaghs 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I kinda like the idea of giving them a cold debuff in earth spec. Would make the baseline ice nukes more viable as well as fulfill a support roll that the class is already meant for.

Another thing that all PBT classes should get is a reduction of PBT power usage. 50% would seem fair to me, since most PBT classes need serenity III just so they can be playable.

 

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Svartalfimposter 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"in light of the 1.62, and the massive amounts of class improvements, updates, additions, and a few nerfs, I was (and im not alone in this notion) wondering why almost every single class in the game got something new, except Theurgists. "

"Something new", haha. Do you want a smack with the nerfbat, too? Keep your head down.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Do you want a smack with the nerfbat, too? Keep your head down."

Um...you couldn't have had your head down further than the Theurgist class pre-1.62, and look what happened. We got our head lopped off, so that others could feel better. Simply staying down and shutting up isn't good enough for Mythic, they now have taken our class and removed its final working component. Kudos.

 

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Hyperion191 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
001111111000110001100011111001111100011111110
001100011100110001100011000110001100011000110
001100111000110001100011000110001100011111110
001100011100110001100011000110001100011000000
001111111000111111100011000110001100011000000
000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

earth theurg fix binary code ? no, watch again or move back a little from the screen... wink

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Did you hack into the Mythic database for that one? LOL!

 

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{old}Znail-2 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Quote:
--------------------------------------------
Another thing that all PBT classes should get is a reduction of PBT power usage. 50% would seem fair to me, since most PBT classes need serenity III just so they can be playable.
--------------------------------------------
Best idea in this thread. All 3 PBT classes share the same power problem, only one who suffers less is the Warden, but they would also benifit from being able to use some spells now and then.

 

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Jilael 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
#1 /bump

#2 Earth line sucks, I can deal with the power drain of my theurg specced to 45 earth rest wind, BUT I and most theurgists need/want something more for that investment, especially with the nerfbat hitting our groupmates pbtage. My suggestions for this line would include the GT in the earth line.

#3 The cold line is simple crap, unusable, now the snare will help with the new snare fix... but still has issues, 2 viable spells not that great, maybe livable for some, not sure, but no rp usable things here.

#4 The wind is line is okay, and dd's decent.

#5 Pet usage is not viable at all, period. maybe to interrupt a caster but the pow cost is too high, especially for pbt theurgists. simple fix here, the FINAL pet spell only make it based off of standard power, not percentage of total, I DO understand why you have it as a percentage but less needed at higher lvls and no longer a big problem. PLEASE fix this. kk thx

#6 Post a public apology and admit theurgists are [mod] for keep sieges OR give us sieging abilities like the GT in the earth line, or cold line if you must but DEF give us one.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, I will now go back to my now uber as hell merc *post patch* who honestly only needed dirty tricks fixed.


 

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Tritone_33 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/Agree to original post

 

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-Euphoria- 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
BUMP!
also notice that theurgist have the least amount of spells in thier base and spec paths then any other caster in the game.
earth base=3(shield,damage buff, Buffer)
earth spec=3 (pet, debuff,bt/pbt)
ice base=2!! (nuke, root)
ice spec=3 (nuke/snare, pet,ae root)
wind base=2!!(haste,speed buff)
wind spec=3 (pet,nuke,ae mez)

the ae mezz is pretty much useless with 1250 range I find it much more useful after purging and using it at close range to maybe mezz 3 tanks near me for 10 secs..the range and teh duration need an increase. The earth and ice lines are just horrible and wind being the best and most viable line of the class is STILL lacking.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Caliwyrm 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Power consumption should be a priority fix.. Running 6 sec PBT allows for you to do...not much..

I'd also like to see Seige Bolt made Earth spec at different levels, the higher the spec, the shorter the recast timer.

Replace the Seige Bolt RA with Barrage of Elements-RA that allows for the creation of a ram with no parts in inventory.

Seige masters, remember?

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Mythic's having a hard enough time remembering us PERIOD, let alone as siege masters.

 

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NightPath 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I've borrowed a friend's Theurg, and wow..they suck hard.

Their mana drains like the Animist's mana when casting a pet. 6 pets later no mana = no defence = no PBT =pissed folks.

Theurgs and Animists need to have one of 2 things:

1- Automatic Pet Death Power Recycle -= when pet dies, a % of the mana comes back to the caster

OR

2- Put the pets on a Concentration System. The pets die, conc goes back up, wham, back in business.


There are 2 simple, easy steps to fixing pet/mana consumption.

And yes, Theurgs really do have some problems and do need some sprucing up. AoE GTAE DoT be cool, or a new baseline nuke in Earth.

Fixeth the Theurgs!

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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*staples thread to top of page* Stay put, damnit!

 

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LanoItar 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Very good arguments, lots of valid reasoning.


My Earth Theur (first char) is up to level 23 now, but he's a damned fine spellcrafter!

Meanwhile, I have 2 level 50's that actually have playable qualities and are fun.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Frankly there is no reason to even play earth or ice line theurgs. I won't even go into the reasons because everyone knows what they are, this is why albion lacks 6 sec pbt and will soon lack pbt all together. Wind spec is the only line to go with and you can actually contribute to a group. Mythic is basically saying now that casters shouldn't be all that powerful, mythic needs to wake up and realize that since we give up so much to be a caster we should be able to kill something without dying right off the bat. Theurgs NEED major love not just some stupid spell added they need a major make over.

 

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Crandell 
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bump

 

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NightPath 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I think that Theurgs abilities all look good on paper.

Mind those key words: Look good and Paper


Bumpity bump

 

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Balthar_IV 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Please give the Earth line an additional type of offensive spell (GTAoE or PbAoE or some type of power tap spell) to make earth more attractive to players.

A Theurgist without PBT is like a poor man's Wizard. Make the earth line more attractive so that Albion can get some PBT's.

 

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{old}Neslyn 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"1- Automatic Pet Death Power Recycle -= when pet dies, a % of the mana comes back to the caster

OR

2- Put the pets on a Concentration System. The pets die, conc goes back up, wham, back in business."

Wow, I actually really like those ideas. Especially the concentration-based one, but the power-recycling one is probably more balanced.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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"I think that Theurgs abilities all look good on paper."

No...Wardens and Runemasters look good on paper. (and most would argue that they look good in game too) Earth Theurgist spec HAS ALWAYS looked like crap on a stick, and plays like it too. Anyone who argues otherwise has a) never played the game, or b) blind as a bat.

Frankly, this nerf surprized me, as the uber-crap treatment of Theurgists left me expecting a fix...not another nerf.

 

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{old}Fedifensor 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"A Theurgist without PBT is like a poor man's Wizard."

Post-patch, a theurgist with PBT is like a poor man's wizard...but with less mana.

And a Theurgist with 6-second PBT is like a wizard's inept apprentice wearing a blindfold and perpetually out of mana.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump, bump, bum bum bump it up!

 

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AquaBlaze 
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"And a Theurgist with 6-second PBT is like a wizard's inept apprentice wearing a blindfold and perpetually out of mana."

LOL! And...

B
U
M
P

Earth Theurg: "What is this thing you call mana?"

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Earth Theurgist spec HAS ALWAYS looked like crap on a stick, and plays like it too. Anyone who argues otherwise has a) never played the game, or b) blind as a bat."

Dead accurate and sadly true.

"Frankly, this nerf surprized me, as the uber-crap treatment of Theurgists left me expecting a fix...not another nerf."

Me, too, for as bad as theurgists have it I was expecting theurgs to finally get the love that they so badly need (their mez given the same range as everyone else's mez, pet costs lowered, earth spec being finally fixed so it isn't the worst spec line in the game) and instead Mythic nerfs PBT.

What are they thinking? Hey, Mythic! Pay attention! Theurgists need help BAD.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumps

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for theurg love

 

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{old}Fedifensor 
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"Me, too, for as bad as theurgists have it I was expecting theurgs to finally get the love that they so badly need"

Well, the theurgist "love" was in the Albion patch. Honestly, it helped Air theurgists more than it helped Earth or Ice...which is very, very odd.

 

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{old}Bubble_Bot 
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Frankly, this nerf surprized me, as the uber-crap treatment of Theurgists left me expecting a fix...not another nerf.

aye, same for my warden thats now retired.


Theurgists, please stop complaining, your class is far superior to my warden. Your nukes outdamage my melee, you have stun (on air pets) ae root (even low ice spec) and ae mez (granted it dosent count for much) but that is THREE FORMS OF CROWD CONTROL.

Not to mention, uncc'able pets, even one cast on an enemy healer can seriously disrupt a battle in your teams favor. Trust me, ive been on the opposing end of theurgists that actually knew what they were doing and they made a very big difference.

Vs assisting opponents, PBT is worthless, for all realms, what is so wrong with being a nuker with a 10 dps damage add, base haste, base run speed, pretty decent nukes, pets that are unccable and cast from bolt range, 10s pbt?

Come on theurgists...there are many more classes that are in need of help than yours. Learn to use what you have.

 

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Qoaa 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Well, the theurgist "love" was in the Albion patch."

You mean that pathetic attempt to fix the Theurgist pets? Great...now our overly-expensive pets will mosey along a little bit farther, before putting it it's one or two swipes, then croaking. Any Theurg can tell you that casting pets at a 2000 range 1) takes forever, as the pet needs to walk to the target (which subtracts from its 20-30 sec life), and 2) does either little or no damage to the target.

And the Siege Bolt "fix"? Yay. Still useless. We now can do the equivolent of 1-2 ram swings every 5 minutes. I can sooo feel the uberness filtering through me...

The Theurgist "love" wasn't "love", nor a "fix". Hell, it wasn't even a band-aid. THAT was a Mythic asswipe, plain & simple. Mythic came along, took the failing Theurgists, and wiped their ass with them. THAT is what we got.

"Theurgists, please stop complaining, your class is far superior to my warden."

Umm...the jury has long since been out in the Earth Theurgist vs. Warden cases. Warden whomps major Theurgist ass. Any Theurgist that specs high enough in Earth for real PBT doesn't GET all the fun luxuries that you meantioned. However, a Warden gets a lotta group usefulness WHILE speccing their line, plus are on the hybrid scale, PLUS wear armor, PLUS, PLUS, PLUS...GAH!

Here's the simple explanation for you, based upon many, many reviews of other PBTers. This scale has been widely accepted, and trying to argue otherwise at this point is useless.

Supp. Runie = Enhance Warden > Earth Theurgist

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bubble Bot, PLAY A THEURGIST.

They are one of the most useless classes in the game, if not the most useless.

Wardens are VERY GOOD support classes, I should know, since my fiance plays one. A Warden's nuture line alone makes it superior to a Theurgist in almost every respect, then we throw in Scale Armor, Heals, style fatigue reduction, specable weapons, use of a shield...

All 3 Theurgist spell lines need at least one more spell to be viable.

MYTHIC: DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS. Otherwise, just delete the class and spread its spells elsewhere in Albion.

 

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joe1877 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgist are the most overpowered class in the game, so stfu. Here is a typical encounter with one. Ae mezz, 4 air pets chain stun me to the point I can't move, DD,DD,DD and I'm dead. The air line is so overpowered that your enemy can't even fight back while getting nuked for 400 dmg every 1.5 seconds. If you can't beat any non-pet class in the game, then you just suck, plain and simple. Despite this, we have posters saying even the air line needs help to be viable.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
OMG...did you _WANT_ people to know you got whomped by a Theurgist? LOL! Damn you must be gimped/retarded. Did you ever try MOVING? Have you ever tried GROUPING UP? (new concept for you, I'm sure) There are 1001 counters to the mighty 1 sec stun on the wind pet. If you really want to make things fair, make air pets proc snare with 10x (or more) duration and THEN we can talk about giving your dumb ass immunity.

Folks, here's a simple heads-up. You CANNOT use the words "Theurgist" and "overpowered" in the same sentence without sounding like a lobotomized monkey.

 

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Latric 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Wonder how many of these threads it will take before mythic listens to one?

 

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Hoirip 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bump for Lots of good ideas in this thread. Albion has gone far too long without a spec that is desirable for high-spec PBT.

Oh yeah, and fix the chain stunning air pets, but give the stun longer duration to compensate for activating the player's immunity timer. No spell can incapacitate a player from extreme range like those pets-purge can fight off regular CC, but if one of those pets comes bearing down on you all you can do is run and hope the damnable thing dies (since you can't mez or root them).

 

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{old}Neslyn 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Your nukes outdamage my melee"

Your heals are better than my...oh wait I don't get heals.

"you have stun (on air pets) ae root (even low ice spec) and ae mez (granted it dosent count for much) but that is THREE FORMS OF CROWD CONTROL."

Earth theurgists don't get those.

"Learn to use what you have."

I guess we have to since we've never gotten anything new for our class.

"Theurgist are the most overpowered class in the game, so stfu."

This is, of course, why theurgists dominate RVR standings. Oh wait, they don't

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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"Theurgist are the most overpowered class in the game, so stfu."

Your are either utterly ignorant, a bald-faced liar, stoned out of your tree, or have never faced a mana chanter.

"Here is a typical encounter with one. Ae mezz, 4 air pets chain stun me to the point I can't move, DD,DD,DD and I'm dead."

Dude, three things: (1) chain stun was removed LONG ago; (2) that's an AIR theurg buring all his mana killing you; Earth theurgs, as we have been telling you, have zip; (3) something like that will happen to ANY tank going one on one in the open field vs. any reasonable caster. With a chanter it goes stun, permanent pet, DD, DD, DD, dead. (Or just stun, debuff, DD, DD dead).

"The air line is so overpowered that your enemy can't even fight back while getting nuked for 400 dmg every 1.5 seconds."

ROFL. What game are YOU playing? Air theurgs are a second rank mage; chanters and runies own air theurgs all night long.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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"Theurgist are the most overpowered class in the game, so stfu."

O master of ignorance, if you look up the RP stats you will see that theurgists as a class are in the bottom half of all 45+ characters in the game in RP, both in total RP and in average RP. Theurgists are not overpowered, they are BELOW AVERAGE.

It's a shame that people like you post nonsense like that. You remind me of the all the Mids posting, "But, wait...Left Axe really isn't THAT overpowered. Really. Trust me. Please?"

 

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Calindra 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I would like to see a baseline DD in the earth line. This would definitely help earth theurgists. It would also help the weak earth spec of wizards.

 

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{old}Neslyn 
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"I would like to see a baseline DD in the earth line. This would definitely help earth theurgists."

Not really. Earth theurgists can get a useable baseline DD out of ice. And with the power concerns of PBT, just slapping a new DD onto the class isn't going to help things a lot. Of course, that's an issue for all PBT classes.

 

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{old}Flunkie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Mythic designed the casting classes with 1 viable spec line per class. Thurgists have Air. Good luck getting help for earth.

 

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joe1877 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
aquablaze you are a dumbass. You can't run when you are chain stunned. You can't move. Thats the part about being overpowered. You just stand there and get chain stun and beat down, while the caster nukes you to death. If you can't beat someone who can't even fight back, then you are the worst player this game has ever seen. If the air pets didn't have 2000 casting and, and didn't take less than 4 seconds to reach you, it would be a different story. Seriously, if you are an air theurgist and you can't kill 90% of the classes in this game then you just suck.

And yes mana chanters are bull**** too.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
No, Joe, YOU are the moron. Theurgist pet chain stunning was removed in the 1.52 theurgist nerf patch. Go read the patch notes. ("Previously, the high chance of the stun proc firing in RvR combined with a lack of a recast timer made the pet able to chain stun RvR targets.")

Have you even been PLAYING since 1.52?

 

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joe1877 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
dumbass. it was not removed. Have you ever played against one? The chain stun might have been removed against mobs. but it still remains against other players.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Umm...Joe? You already verified that you are a grade-A retard in your above post...not like you've stopped talking out of your ass now though. You CAN move, (albeit slightly stuttered at worst) you CAN fight back, you CAN just twiddle your thumbs and wait for the little gimps to die. So...my stoner Hibbie retard...STFU, and open the box before you try to make comments about the game, K?

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Chain stunning was removed from RvR in 1.52. You can stop lying anytime now, Joe.

Jake, who does play a theurgist now and then

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
*cements thread to the top of the board*

E
L

B
U
M
P
O
!

 

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joe1877 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
yay I can move one step every 5 seconds or so. Forget fighting back. Cry more losers. If an air theurgist can't kill just about every class, they suck. You all suck. Get some skill or tactics or something. Again, if you can't kill a target who can't even fight back, you just suck. No love for you.

 

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{old}Banadan 
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Bumpz0r........

 

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GoldManiac 
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Just ignore the anonymous moron with 19 posts. We could fight him for 100 pages and he still wouldn't see the truth.

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Joe, get a life. Theurgists are among the most underpowered classes in the game, and the earth line is BY FAR THE MOST USELESS CLASS LINE IN THE GAME.

 

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Threth 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Sorry guys... Mythic is too busy making Enchanters better. I think we can all agree Enchanters need the love more than any other class in DAoC.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Joe, will you please stop talking out of yoru asscheeks? Thanks.

Oh, yay...yes...Enchanters needed much more love than the Theurgist crap lines. Thanks Mythic.

 

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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have to say that Joe is the stupidest and most ignorant poster I have ever seen on these boards, and that's saying a lot. Joe, some time you need to play DOAC, in which chain stunning was removed in the 1.52 patch.

Earth theurgists need love bad.

All theurgists need to have their pet casting costs reduced dramatically.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Hey Kids! It's Bump Time!

^ UP ^ UP ^

 

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Big_Twinky 
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BA DA BUMP

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

Theurgist earth spec = worst spec line in the game

 

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{old}Grann_Tristan 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
The only Earth Theurg's I know are PBT bots, nothing else.

That right there should tell you something.

 

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Gergyfo 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
the chain stunning pets could use a nerf

 

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{old}mordred-player 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Some people never stop whining.


Earth thuerg could use some love is about it. Possibly trim the power cost of making pets to be lower %. I dont know but The thuergs I seen rarely have trouble cranking out about a dozen pets when needed even though I know the spell supposedly shouldnt allow you to get much more than what 8 because power cost is % based. Possibly increase the duration of the pets a little bit or possible allow the caster to have a mild amount of control over hte pets so they could just change targets for pets whos target dies as opposed to them just standing there till the timer expires.


Thuergs are a very solid casting class and even have great untily spells for melees, the common ice/air combo is an excellent combo powerful at that.


Any other isues within thuergs are more than likely "casters in general" issues.


*** I have always been in favor of a change that made the thuerg pets spawn AT THE TARGET not at the caster and needing to run to the target *** this might be overpowering with the way thuerg pets currently perform however.


OR maybe just make them like "bomber" pets where the pet is a one time DD that just has a graphic of the pet charging out to its target and when it hits it dissapates and inflicts a set DD amount.

Right now thuerg pets are like crappy dots, in alot of ways, neat concept however just not sure it was implmented quite right to be useful but not overpowered in rvr, where smart people unlike dumb mobs just avoid the pets.

 

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Qoaa 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Pranzer 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"I have to say that Joe is the stupidest and most ignorant poster I have ever seen on these boards, and that's saying a lot. Joe, some time you need to play DOAC, in which chain stunning was removed in the 1.52 patch.

Earth theurgists need love bad.

All theurgists need to have their pet casting costs reduced dramatically."


stfu you are a jeark for what you said espically since chain stunning from pets was never removed.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Please ignore the above said morons while I...


BUMP THE CRAP OUT OF THIS POST! MUAHAHA!

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Page 2? Don't think so...

 

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{old}Daltarr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Melee realm mage runemaster > Theurgist.

Earth line, wow what can we say. This line has sucked since day#1.

Ice line, wow what can we say. This line has sucked since day #1.

Air line, average at best.

 

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Heladus 
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"Thuergs are a very solid casting class and even have great untily spells for melees, the common ice/air combo is an excellent combo powerful at that."

What common ice/air combo ... I do not know a single Theurgist that is specced that way .. is this a dred spec?

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Nice sig Heladus. I did the same thing by rolling an ice wizard. I finally got all the siege abilities I was looking for.

 

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Heladus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
(grins) Thank ya Gold and with the line respec they're giving us I'm going for the common air template ... still won't fix the real problems that Theurgists are having, but hell I'll have more fun in RvR.

 

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Sarumz 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
B
U
M
P

Earth spec line has been and is about to become even worse than all other lines in the game. PERIOD. =)

Sarumz 50 Theurgist <DoA> Lancelot
41 Ice / 35 Earth

 

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{old}Fedifensor 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"I did the same thing by rolling an ice wizard. I finally got all the siege abilities I was looking for."

I made an earth theurgist for siege capability. A year and a half later, I'm still waiting...

 

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penman69 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump.

i played a theurgist for a year then levelled a nightshade to 50 while i waited for theurg fixes, levelled a druid to 42, a bunch of others to 35'ish for BG's got bored, quit, and theurgists STILL haven't had more than a few cosmetic tweaks. Yes the changes to ele's were needed and good - but more is needed.

Theurgists are the ONLY casters in the game to not have had a single new class spell since launch. Not one.

HEY MYTHIC - DO YOU EVEN KNOW THIS CLASS EXISTS??

Personally i take my hat off to those of you who stuck with the class...you're stubborn bastards.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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"Earth spec line has been and is about to become even worse than all other lines in the game."

Whoot! #1 Gimp! We're number 1!!!!!!

Haven't been this excited...well, haven't ever been this excited. :P

 

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The_Kierdaghs 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Do theurgist actually run out of power casting pets in RvR? I'd imagine they are dead before that. PBT needs a drastic power reduction for all three realms, earth theurgists get hit hard by this since the spells they use are power-hogs.

Air pets chain-stunning and decent nukes give that kind of spec'd theurgist the edge in RvR, but that's only one line out of three sad

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Akumakis 
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/bump!

poor theurgists.

 

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{old}Nightmare1111 
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THERE ARE ONLY 3 ACTIVE EARTH THEURGISTS IN PERCIVAL. IS THAT NORMAL?!??!!?!

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Yes thats perfectly normal..... its like that on every server. Actually thats almost above normal. Earth theurgists becoming endangered species and Ice becoming (it always was) extinct is just a part of life right now. It has been the norm for over a year now and still will be untill Mythic stops making classes better that dont deserve it, and starts fixing the hurting ones. But to Mythic, all they have proven to the Theurgist loyalists is that they care more about "dolla dolla bills yall" then their players who have put up with total shit for 2 years and about 300$. Why we still put up with it, who knows... maybe in hope Mythic will help us? I lost that hope a long time ago, I think what kept them playing is rolling new characters, which is such a shame to waste a whole class in albion over rerolls. I did not post this thread expecting Mythic to actually listen, the only thing they seem to listen to is money. Im posting this just to prove a few points. I have been suscribed to Mythic for 7 years, 7 freaking years since they started beta in MageStorm and Darkness Falls. In 7 years they have not rewarded any of the people who payed $10+ a year, supported their products, and kept food on their tables. For 5 years they just didn't listen to people, and when DAoC came out, they opened half an ear to the player base that would make them the most money. Thats why DAoC has always had classes that are great, and classes that just suck and are not enjoyable. Their really are no in betweens if you look at it, and it makes perfect sense. Their are still people playing their old games like SpellBinders: TNC, paying 10 bucks a month and they dont even get to play it because the freakin servers are never up. Mythic has so many thousands of suscribers and are making so much money, and they wont pay cent to keep up a server that supports only less then 100 people. Thats how cheap Mythic is and always have been. For 5 years Mythic did not pay any of their customer support reps, or their game GM's. It was all volunteer from already suscribing members, so actually they profited from that too. I wonder what the fuck they spend their money on, it definantly is not towards their customers. At least not the way it should be.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
^^ Ouch, paragraphs are your friend tongue

/bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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"THERE ARE ONLY 3 ACTIVE EARTH THEURGISTS IN PERCIVAL. IS THAT NORMAL?!??!!?!"

No...there should be half that amount...and none when 1.62 comes out. Hope ya'll weren't too fond of PBT, as that's gonna be dead too. Most Wind theurgists are even dropping that, going Wind/Ice.

Theurgists are dead ya'll. Time to reroll or cancel.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump happy

|
|
|
v

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Mythic will never read this, but here's my "bump" for the class.

 

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jonny290 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
To the top.


Some thoughts (cc'ed to Sanya):

-GTAoE or similar spell in earth line (yes, i know, it'd make us an earth
wizard....)

-Some form of CC (perhaps move spec AoE root to earth, spec AoE mez to ice and add a spec AoE stun to air to match pet effects?) in earth line

-Change pet cost from percentage to fixed value

-RA named something like Protection of the Summoned that would allow any group pulsing spells such as paladin chants, theurgist runspeed/PBT, minstrel speed, etc to have an effect on up to five casted pets, or the last five pets you cast if you have more on the battlefield.

The RA would cost 1/2/4/6/10 points. For each level, it covers one more pet. Level 1 covers your last pet, level 2 covers last two pets, level 3 covers last three pets, etc.

This would aid in the viability of pets, currently touted as the earth theurgist's sole method of spec damage output, on the RvR battlefield. I don't see why this couldn't be a passive RA with a cost of 6 points or so, but it'd also work as a one-level active RA with 2 minute duration / 15 minute recast timer.

-Fix attack speed debuff so that it doesn't increase damage output when somebody is at the haste cap, is debuffed, and is still at the haste cap.

 

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{old}Znail-2 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Quote:
--------------------------------------------
-RA named something like Protection of the Summoned that would allow any group pulsing spells such as paladin chants, theurgist runspeed/PBT, minstrel speed, etc to have an effect on up to five casted pets, or the last five pets you cast if you have more on the battlefield.
--------------------------------------------
Pets already get the benifit of group spells by default, so no need for any RA.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}Daltarr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
The Theurgist, that other caster of Dark Age of Camelot. I give Mythic a B for a good attempt at drawing up a unique type of elemental caster in the Theurg. They also get a freaking F for making all those unique 'elemental' abilities of the Theurg suck royally.

Melee realm mage runemaster > Theurgist. Why? Hell if I know.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Here's to praying you remove your head from your ass at the last minute Mythic...


BUMP

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
keep this on the front page

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
How to improve a Theurgist:

Earth Spec:

Add GTAoE. Hibernia has two PBAoE classes, why shouldn't Albion have 2 GTAoE ones? Albion is the more defensive oriented realm, and GTAoE is a defensive oriented spell.

Ice Spec:

Add Damage and Snare (AoE). This is lacking in Albion and gives the Ice Theurgist something to distinguish it from an Ice Wizard.

Air Spec:

Add either a specline stun (similar to Hib casters baseline), specline single target mezz (similar to Mentalist/Spiritmaster), or Instant AoE Mezz (similar to Healer/Bard). All of these are lacking in Albion in one form or another, compared to at least one of the other realms, if not both.

Implementing these for a Theurgist gives each line one more spell, and each gives something which fits the spell line, as well as something which the realm of Albion as a whole could use.

Mythic, please implement these for the Theurgist or something along similar lines.

 

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{old}SuperSoaker 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgists are fine. if you want new content, go make another class.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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"Theurgists are fine. if you want new content, go make another class."

Yet again, the human personification of the reason for birth control appears. SHUT UP. Do I really NEED to count the oh-so-many ways Theurgists suck AGAIN? No. Scroll up and read, or God forbid you actually play the game.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
1. Theurg pets need to have a fixed cost, not cost a % of the caster's power.

2. Theurg mez range needs to be 1500, the same as every other mez in the game (the shorter range is blatant anti-Albion prejudice)

3. The earthe theurg line needs a DD and a GTAOE. Right now it has NOTHING in it except for PBT, a useless debuff, and a crummy, expensive pet.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
BUMPO...lol, anyone want to guess how many folks /level a Theurgist? $50 says its in the single-digits. ;P

 

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{old}EtherealTsunami 
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<---- bumpos inexpertious

non-wind thuerg ---> maximus gimpicus

 

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{old}nukem888 
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I am not shure what can be done to help you guys.Your pets seem worthless people can out run them easly.

 

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GoldManiac 
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I've got nothing left to say, except I love my ice wizard and his siege capabilites . . . oops, the theurgist was supposed to be the siege master, wasn't he?

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Mythic can first start helping Theurgists by locking their accounts. We're a buncha die-hard freaks, and really need a good swift kick in the @$$ to realize our class is dead.

 

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Pritcon 
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You Almost think they want us to stop playing our Albion toons and try out the other realms. Forced population control.

Please forgive me.

 

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{old}fludane 
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BUMP

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
i know nobody is gonna read this far, even i didnt, but one thing i didnt see alot of people commenting on is the unique RA. ok, ok, so some calsses may have totally broken ones, but ours costs 10 points and does less damage than beating on the door with our staff for 5 minutes would, and has been proven. i currently have a 24 theurg im lving up, going 45 earth just to break the curve, as i love to do, but please, for the love of little bunnies and all that is holy, give earth something. last i counted, we get a crappy speed debuff, a mana-sucking, now nerfed, PBT, and a crappy 29 sec pet that you have to be in about half of bolt range to cast and do anything, and said pet takes 12% of our total mana pool to cast. forgive me if im wrong, but alot of perfectly great, sometimes even "I Win" spells, take a bit less than 12% power. given focus, int, and +pow stuff, id say you could work about any other non-set cost spell down below 5%, and thats pretty conservative. so in short, we have to have serinity 3 just to be an effective bot, and on top of that you give us one of the crappiest damage spells in the game which costs more than double what some of the best spells in the game would cost? oh well...

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Ice Theurgist:

Make the power cost the same as the air nukes, give a higher damage nuke at 50. (It's way less damage than the 45 air nuke, c'mon!) Fix ice pets' resist rates on nukes, it's currently so silly that why even bother casting them, when they are the easiest to outrun?

Earth Theurgist:

Please please give them something! In the same boat as Earth Wizzies here. Why not put the base fire nuke in base earth and be done with it? Oh yeah, fix power costs on a chant that is basically negated with the new archer lovin'.

Didn't we see about 5 threads 15+ pages long, just like this, over the past month, with no response? Sad...

 

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Axauv 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumpity

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Man i wonder why mythic hates theurgs so much. i mean... dang. TL has been going all out since forever and... nothing.
5+ page threads, usually weekly, and... nothing.
every player complaining with good reason and... nothing.
not a single cry for /nerf theurgs, whereas ive heard cries for /nerf about everything else, and... nothing.
a populace of 1-2 ice theurgs and worldwide earth theurgs in the double digits, and... nothing.

Now, they decide to try out some class balance. woohoo, class balance patch! finally some theurg lubbins!
umm.. didnt see the theurg lubbins on the patch notes... guess they forgot them.
oh wow, they are finally fixing those poor archers, they were almost as gimp as us.
oh, doh, what an oversight, that archer fix is actually gonna nerf us, rofl, i bet they take that out quick happy
oh wait, they arent takin it out?
oh well, at least we should get something to make up for it, plus the class balance!
oh... i dont see any class balance yet...
oh, they arent giving us anything to make up for it...
oh, now they are making arrows not only penetrate, but pop BT...
wow, the patch went live, and nothing. guess its time to wait another year.

Mythic, its obvious you dont give a **** about theurgs, or the poor people who play them, so why not just boot us all? maybe delete our theurgs? take the class out of the game, as it is its just feeding the other people a couple rp? hey, it would help the realm, since it seems most of us are such diehards that several years with... nothing hasnt knocked us out. oh well...

(edit for general cohesiveness and a touch of spelling, its kinda late)

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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bump

 

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Caepinus 
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UP

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Bumpity...

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump happy

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Let's hope that 1.63 is the "we're sorry we nerfed pbt, here's some stuff" patch.

 

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Heladus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/e shrugs

I'm an air wizard now so whatever they do to Earth doesn't really effect me any longer ... of course I still have the 10 second bubble so I hope whatever they add has at least low level versions so I can have some new toys ... then again that assumes they will add something.

 

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Latric 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Double the pet life span. Raise the level onf the procs so they are not constantly resisted at 50. Make the !@#$% Ice pet actually cast.

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump happy maybe if we keep this on the front page someone will see it... lol

 

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Latric 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Well it only took a year of this to get us longer range cc proff pets. There is hope.

 

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{old}Incinerator_Bedevere 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

The ONLY thing i see Earth Theurgs doing anymore is farming in DF. The Archer changes ( which i will be the first to say were needed) hit theurgs the hardest by far.

keep bumped.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Our problem is we just sit here and take the punishment. Then we politely ask for fixes. Then Mythic ignores us. That has been the cycle since the begining of the game.

Meanwhile classes that cry and whine and ask for the world get moderate help. I'm tired of this garbage, but will sit here like a good little theurgist.

Mythic, remember us? The only caster in the game never to get a new spell. The class with the fewest spells in each line and overall. And the class that gets hit with an inderect or direct nerf almost every patch.

 

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Ylistra 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgist's need love!

Suggestions:
Reasonable pet casting cost.
Wind-baseline DOT/DD.
Castable stun & AOE stun.

Dreamworld:
Stationary one-shot PBAoE pet. (i.e. landmine pet)
Melee pet w/ bonus against doors/siege (i.e. siege ram pet)
Fire-and-forget pet.
Single long durration pet.


 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
badabump

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bumpidybumpbumpbump

Mezz range 1500
DD spell to earth line
GTAOE to earth
Ice DD with debuff
Wind DD with snare

Bumpbumpbumpidy

 

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{old}Daltarr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgists...that other caster of DAoC. Nobody really knows what they do. Nobody really knows how they fit in. Every Hib and Mid loves em for their easy RP though. They'd wish every Alb were a theurgists.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Let's hope that 1.63 is the "we're sorry we nerfed pbt, here's some stuff" patch."

Naw...1.63 will be the "we'll unnerf a tiny bit on PBT nerf, consider yourself loved for the rest of the year" patch. Or the "no PBT fix yet, resume playing with your sad character alone in RvR" patch.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
We're here to bump

*CLAP*

YOU UP!

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Good Morning Camelot!

*Morning BUMP*

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/wave Mythic. We're still here.

 

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Barath-Xap 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I'm not really sure they *can* give something good to the earth theurg line at this stage of the game. Rather than beef up the earth line like they should've done in the first place, mythic gave albs defensive abilities like minstrel ablative chant, BoF, and Soldier's Baracade.

Now if they suddenly make earth line attractive for theurgists to spec, won't it throw realm balance even more out of whack? I feel for any class that has an undesirable spec line (*cough*summon SM), but that line should've been fixed long ago before these extra abilities were added to the realm. Seems that it is too late now unless mythic is going to "balance" things more by giving the other realms similar defensive RAs/abilities.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
All the wind line needs is to have the mez range normalized with EVERY OTHER secondary mez in the game.

At least a real explanation should come from Mythic about why they think that having a 1500 range ghetto AE mez in the wind line would be overpowering. (Since after a year of lobbying, it seems that they think that having a normal range ghetto ae mez and a spec dd in the same spec line would be overpowering)

Earth needs--to be brought up to relative par with the runie supression spec. Give the earth line a 180 snare + DD like the suppression line has, and earth theurgs would be happy.

Ice needs--Make the dd a dd+resist or something, and put in a mild GTAE or something. Fix the ice pets so they are "cast only" and can't be goaded into melee mode by casting instas and cc spells on them. Fix the problem with the game engine that treats snare the same as root, so they are on the same timer. Remove snare effects from all immunity timers.

Give all theurg pets the 35% damage bonus that DOTs and "controllable pets" got in spring of last year. Theurg pets are either pets, or DOTs, don't give them the disadvantages of both, but not give them the advantages as well.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for much-needed theurgist love

 

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KnumbKnuts 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Yea,

I rolled an earth theurg cuz I thought "this sucker is at the low point, he'll get love, not a nerf."

Doh! NERFED! Thank you, drive through.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
>>
Didn't we see about 5 threads 15+ pages long, just like this, over the past month, with no response?
<<

That thread was locked.


/bump for theurgists. We have been crying for too long. This is totally ludicrous to have a class with such BAD and barren spec lines.

Add a GTAE to the earth line
Add a single stun in the Air line
Add an AE DD + Snare in the Ice line

Make a different version of the air and earth pets in that this one, when cast, appears at the target’s feet. Put it on a 10 sec recast timer. Whatever.

Add a siege DoT in the ice line. This DoT would affect doors and siege equipement. It would tick for xx amount for 6 ticks.

Give a bigger variety of pets. The VAST majority of the Animist pets were suggestions that were given on the THEURGIST board. They were things that the theurgists had thought about to make their bad class better. These suggestions were taken and molded into a new class and given to another realm.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
More great suggestions. If Mythic gave us just 1% of what we suggested, we wouldn't need these large threads.

 

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Shadowmage 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
up I say up!

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Add a GTAE to the earth line
Add a single stun in the Air line
Add an AE DD + Snare in the Ice line

Make a different version of the air and earth pets in that this one, when cast, appears at the target’s feet. Put it on a 10 sec recast timer. Whatever.

Add a siege DoT in the ice line. This DoT would affect doors and siege equipement. It would tick for xx amount for 6 ticks.

Give a bigger variety of pets. The VAST majority of the Animist pets were suggestions that were given on the THEURGIST board. They were things that the theurgists had thought about to make their bad class better. These suggestions were taken and molded into a new class and given to another realm."

Amen. I wish Mythic would listen.

 

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Barath-Xap 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Give a bigger variety of pets. The VAST majority of the Animist pets were suggestions that were given on the THEURGIST board. They were things that the theurgists had thought about to make their bad class better."

That's funny. The exact same thing happened with Spiritmaster pets ... almost all of the things suggested on the boards to help the struggling spiritmaster class was given to Bonedancers.

 

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Jjix 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Yep, zerkers got some major love this patch.

As I recall, theurgists got major love just a few patches ago. How much do you want?

Remember, as soon as you class becomes uber, you will get nerfed into puddy. Be careful for what you wish for.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
... we got major love? what? we got more range for people to see our pets coming and run? no cc? this is all great, cept that most of the time the pets never make it to the target, they cost way too much power, and they do pathetic damage. major love would be putting theurgs up to where all the other classes are, giving them 3 new useful spell lines in each spec, boost dmg on our RA, and give us something to compensate for the pbt nerf.

 

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soccervh 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Give earth either
gtae dots
ae stun
cold debuff.

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump... happy

 

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jaythegamerguy 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
much love for theurgists

i play a runemaster and thank god everyday that midgard only has 3 casters (SI included). That means that all of the neato abilities casters get in DAOC are on either a runie or SM. I feel sorry for the albs because u have like 7 casters and everything is so spread out =(

I get to nuke, or PBT, or bolt. Nice options. Theurgs don't quite have this comfort.

 

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Tavarez_DAOC 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
You poor deluded fools.

If you think that Animists are an improvement on the design of Theurgists, you need to quit your armchair Game Developing.

Animists are the least played class in the game for a lot of good reasons. They can be a frustrating class to play and require a patience and a learning curve to understand how to play them effectively.

And even then, they are still in a semi beta state with plenty of idiosyncratic bugs that may never be completely fixed.

Animists and theurgists share the same problems in many ways.

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump sad

 

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Elvana 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/Bump some new spells for Earth Theugists.

Fix the pathing on Ice pets as well.

 

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{old}Midgard1.62 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Earth Theurgs do need loving. I leveled a Earth Theurg to 50 and would have to agree that the spell line is seriously lacking.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"As I recall, theurgists got major love just a few patches ago. How much do you want?"

Did you even open the DAoC box, you 'tard? We didn't get JACK. Siege Bolt, the completely useless RA...has been "fixed" to be completely useless. Pets that're useless & huge mana drains...have been fixed to be still a wandering pile of crap. And now PBT...has been "fixed" to be useless.

Yea...major love. Play the game moron.

"Earth Theurgs do need loving. I leveled a Earth Theurg to 50 and would have to agree that the spell line is seriously lacking."

Getting power-leveled does NOT count in judging a class being effective. Any moron (like yourself) can level a class up to 50. Try taking that Level 50 Earth Theurgist gimp out to the RvR, and see how laughably useless we are.

Plus, given that your sig has Midguard on it, and you haven't posted worth a who-ha-diddly, you must either be a troll, or an uber newb. In either case...

SHUT UP.

 

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jonny290 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
With all due respect, it's my opinion that Theurgists are the best casters in the game right now. Even Earth theurgists.

Why? They have pets. Pets are helping the to-hit problems TREMENDOUSLY on epic-ish mobs, from sents all the way up to Sidi mobs. I agree that our class needs some major upgrading, especially earth, but still...


Just realize that you, right now, have the power to make those level 67 mobs die in half the time - dump a power bar full of pets, and sit down and watch your tanks and casters start to land at rates closer to pre-patch levels.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
And that will help me in RVR how?

 

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jonny290 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I wasn't saying that it's going to help RvR. I was simply stating that we're not the worst class in the game. Maybe if you removed that <Retired> flag and gave it a shot, you'd find redeeming value in some sort of activity with your theurgist. This is my first high-level (getting 50 tonight, woo), but even I realize that a class's role shifts.

But yes, earth theurgists need major bumps to their spec line.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"With all due respect, it's my opinion that Theurgists are the best casters in the game right now. Even Earth theurgists.

Why? They have pets. Pets are helping the to-hit problems TREMENDOUSLY on epic-ish mobs, from sents all the way up to Sidi mobs."

I hate to break it to you newb, but the end-game here ISN'T PvE. Sure, you rolled a terrific PvE bot, but will suck uber beans in the REAL game...RvR.

Best caster in the game my ass...ever see an enchanter? Or hell, even a wizard? Those classes could fart & out-perform anything a Theurgist could do in the battlefield.

It's great that your happy with staying in the PvE environment. You really should've just played Everquest, or some other carebear MMORPG. But to say that our class is "great"...hell, even "ok", you are full of it. So, sit down, shut up, resume playing in that tiny box of yours. Those that actually want to play the game deserve a chance at their fare share of RPs.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Aquablaze seems to be getting very bitter, and I can't blame him. I've seen many a good theurgist quit this game in a fit of frustration. Done it a few times myself, but I decided to come back each time for some reason (Spellcraft, SI). Next time will be my last time.

But I will be around for a while longer because I am loving my siege caster - my ice wizard.

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Quote:

Add a GTAE to the earth line
Add a single stun in the Air line
Add an AE DD + Snare in the Ice line


Pretty much the same things I suggested back on page 6 of this thread, though I gave several options to fix the Air line.

Mythic: Theurgists have the fewest spells in the game. They have received NO NEW SPELLS since release. Fix Theurgists, or just delete them from Albion and disperse their abilities elsewhere.

 

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{old}Aelie 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I've got THE solution happy

Buy a second account, PL a little clerc (1 or 2 days played in barrow sidi and avalon and no need 2 pc). wink

Then life will be much better tongue

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
All having a buffbot will do is give you the equivalent of a free Aug Acuity/Aug dex, but keep in mind that most of the time you group you would have had mid level buffs anyway.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgist ice line is a joke... i mean really ridiculous.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Yep, zerkers got some major love this patch.

As I recall, theurgists got major love just a few patches ago. How much do you want?

Remember, as soon as you class becomes uber, you will get nerfed into puddy. Be careful for what you wish for. "

well I don't wanna be mean, but Jjix was being sarcastic... use the context clues in the first sentance, he mentions zerker love (by love he means nerfs in a sarcastic way), and he says the same about theurgist (pbt nerf). All he is saying is how much more do we want to be nerfed... if we got something good people might complain then we would become worse.

Problem with that is, we cant become worse...

Just wanted to clear that up.... bump

 

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Axauv 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
If you add the spells for all spec lines of ALL casters you get the following:

Theurgist spells TOTAL: 17 (including pbt, dmg add, haste, 2 DDs, one low range mez, and practical joke pets)

Runemaster: 25 (including debuff for own dmg, ground target, dmg add, pbt, DD, bolts, range AE, nearsight)

Enchanter: 23 (including stun, 2 DDs, pbae, debuff own dmg, pet, pet buffs, dmg add, dmg shield)

Spritmaster: 30 (including DD, debuffs, pet, pet buffs, pbae, rez, debuffs)

Bonedancer: 28 (including pets, pet buffs, snare, dots, baseline DD, lifetap)

Mentalist: 19 (including heals, HoT, dots, 2 DDs, AE DD, charm, mez, stun, power regen, dmg shield)

Eldritch: 27 (including dmg shield, stun, gtae, bolts, stun, DD, DD and snare, disease, nearsight)

Necromancer: 23 (including pet, insta spells, lifetaps, power taps, DD, dots, AE, pbae, pet buffs, realm abs buff)

Sorceror: 31 (including charm, mez, DD, dots, debuffs, power regen, mez debuffer, lifetap)

Animist: 28 (including pets, DD, pet buffs, pbae, snare, turret pets, lifetap)

Cabalist: 33 (including snare, debuffs, pet, pet buffs, lifetaps, dots, nearsight)

Wizard: 21 (including bolts, DD, AE DD, dmg add, dmg shield, GTAE)

As you can see, theurgist is at the BOTTOM of the entire heap when it comes to spell selection; with TWO of the theurgist spec lines yielding only THREE SPELL CHOICES EACH.

The mentalist comes in second with only 19 spells; but here is a character with buffs, stacking dots, heal over time, and power regen in the SAME SPEC LINE.

Theurgists are the forgotten characters, the lost casters that are a threat to no one anywhere. I have never been killed by theurgist pets even on alts; and I frankly doubt my escaping that fate is anything to be surprised about. I believe Mythic will fix theurgists; and I believe it can be done easily without making them an unbalanced FOTM.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
200 posts now. You have all the data in this thread Mythic. Read it over, ignore the spam and flames from both sides and read the data. This should not be a difficult decision.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
>>
You poor deluded fools.

If you think that Animists are an improvement on the design of Theurgists, you need to quit your armchair Game Developing.

Animists are the least played class in the game for a lot of good reasons. They can be a frustrating class to play and require a patience and a learning curve to understand how to play them effectively.

And even then, they are still in a semi beta state with plenty of idiosyncratic bugs that may never be completely fixed.

Animists and theurgists share the same problems in many ways.
<<


Honestly, I don’t give a crap about how gimpy Animists are. If you don’t like them, make a thread about it posting ideas on how to fix them (like we are doing to Theurgists). I posted that the ideas given for Theurgists by Theurgists on this board (and probably others) were taken and made into a new class.

No where did I ever say that Animist are better than theurgists or an improved version of. The fact that the ideas given by the theurgist community were badly implemented and poorly designed is a totally different topic.

I totally agree that both classes have similar problems, they are both gimpy. Problem is that Theurgists have been waiting a whole year more than Animists for any REALISTIC fix.

So before calling people fools, please try to understand what the people mean. You may end up looking like the fool. (not a flame, just a warning tongue )



Unfortunatly, its not just a matter of how many bumps, posts or how many times people will say it. I seriously doubt that after almost 2 years, nothing substantial has been done to theurgists. It’s sad to see a class be in the shape it is in 2 years after launch and not see ANY word from Mythic on the subject.

Hunters used to be known as a bad, gimpy class. They got some major tweaking done to help them out. I cant comment if the class is better off, but I don’t see “Save the Hunters” posts like I did a year ago.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
My earth theurg is now a bot, thanks mythic. Its a waste of time to even bother going out in rvr, I have no chance of being able to survive, there is no reason for me to help in keep defense or offense because I can't do a thing. Siege masters we are NOT! Wind theurgs are the only spec you can go with and frankly if you wanted to make theurgs be a one spec puppy then you should have never created earth and ice, they are both jokes.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
ba da bump

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for theurg fixes

The class needs help NOW!

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Masters of siege!!!

<Slowly begins to lose his mind>

 

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Pritcon 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Do you really want Mythic to do Anything? Those last tweaks where NEVER asked for, Not by any of our TL's, Not by the theurgists community.

Think of something from left field, that's what they will do to us.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Yea...so I am kinda gettin' bitter. It really sucks having your character's head stepped on every patch day. Then, after all is nerfed and done, I come to ignorant posters who say "Theugists are fine, shut up"...well, that really just boils it.

So, sorry to those I've blown up on, however, I think I'll keep feelin' this testy until Mythic decides to either do something with this class, or *%#@ing delete it already.

And finally, yes, all the evidence is out there that Theurgists are the uber suck. Mythic just needs to stop playing Hellen Keller and fix us already. But, one thing I learned from the OJ trial out here in LA, evidence still doesn't mean a damn thing. ^_^

FIX US MYTHIC, I KNOW WHERE YOU LIVE!!!...er...no I don't. Damn.

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgists need improvement, a /bump for Theurgists.

Out in BG3 today with my BM, felt bad for the poor theurg spamming Air pets at me...

 

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Syndire 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgists need !no loving! whatsoever with their chain stunning pets. Its impossible to beat them and they already had pet buffs in the last patch. So lemme think, oh yeah, cry me a river.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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"Theurgists need !no loving! whatsoever with their chain stunning pets. Its impossible to beat them and they already had pet buffs in the last patch. So lemme think, oh yeah, cry me a river. "

haha funny how this post is focused on earth and ice (66% of the theurgists abilities) not wind. People still can not read. And fyi, if your getting chain stunned, your either playing on a pvp server, or your a low level noob. Also there is this thing called running, and all you really need to run for is a few seconds before any "chain stunning" pets will die before they can "chain stun" you.. its called brains. quickcastable stuns that other realms get are not as avoidable.

Cry me a river? thats a real original one. Makes you funny and cool at the same time eh? Must be a fan of the BackStreat Boys too.

/bump

**edit**
lol just checked your signature:

50 Hunter (sold) • 44 Runemaster • 41 Shaman
Nelo - 24 Runemaster • Marionete - 24 Shaman • Sleipneir - 24 Hunter
Baromier - 20 Warrior (800 AC) • Sunari - 20 Shadowblade

thats funny, not one character over 45.. I can see why your having trouble. And a buncha BG characters where pets still have not become completely useless because of the level percentage. Oh wait, you did have a 50, but you sold it. Too bad.. but the funny thing is your 44 runemaster could still bolt any earth theurgist to hell, or nuke me to hell of your darkness.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Ignore the moron and keep going.

If I dump more than 60% of my power into 5 pets (required minimum to chain stun) thenh hell yes, I should be able to kill one person.

I kill ENTIRE GROUPS with my ice wizard and pbaoe damage with LESS POWER. Get a clue.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Naw...I think Backstreet boys are too outta this loser's range. I'm pretty sure he's more into Sesame Street, or he's "chillin'" with Barney.

Yea, I bet chain stunning is really annoying...for a 'tard like you. Honestly, there are a range of things to do against those weak things. You choose to bend over and take it up the rear...and folks are supposed to feel sorry for you? Again, that's just plain stupid.

And yes, most of these threads are dealing with the two dead spec lines to Theurgists. Lord knows my Earth Theurgist can't chain stun, or let alone spam multitudes of pets with the high cost of (the now useless) 6 sec PBT. Hell, even air is slightly lacking in damage/utility, and could use slight tweakage up. All three lines to the Theurgist need to be re-evaluated, and need some massive fixes NOW.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I love it when people post stuff like he did. Its a free bump for the cause. He is essentially taking the thread from the bottom of the page (because he never gets by page 1) and puts it at the top for all to see.

So thanks for the bump. No real need to defend the ideas and problems with the class. No need for us to explain them to you, but please, keep coming back and bumping the post...

some people are such lemmings and blindly follow without thinking.

Here is to hope that theurgists get some help in 1.63

 

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Silverleaf90 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I agree, a theurgist is my first toon, now at level 46 I nothing more then combat support. I buff and pbt but my DD is very weak. If I cast a pet I get yelled at for exp leaching. In RvR, my pets are go for little more then minor disrupting of a foe. When I first rolled the toon, I was under the impression I would be a major force in sieging, that has not been the case at all. A GTAOE would be nice, or a seige bolt in the earth line would be cool.

Thanks,

Silver happy

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I like the idea of putting the Siege Bolt into the earth line. And then give Theurgists a different unique RA.

And yes, GTAE should of been a theurgist spell and NOT a wizard spell.

 

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Shadowmage 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
up you go my friend.

 

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Axauv 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

worst class in the game, fix them please.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I've noticed that the only thing people can say is that the air pets are so good and they chain stun, i'm sorry But I have never seen out in odin or emain or my frotier my air pets chain stunning anyone from getting to me and putting death on me, if your only arguement is air pets then you need to move it along.

 

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Balthar_IV 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theurgist need love! Bump

 

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{old}Telidor 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/Bump

All we ask is utility. The begining guide mentioned we were able to assist with keep assults/defence in so many words, i dont think seige bolt is the answer. I have posted it before but my idea is.

GTAOE that does 1/2 what the equiv wiz but does 4X the amount to seige equip doors.

And a new Idea.
OR how bout if you target your pet (earth only) on a friendly keep. It would add X amount to the doors hip as temp hip depending on level of earth and level of pet used. The extra hip could be on a timer base of X amount.

Verick
-shamlessly stalking sorc for more crack

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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{old}Rokar 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
For the love that is all sacred and Holy FIX THEURGISTS!!!!!!!!

In fact most (not all) of the casters are beening put down FAR too easily. Sure we need to be put down fast because of the high damage we can deal out (Except theurgists, AND the fact most of our damage is resisted :You hit for 32 (-320)" Gimmie a break!) But How can we be putting out this "high damage" if we are face down in the dirt 98.9% of the time? Come on all we want is a chance in RvR sad Oh well time for another person to roll ANOTHER stealther.....

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
booooooomp

 

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Fabersham 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I think i'm one of the last earth theurgs on my server. so sad.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I'll be rolling an earth theurgist - on my second account - as a bot.

 

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Axauv 
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Only caster my shaman could kill in his sleep lol; the theurgist.

Either fix theurgists or give them /quickcast sprint lol

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bump I mean really I just did a /who Theurg On guinevere at 8pm, prime time, about 2800 people on the server and out of that only 21 people were theurgs, now i'm not really that bright since I rolled a earth theurg to begin with but I mean when there are only 21 people playing one class at prime time when there were

1. 70 clerics
2. 61 frair
3. 47 minstril
4. 34 cabalist
5. 66 infil
6. 35 reavers


I mean those are just a few of what i did /who on but really no one plays these things and if they do they are wind spec why even bother with earth and ice just combine them all and let us at least enjoy throwing our money away.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumpah
i think our ice line needs something unique which can really differentiate and identify us as siege master.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
would it make sense if:
-Air nuke has a given/small percentage of snare.
-Ice nuke comes with a percentage of debuff.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I do a /who theurgist 46-50 all the time (also on guinevere). I pick this range, because that is the range of eligiblity for loot on a Sidi raid. There are anywhere from 5-15 level 50 theurgists on at a given time with 1-5 level 46-49. Theurgist is my favorite character for Sidi raids not because of his abilities, but because of my odds of getting a drop.

 

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motowntheta 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Theres a difference between RvR played earth theurgists and PvE bot earth theurgists just in the same way as RvR played rejuv clerics and RvR bot enhance clerics .... a shame that.

I'm sure I'm probably the only RvR 'Played' Earth Theurgist on Excalibur sad

Anyway just a small /bump

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for help for the worst caster class in the game

 

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leonheart00 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Earth Theu is the best class...





for a bot who follow you. It needs no care at all. Best bot for melee class grin

 

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BrockmooreWallace 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Something, anything...

- Siege Elementals
- GTAOE in Earth Line
- Siege Equipments Buffs and Debuffs
- Double the damage Siege Bolt does, yes I have Siege Bolt. :/
- Make our Elementals Insta cast with a timer
- DD spell in Earth Line
- DoT in Earth Line

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
help theurgz!

 

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{old}MrNavon 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I think the idea of making an Earth Theurg a powerful siege class is a good one. Many of the ideas in this thread for that are very good. You only need to implement a couple of them to make an Earth Theurg an actively played class instead of a PBT Bot.

Besides, would it really be overpowering to have GTAE available in two places in Alb? Especially with it in two weak spec lines?


Wind Theurgs are obviously nukers with some utility (weak mez, 10 sec PBT, run speed, buffs). Already a decent spec, any additions to the other lines would have some small benefit to Wind Theurgs so they probably don't need any direct help.

What I'm not sure of is what to do with Ice theurgs. They have mediocre damage and mediocre CC (full range and duration, but a root doesn't help a caster when your rooted opponents can still attack you at range and interrupt your casting).

I'm not sure if any of these would be the right fit:

1) AE Damage (a wizards domain, and only clear role that they can do better than anyone else)
2) Better single target damage (maybe more utility damage options like DD/Debuff. Would still leave Theurgs with weak offensive options in this spec. Full DD damage is the domain of wind theurgs.)
3) More CC (Ok, obviously a bad idea....)
4) More utility (AE dex/qui or Str/Con debuffs? Resist debuffs?)
5) More buffs (something defense related that would help tanks in the field. Wouldn't help the bot situation much though)

Whatever the fix, it should be in line with the concept that Theurgists are part of the Defenders of Albion and fight in the field next to Armsman, Scouts, and Friars. The PBT fits with this, as well as their beneficial buffs (damage add and haste). Would be nice to see the class concept included in the fix.

 

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{old}Kaladim 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump cause theurgists have been ignored too long

 

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GoldManiac 
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Any boost for theurgists would be a good start. Come on 1.63

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Gilimyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
How about a 50% cold debuff in the earth line?

 

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Locrian_Mode 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
have pets regen a bit of mana when they die,
or put pets on a conc system where you get conc back when a pet dies.

(good idea from earlier in the thread)

help the theu!

 

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cabbyman 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I woulnd't mind a castable monkey, so while I'm running pbt I could play an accordian and have my monkey dance for the enjoyment of all around!

 

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Latric 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Has one of these theurgist threads reached a 1000 posts yet?

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I'm sure if you added up all the theurg threads you would by pass all the scout whines, so I figure we should be getting love pretty soon since mythic listens to whomever whines the most, I mean god forbid if they actually just look at theurgs, here is an idea mythic, go play an earth theurg or ice theurg in rvr, i'm not talking about one you create with all the best stuff and RR10 with best RA's i'm talking go create a lvl 50 like what most of us have and see how long you last, see how fun it is.

 

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74orgun 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Before you get love , go back at the end of the line , you where given 2000 pet range , wait your turn until every class get love

grin

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
What a moron. The class wasn't fixed AT ALL and it still sucks canal water.

The earth spec line remains the worst spec line in the game, theurg pets still cost a % of power instead of a fixed cost, the theurg mez is still shorter in range than that of every other class, theurg pets still take to long to reach their targets, theurg pets still die too quickly...all this is why theurgs still need love NOW.

Theurgs are the worst caster class in the game, and the theurg earth spec line is the worst spec line in the game.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
>>>have pets regen a bit of mana when they die<<<

That’s a cool idea. I like it.


>>Has one of these theurgist threads reached a 1000 posts yet?<<

The last one that almost did got locked!

74… they can have that love back. All that range does is make it that our pets (who have the same life timer) have to run further to get to their targets.

I don’t consider that love. Not even close. Its more like a wedgie.

And thanks for bumping

 

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BrockmooreWallace 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"you where given 2000 pet range"

We dont have pets, we have Elementals. happy

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..


Earth: GTAoE DoT or GTAoE DD

Ice: AoE DD/Snare

Air: AoE Stun (lacking in Albion), or Single Target 1m 20 sec max mezz.

Its very simple mythic...

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Earth line has been dubbed the support spec. Alright fine give us more support spells. How about a AOE Root spell like how Ice has, How about a debuff spell that debuffs ice or spirit. How about some sort of mana regain ability so we can run pbt and be able to cast buffs. Anything How about one damage spell in the earth line so we don't have to rely on the second spec dmage or the ICE baseline attack which is terrible. Please love.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump happy

 

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Ylistra 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
How about giving Theurgists a real pet? Like a permanent version of the elemental, with the normal pet command panel.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Giving earth theurgs a spec cold debuff would be good, since casters who can debuff their own damage are easily the best ones these days.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Anything at all?

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
How about drop the level on the pets, increase timer to like 2 minutes, have one "master elemental", he gets a control panel and l;asts indefinitely. all pets are green to you at whatever level you are, master elemental is high green, anything else is low green. the army of pets you cast follow the master elemental around, like golems. you tell him to attack, he runs and attacks and they all follow him and attack. they cannot choose targets independantly, dont aggro on anything, only help the master elemental, like an extension of him. after 2 minutes they dissappear. same power cost, make it harder for air pets to chain stun, since you could technically get a ton, all that. this way, you could have a short duration mini-siege army of pets to get all up on a door or siege equipment or whatever. this might be unbalanced, im not sure, but i think it wouldnt be horrible for theurgs to actually... you know... not suck for once... mana chanters have been overpowered since day one and they still keep gettin lubbins...

 

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Silverleaf90 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have now rolled a wizard and will be specing him in earth mostly for the GTAOE. That seems to be one of the biggest support items in a keep raid. I was hoping my theurgist would be able to be a factor in a keep raid, but...............what's that, ok here's some rebuffs....goes back to reading his book...:(

 

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Radient_Morning 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump yeah Theurgs need some loving

Mythic has already stated that theurgists aren't allowed to have aoe damage spells, so an aoe stun in the earth line would be very usefull, but make sure that it starts at 29 earth spec, perhaps 29/39/49 earth, and 6 8 10 seconds respectively. This way wind theurgs couldn't really use it, at least not with the lvl 45 wind DD, as it was already deemed too powerfull for earth wizards who had spec aoe DDs. Imo, that would really boost the earth line, and give all 3 speclines a form of aoe CC.

And /agree please please please please please make theurgist mezz 1500 range, I HATE having to be in /hug range to cast a mezz (it should also be noted that darkness spiritmasters should have their radius increased to 350 on their ranged aoe mezz).

For Ice I believe the pets need to have 3 second cast times and check for in range at the BEGINNING of a cast instead of the end, so that people can't easily run away from them (atm they are the easiest to outrun/avoid). I also think they should proc snares when they melee to add usefullness in RvR.

 

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motowntheta 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Hey it's 1.63a and we haven't been fixed yet happy

 

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{old}Maverick15999 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
kk, 1.63b /hug Theurgists happy? There is your love. happy

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumps

 

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Gilimyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
AoE stun would be nice too. I really don't understand why theurgists have been left out for so long. Low offensive punch. Low survivability. Recently nerfed utility.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump...again...hoping... for...something....anything...

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Pendragon down. After more than a year and a half I'm very pessimistic, but I still have that tiny spark of hope.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Kill the spark of hope, I really doubt theurgs will ever be fixed.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Guess not. <Waves hands wildly> Over here, remember us?

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
*steps and snuffs the spark of hope out* Trust me, I did you a big favor. Ditch the b*tch and either play a new game, or roll a viable toon.

"I don’t consider that love. Not even close. Its more like a wedgie."

LOL! Too true. Hell, even if Mythic were to play a RR10 Earth Theurgist, they would still suck monkey balls. What's there to get? Will that fix everything? Uh...yea. Thought so.

 

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WhiteRhyno 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Dont forget ice theurgists, I know we all want earth to be made good but ice is really lacking also.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Sure, Ice is short a few things, but Earth is the single worst spec line in the game.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Heck! I'd be happy if they made EITHER earth or ice viable!!

Well, that plus make siege bolt comparable to other class specific RAs.

 

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Karaethyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
You know what would make theurgs a good spec, One way simple way easy way, allow us to get two points instead of one point spec. That way you could easily spec in both wind and earth. Simple, fast and easy.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
2 points per level would let us get 50 in 2 spec lines and 28 in the third with minis. And we still would be a subpar caster class. We need changes and we need them a year ago (or now).

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
(Cut n pasted my original post from the official Theurg discussion boards)

First we're gonna have to start with some facts. Before 1.62, earth theurgists were mainly useful for shielding against a rain of arrows at main gate standoffs or keep sieges. They're lousy nukers, all CC has been nerfed by SC / Determination / Cheap Purge.

That's gone now. What are earth theurgists good for?

Indeed, what?

Suggest a 1 minute immunity timer to be added to the Friction line of spells since it's the last (and only unnerfed) secret weapon in the earth theurgist's arsenal.

---

Cynical? Just look at these first person accounts of the incredible power of Friction!

(Name Withheld), Level 50 R7L4 Light Eldritch from Hib (Server Witheld) had this to say about Friction:
"we used to pwn groups dum enough to run with earth theurgists. theyd like spam those pets n we'd stt and watch em run back an whack em over and over lololllolol. and their baseline ice nuke lol. but after 1.62 we gotta watch em close or they run and find a spot ta friction. 5 sec to take down a caster instead of 4 sec is 4-ever for r tanks so we gotta nearsight em fast."

(Name Withheld), Level 50 R4L5 Ranger had this to say about Friction:
"Since 1.62 I've had the misfortune of running across more than one earth theurgist out solo pwning stealthers. Now I pop out of stealth knowing that while I pop his bubble, and chew through his hitpoints in about 5 seconds, that there's the odd chance that he'll get within 1500 range... and then he casts "it". And I'll be damned if my fire time doesn't go from 1.0 sec to 1.19 seconds. It's freaking awful. Sure their earth pet won't make it to us before I kill the guy, but I'm sure they have sprint on thier hotbar as '1' now, and that awful level 47 spec earth 'paralyzing friction' on the quickbar as 2. Whack! Friction. It even lasts 2 minutes at a 19% penalty to speed! We need at least a 1 minute immunity timer on friction to prevent re-friction. Nerf Friction now pls!"


---

Actually, I think Mythic has done Earth Theurgists a favor in 1.62. Where the awesome power of 6 sec bubble in RvR was overshadowing the real power of the Friction line of earth spec spells. Not only that, with the low mana cost and insta casting time of this spell, think of all the slow you can cause.

Who needs a variant of suppression runemaster, with their nearsight, DD/snare, AoE DD/snare, pbt, and non-specline bolts and fun and varied skillset when those Earth Theurgist masters o siege have Friction.

---

A modest proposal:

AoE Friction
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AoE Friction would be a nice addition to the Earth Theurgist's core spellset.

Make it a 5 second cast time, 1350 range, 350 radius and give it the Minstrel's "Victory Mez" animation.

Classic.

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
rofl, I love the above post.

Honestly, why do theurgists get no love? Either love us, or merge us with wizards, but we're miserable as-is.

With my free respec of 1.63, I went from 26earth/32air (headed to the cookie-cutter 45air/26earth spec) to 35earth/22ice. I wanted to be different, even though, after some serious thought, I know the earth/ice lines are quite subpar. Why is it so wrong to ask to be different?

Ice has serious issues.

The ice nukes are less delve damage than the air nukes. My only supposition is that they claim the damage of the ice pet evens it out, but the ice pet is resisted rather often (tested it at 42 against a 35 friar with and without self cold buffs), so it's really a non-issue. Why not bump up the ice damage to at least be on par with the air damage? (Speaking of the baseline ice nuke, as the specline ice nuke is just silly.)

Specline ice nuke also has lower damage, with a snare effect. Nice, but doesn't work at all with the specline AE root. Why are these two not on different timers yet? Or why doesn't the snare component get changed to an ice debuff? Additionally, the suggestion of simply adding a cold debuff in the ice line was a wonderful one. It's not like ice/earth theurgists are killing anyone now, and this would hardly become fotm.

Lastly, why on god's green earth do ice nukes cost more power? What reasoning was behind that? Most people who spec "full" earth (45 or 47) use their remaining points in ice to lessen the variance on baseline nukes. Earth already has more power problems than I can think of.

Earth has serious issues.

We have a pet, who melees for around 100ish, and that's IF the pet reaches the player in time, IF the player simply stands there and allows themselves to be whacked, and only useful IF the theurgist isn't dead already from the tell-tale "Hey, I'm easy realmpoints, come kill me!!!" pets.

We have an attack speed debuff. Whee.
The suggestion of having AE attack speed debuff would be fun, but it's still mostly useless.

We have pbt. Yah, that does so much good now that the archer changes are in and 6 sec pbt costs so much power you basically *can't* do anything else. We're better off running speed, picking up our robes, and heading for the hills as soon as an enemy is sighted. At least we wouldn't have rez effects when the fight's over.

Wind has an issue.

Why is mez range deficient? Why has this been asked forever, and never answered? Rest of the specline is fine, imo. But now that necros are out, spirit nukes are no longer even a good pve way to go, as there's nothing a theurgist can take that isn't being shared by 2-3 necros anyway. heh.

Pleasefixtheurgists!!!!!!!!
Edit: Oh, yeah, /bump.

 

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{old}Skyhaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"1) The other 2 lines suck too much to use
or
2) Wind is real cheap.

I dont think it is #2..

LOL I am pretty sure tis #2... and #2 alone...

For to make ice and earth as appealing as or even more appealing than air you'd have to make the other speclines just as cheap as air is...

Now excuse me... how are you going to make them more appealing than what air has available?

You need only mix with enough earth to get the 10 sec PBT. Doh you would get the ghetto mezz? Your ghetto mezz is just what most part of the Healers on Midgard get since most will go only 39 Pacification.

Now combine it with your 2000 range chain stunning pets and the highest damaging dd and you have something... Simple combo mezz some pets dd dd and a dead target...

Air theurgists are even cheaper against Mids... Since healers aug line just plain sucks Mids don't have the spirit resist buff... So an Air theurgist DD nukes like this against 29% spirit resist lvl 50 toon.

http://www.shadowkan.com/sb/lori.JPG

540+ dmg per dd for no need for debuffs


"there are far more cheap lines in the game, and in Albion to play. And all the evidence points to #1."

Far more cheap lines? Nope, in Albion there are classes as cheap as Air Theurgist...
Example the 437 dmg in the pic above is from a necro (necros can also abuse of Mid lack of Spirit resists)... And there's always the extra cheapo Matter Cabalist, the best dotter in DAoC hands down, sporting AE DoTs, 2 stackable single target dots on the same line, nearsight, focus shield and pet recycle for power...

What Earth and Ice Theurgists need is a good nerf on Air specline and then maybe Mythic will give some love to those two lines...

Till there respec to air and go to Mid Frontier to farm RPs happy

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Well...I think this quote wrapped up the situation with Theurgists lines well:

"The only worse spell line in the game than the Theurgist's Earth line is the Theurgist's Ice spec line."

 

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{old}Mithandyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Skyhaze... i sure hope that was sarcasm...

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Sadly, it probably wasn't. Theurgists are all seen as the Evil Chain Stunning Superior Nuking PBT Casting Gods of Albion... even though we suck.

If people would just leave us alone, or go roll a theurgist to see for themselves how much we suck, we might actually get some love.

How is it the air theurgist or necro's fault that your realm has sucky spirit resist? Up the spirit resist and you'll be doin' a lot better, as that's a theurgist/necro/reaver counter right there.

 

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Rhyolt 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have played earth, Ice/Earth and wind/earth specs for this class and feel I have a pretty good idea of what's right and what's not.

Wind may well be the current favourite spec but personally it's not that satisfying for me to play.

Ice I liked for the AOE root and better pbt but it was definitely subpar in RVR -> why is there never mention of the fact that the snare/dd is on the root timer??? working as intended??

basically I no longer play this toon after spending over a year persevering with him. I respecced to air in the hope it would rejuvinate my interest but that wasn't to be. I find that spec ok in RVR but it's not an overly satisfying spec and not what I wanted to have.

My once favourite class that I leveled to conduct sieges with is possibly the worst siege caster in Albion....

Rhyalt
50 Theurgist
Pellinor

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
And upgrade siege bolt! It is the only theurg skill that blows more than the earth spec line does!!

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Someone posted the idea of changing siege bolt to be "Siege Dot" on the "Official RA Topic"... would love to see that. Usable only on doors/siege equip/keep guards type stuff, but dots for around 150-200, conc based, but greys out when the caster is out of a certain range. Maybe not a great fix, but an interesting idea.

 

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Lardahs_SOD 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
i wouldnt mind having the following added to our specs

Earth:
GTAE dot

Cold:
AE stun

Wind:
Longer range mez

also for pets, please do reduce the cost of casting each pet, as a seige caster, after we cast 12-15 pets on doors, we run oom and gotta sit down for min's to get mana back..

 

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daryen 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
ICE from the mid side seems like an ok spec.
Earth could use help.. especially when you compare it to what a warden gets.. makes you cry.


AIR ON THE OTHER HAND.... that spec could make baby jeasus cry cry

If you think about it.. you can go split spec and have aoe mez... long duration aoe root... and chain stunning pets shock

<--- FUll time mid saying earth needs help

 

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djbooger 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump!

 

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Albion_Exile 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Earth theurgist's could use help in RvR.. that seems obvious and GTAE for them might be a possibility (since it's the best siege spell available). If a theurgist decides to spec air primary, they'd be a strong keep warfare specialist with 6 sec pbt + gtae.

Ice theurgists are not in as bad of shape as their earth brothers but the spec DD/snare is not that great for damage output, but is pretty much identical to the one I live with as a suppression runemaster. Maybe we should both see the cast time reduced to 2.8 sec?

As for Air theurgists, I think they are one of the best caster classes/specs in Albion. Their air pets have 2000 range with stun spells that cast repeatedly. Your air DD is also a very high damage dealing spell with 2.8 sec cast time.
Maybe the Air mez isn't that good, but then your other tools are pretty nice. Don't forget you also get run speed, 2nd spec in Earth has 10sec pbt, and great buffs (damage add + haste).

2 of 3 spec lines (Air and Ice) are decent specs for RvR. Maybe earth doesn't cut it but alot of other classes have the same problem with 1 or more of their spec lines. Moreover, the weakest line for primary spec is always used a the 2nd spec line (so earth is not a completely messsed up line). Just add GTAE to earth and I think theurgists should be in ok shape.

Gromley level 50 runemaster guin

 

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motowntheta 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Can't have high air and 6 sec pbt sad

Ice DD's in the ice line are mana hogs and require you to take it so high so as not to have any pbt. Ice pets are very bad with their slow to cast lvl 25 dd sad

Earth is poor period.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
from what i read:
i like the idea of having STUN in air line.
i also like the idea of putting ice debuff in ice nuke.
i like the most on the idea of having GTAE Dot.

big /BUMP

 

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{old}Skyhaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Theurgists are all seen as the Evil Chain Stunning Superior Nuking PBT Casting Gods of Albion..."

Wrong... From Mid perspective:

Air Theurgists are the Evil Chain Stunning Superior Nuking Casting Gods of Albion

 

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luelle 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I agree with all the other Theurgists...

Ice and Earth suck and need major help..

Air is decent but needs a few tweeks...

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Hint: chain stun was removed a number of patches ago.


MYTHIC:

Theurg elementals need to cost a fixed anount, not a % of power. This is a bogus penalty that hurts high level therugs a LOT.

Theurg elementals need to be faster. They take too long to get to their target.

Theurg mez needs to be the same range as all other mezzes.

The Ice spec needs help.

The Earth spec is BROKEN.

Help theurgs now!

 

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{old}Znail-2 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Quote:
--------------------------------------------
Hint: chain stun was removed a number of patches ago.
--------------------------------------------
Hint: Chain stun was removed from players, not pets a few patches ago.

 

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BrockmooreWallace 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Honestly, why do theurgists get no love? Either love us, or merge us with wizards, but we're miserable as-is. "

And therein is the problem. During beta up until the very very end there was no Theurgist class, the Wizard and Theurg were one class.

Now obviously this was overpowered so they split them.

Problem is they then made both classes borderline useless and spread the needed abilities in Albion to thin.

 

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Latric 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I find it interesting that there is always a long thread on this here on the developers board. The fact is supported by players from all realms. They are very few that even attempt to say theurgist don't need some help. But nobody from mythic ever makes even the slightest comment on this problem and the only fix the class has recieved was ridiculasly weak.

 

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Shadowmage 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I am praying to the Mythic gods that they have plans for us in the RVR patch and plan to finaly give us our siege spells then to boost us that way. Becuase if they boost us before then boost us again in the RVR patch all holy hell will be raised around here and we will just lose everything we got.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I noticed that it's mostly Mids complaining about our nuke. You know why? Because most mids have less than 20% spirit resists. Yes, I nuke for about 500 on mids. And Hibs you ask? Well, they have over 60% spirit resists, and I nuke for about 200 on them. Not to tell mids how to defeat theurgists, but if you get more spirit resists, you'd see why we need so much help.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
sad part is spellcrafting lets you get max in everything you need for resists. My full time character (thats not a gimp) is now my 50 Savage on Percival. I have max of most the nuke resists, and wind theurgists are alot more easy to take damage from then most the other elementalist/mages. Anyone who complains about being owned by a caster with less then 20% of their resist is asking to get owned.

 

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Ylistra 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Now if only the earth line had a spell that was even worth attempting to resist....

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Cold day in hell would be if someone was specing their suit with /earth resist, OH NO A EARTH PET IS COMING AT ME!!!!!!! Thank god I have high earth resist. /bump

 

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{old}Jaavon 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I don't know whats been mentioned so far ... so might be some repeat info.

Earth (theurgist) is the only casting line in the game without a way to deal damage short of the pet spec's (spirit, enchantments - etc - which aren't really that bad though).

I've proposed fixes before in several threads, all of which were deleted to make room for skald reads or some other unexplained reason, and here is my fix ...

Take the snare/dd away from the iceline and make it a matter based earth nuke. Add a gtaoe to earth. Those two things would add utility to the utility line of albions utility caster. It would also somewhat satisfy the thought of the siege mage. There are other outlandish ideas out there to satisfy that requirement ... but they would be a lot harder to implement and get a 'hahaha ... no' response so they aren't worth mentioning.

The ice line is also somewhat lame. I think to help the ice spec line they should recieve a debuff/dd similar to an ice-wizards but perhaps make it a 20% debuff with a lower delve rather than an exact copy of the ice wizards. Also, add a pbaoe/debuff that would delve at 275ish at top level and add a 10-15% debuff to the effect. There lots of variations (snares, debuffs, stuns ... more if i put more thought into it) to the combination spells that would allow the ice theurgist to do a lot that the wizards can not (And work very well in tandem with them) while not stepping on their toes as the pure damage dealing casters of albion.

There is also a popular option to add an ice debuff or other debuffs to one of the two lines. I'm not against this, its a good idea, but i'd rather my idea wink .

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bump

I think everything has been said, its time for action now

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Well, another week is come and gone. Time to keep this bumped until monday when we can try again.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Yeah i'm kinda waiting to see what they do with this next patch. Mids are screaming now that they can't hit the I win button but i'm sure we shall see no love for theurgs.

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
From 1.52 Patch Notes:

"- Theurgist air pets have been tuned so that they stun a bit less in RvR, but retain a normal PvE stun rate. Previously, the high chance of the stun proc firing in RvR combined with a lack of a recast timer made the pet able to chain stun RvR targets."

Tip for the paranoid: Approximately 1sec stun proc average per 2 pets when you're even con with your target. Most air theurgists won't spend the time to cast more than 1 pet, which will interrupt while they nuke you down hard.

Since this 'chainstun' thing keeps coming up, a modest proposal would be to remove the stun proc from air pets entirely and instead give Air Theurgists a 1500 range, 3 sec castable 9 second stun. That way you'd have the benefit of an immunity timer; assuming that you live 9 seconds.

---

I think that everyone already knows what I think about the Earth line. It's was awful before 1.62 and it's worse now (except Friction which totally rocks with all the slow you can cause).

---

The Ice line is actually in FAR worse shape than earth. The earth spec is 45 earth / 29 ice. Few people go 50 in ice to get the last DD/snare anyways (or they lose out on PBT and the Air nuke is far more worthwhile). Since the LoS adjustments, their elemental is so worthless I haven't seen anyone above the rank of Warder in recent history actually cast one in combat.


How would I fix earth and ice? I'd look to the specialist skillsets of other casters with an eye for what the _intent_ of the specialization is. Earth and Ice seem thrown together without any real vision of what their purpose is in an RvR group. Choose Support (which would involve debuffs being added of some sort), Siege (which would involve GTAoE and maybe a bolt or two which could be used vs both doors and other players), or Pet Damage (which would involve adding a few of the pets that the animists use, but not their turrets; which are class-defining).

This is all just hot air though, these two spell lines have been broken for so long that most theurgists have respec'd Air.

Not that it's a bad thing for Albion RvR since Air can deal a lot of punishment.

It is, however, bad news for Albion in PvE since I'd predict that there will be less than 1% of theurgists with 6 second non-bot bubble in the next very few weeks.

After hammering my way to R5 with Earth, I finally respec'd air and I'd recommend the change to anyone who plays the class. The other two lines are simply not worthwhile in the RvR end game.

 

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Shadowmage 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bumps in hope we get at least word of something.

 

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Albion_Exile 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
There's a good reason why most mids have low spirit resistance compared to Hibs. Unfortunately, it has little do with SC'd equipment.

1) Hib enchanters have Brillant Aura of Deflection than gives them near magic immunity when activated. Mids have no such realm abilitiy (atleast ALbs have BoF).

2) Spirit resistance is in the augment line for healers. Guess what! most healers spec Pac/Mend and have augment too low even get the first spirit resist buff. To counter this problem, experienced Mid RvR groups run with 2 healers with 1 spec'd high augment just to get those nice resists. This usually requires someone in the guild to respec their healer from Pac to Aug. This makes the character less fun to play and makes the new aug healer unable to perform crowd control.

If you aren't in a optimized Mid group, you'll pretty much have 20 something spirit resist with typical SC setup. Don't blame us for spec line issues and lack of realm abilities.

Gromley level 50 runemaster guin

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
I have some radical new ideas for all three Spec lines, ideas which we all know mythic would never implement.

But here goes:

Earth line:

Pet Damage Add (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 11, 21, 31, 41 as examples. Would scale similar to the Warden/Paladin/Skald DPS chants. This spell would give all pets a boost to melee damage while the spell is in effect. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.

Pet Shield (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 14, 24, 34, and 44 as examples. This spell would scale similar to the Paladin Shield chant. This spell would give all pets a boost in defense while the spell is in effect. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.


Ice spec:

Pet Constitution (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 11, 21, 31, and 41 as examples. This spell would allow each pet to have 10%/20%/30%/40% more max HP while the spell is in effect. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.

Pet Life (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 14, 24, 34, and 44 as examples. This spell would allow each pet summoned while the spell is in effect, to have 10%/20%/30%/40% longer duration. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.

Air spec:

Pet Speed (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 11, 21, 31, and 41 as examples. This spell would scale similar to the Warden/Healer/Sorcerer speed spells. This spell would give all pets a boost to run speed while the spell is in effect. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.

Pet Haste (chant) 0s/6s/8s Would be 4 versions of the spell, gained at say lvs 14, 24, 34, 44 as examples. This would scale similarly to the Druid Haste buff. This spell would give all pets a boost to attack speed while the spell is in effect. Power cost would be 1/2/3/4 per pulse.


This gives each line 2 useful pet chants, which will help the effectiveness of Theurgist pets. The numbers can be tweaked of course for balance. I've put a power cost on each because others may deem them too powerful without one, but it is a low power cost.

These still go along with the following:

Earth: GTAoE of some kind
Ice: AoE DD/Snare
Air: AoE Stun or Single Target Mezz (1m 20 sec)

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump

 

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JohnM81 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Hello fellow Theurgists:


I left DAoC about a year ago and have been keeping track of it on and off. Most of you probably dont remember me. I used to be very active on the boards trying to get theurgists some love. I left after the whole 1.59 crap came about.

Well I see you all are still giving the good fight! Good for you! Let me throw in some of my support too.

As I preached before, swing based duration and access to wild minion would be a huge help the us when considering our gimpy pets.

It would be nice to have our mez uped to 1500 too.

Well just throwing in my .02 Good luck and cya around.


 

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_Arandal_ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
thoughts for the improvement of earth and ice

earth:
- GTAOE DD/Snare
- debuff cold damage
- reduce cost of 6sec pbt for all (even warden/runie)

ice:
- AOE DD (hailstorm) -OR- AOE nearsight (Fog)
- ice elementals PROC dd instead of current CAST dd AND dd level scales up with level of pet.
- fix the ultrabuggy AI for the elementals
- increase delve value of dd/snare. Baseline nukes should never be the weapon of choice over a same-line spec nuke.

all theurgists:
elementals should be able to reach targets, even on ramparts, windows, etc. If LOS is good and in range, spell should be able to affect target - earthellies tunnel, airellies fly, iceellies keep on PROCing their DD.

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Uggh, but the pets are so miserable. A bard's typical complaint is that, as soon as someone notices them with an instrument, they're dead.... even if the pets didn't have an insane power cost, they still tell everyone within visible radius, "Hey, I'm easy realmpoints!!"

As for the Mids and their resists, they could use help in a lot of areas, RA's and some reorganizing of spell lines, but that has little to do with whether or not Theurgists should get some love. Both should, imo, and I've bumped several mid threads in support of it. Also, I've heard rumors that the new "master levels" will include something along the lines of pbt for spells, that may have an impact, and may be one of the many reasons Mythic is holding off on improvements in some areas.

As for theurgist-wizard merge, aye, I knew they were the same class (in beta maybe?), but as time's passed, RA's have come into play, and spellcasters have grown weaker through resists/sc/etc, I don't think it would be overpowered now. Drop the pets, it's an idea that didn't work anyway.

Castable stun is a great idea. Smite cleric's stun is the only one we get, and with so few smite clerics these days (*cough* tynerf *cough*), we don't exactly have a comparable stun to the other two realms. It may be something that would need to be seriously evaluated to consider the consequences, but something to at least look at, no?

And with the new definition of a light tank, I can't help but wonder.... if they no longer consider theurgists a siege caster, why not come out and tell us, so we can try to come up with ideas that fit more in line with Mythic's "vision" for us? Or any kind of comment at all?

Still rather annoyed that Alb got their "Alb love" patch, and one of the classes who could use it just as much as the others, if not more, was completely ignored. (Unless you count making two of the three pets run a small percentage faster, and nerfing pet stun, "love"?)

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
AND ..................... a bump bump here and a bump bump there, here a bump there a bump everywhere a bump bump

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
<hug Crandell>

This is about the third topic I've seen in the past month or two. They can't realistically ignore theurgists forever.

/bump =p

 

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XBlackheart 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
What's a theurgist?

Is it anything like the mythical spiritmaster?

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
No comments or suggestions on my recent proposals?

/bump

 

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Percilus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
You think anyone will actually read this thread at mythic..I hope so

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
The chants idea is great, as buffs for 30 second pets wouldn't work so well, but...

Not sure about other servers, but there's quite a lack of runspeed on mine, and when we get to wherever we're going, I'm requested to turn on pbt. If Mythic did implement more chants, it would be even more difficult to juggle them, and it would probably be very difficult to keep up on power if we had to attempt to twist castable spells. (This would not address Albion's current lack of decent pbt, either, as most are already secondary pbt casters, and would probably go for the spells that improve their chances for killspam over the spells that have a possibility of helping their realm.) Also, most chants have around the same range, and if you're casting a pet, you'll probably be out of that range already.

I'm more in favor of giving theurgists more utitlity and damage, instead of making pets more powerful. It's currently one of the leading complaints against us. Understandably having better nukes may not go over well either, but a person's common complaint with pets is that they:

A) Chainstun while the theurgist nukes them to death. <sigh> Really wish they'd remember that Mythic did address that, aka nerf, and that a theurgist can only cast as many pets as they have power for, before someone realizes what's going on and nukes/hacks-to-pieces said caster. At the current power cost, it's *maybe* 8-ish? (Rough estimate, as I don't do it often.) And on top of that, if they'd run when they saw the whirl around them indicating air pets were coming, this wouldn't even be an issue. I know I sure as heck run if I see an elf or keen with glowing spells on his/her hands.

B) If you send enough pets at someone currently, they die. (Probably far from the truth, but if a person was just rezzed, and unbuffed, and didn't have runspeed of any kind, and didn't see a massive army of elementals headed their way, and didn't move... it's possible.)

Also, I seriously doubt the ideas to air pets would fly at all in MythicLand. You're asking for the pets to run faster (so they can't be outrun), and to swing faster (so they have more chances to stun). Afraid the public outcry on this one would nerf theurgists into nonexistance, even worse than we are now.

I remain favorable to the ideas that give earth a gtae, or possibly a nuke of its own, lower the power costs on ice nukes to be equivalent with those of their air brethren, cause the ice pets to be resisted less often, give air 1500 mez, tune down the power costs of pbt, make siege bolt worth its weight in points or drop the points on it, give single-target stun to air, give a cold or spirit resist debuff in the earth line, change around the way ice nukes work so they don't negate AE root, give ae friction to earth (even though it sounded like sarcasm in the post more than anything, it's still an idea), etc, etc. So many ideas have been put forth so far, without a peep from anyone in charge. It's terrible.

And I really hope Mythic does read this, as it's Julie's job to do so, and currently all she's been doing is reading the easy posts and passing on the ideas.

edit: typing is teh suq.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Hyperion191 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
an earthquake, AE DD, could be fun in earth line

ice could use improved pets (LOS)

air could use a 1500 ranged AE mez

our (laughable) class RA should be less than 10 pts : on my server, i never seen a theurg using it (i still dont know what it looks like !)

 

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Shadowmage 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
The TL is trying to get or damage add and attack speed bufs when cast on us transfer to the pets. They can do it just like they do stat tranfers for Necros.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Having the damage add and haste transfer to pets would be good, but it would help all the specs equally (well, no completely equally since the wind pets are the shortest lived). The fact is that earth and ice need some special loving.

Wind just needs the mez range upped to 1500 like everyone else, or at least a real explanation from Mythic as to why, after 15 months of asking for the mez range to be upped, they feel it is overpowered to grant that.

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"This is about the third topic I've seen in the past month or two. They can't realistically ignore theurgists forever."

*looks at 1.63a* Or can they?

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
buffing pets I see as kinda pointless, they are very short lived and easy to run away from, and have no hit points. More pets would be a good idea, A pet RA would be something nice, a damage spell in the Earth line would be nice, lowering the power for PBT and Pets would be nice, PBT on Insta cast timer would be nice, making wind mez range 1500 would be nice, Giving us two spec points would be nice, but I really want to see mythic come up with their own crazy idea, I mean they are the ones responisble for the slight pbt nerf to our class./

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Good evening Camelot. On tonight's ajenda: Bump!


Mythic tends to do huge patches with massive impacts, and then one or two "fluff" and "fix" patches to see the repurcussions of the previous patches, and then returns to the balance and such. I don't really forsee theurg love in 1.63, but maybe 1.64. (And yeah, I know how much that thought sucks.)

My hope is that when they return to hib, and maybe mid, they'll remember us, finally. I mean hell, they didn't give us love in "Alb Love Patch", maybe they've forgotten they didn't put us in hib or mid instead. wink

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Good to see you posting up there John (Temulence in game, right?). Yes, I was there last time we went through this begging process also. I wound up quitting for a couple of months after it, but a few things not having to do with my theurgist brought me back. SI was a big one, it allowed me to pl my wizard from 30 to 40 and get a better class out to RVR.

I won't be quitting this time, but there will be many theurgists who will. What other evidence do you need Mythic? Why won't you help us?

 

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Smit_Whack 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Just merge Earth Theurgist and Earth Wizard

From an Earth Theurgist point of view, this will solve that line's problems.

spec Bolt
spec DoT
spec AE Root
spec GTAoE
spec PBT

Leave only Fire and Ice Wizards.

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Or merge 'em all back together, and have these lines in the wizard class:

Ice
Air
Fire
Earth

Woah, the four elements.. isn't that, like, what wizards of stories used anyway? Nah, sheer coincidence. They'd be CAPTAIN PLANET!!!!!!!

*cough* Erm, excuse me.

 

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quyesial 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Merging theurgs and wizzies into an elementalist class would be good. Remove the theurg travel chant and give it to the spirit cabbie spec. Give the wiz damage shield and earth wiz AE snare to one of the underused necro specs.

Move the GTAE, DOT and spec bolt to the earth theurg and that class is good. Move the AE root and snare+dd to the ice wiz line, dump the dd+debuff and that class is good. Move the ice elemental to the fire line, and that spec is good. Up the mez range on wind, move the haste debuff from earth to wind (it is wind/spirit based anyway) and that spec is good.

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Bah! The main reason I rolled a theurg instead of a wizard, in the very very very beginning, was runspeed. =p

 

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Warlade 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Incase some of you don't know, in the begging (early beta) Theurgist and Wizards were one class (Wizard) . Mythic decided that having so many abilitys in one class was overpowering and thus the Theurgist was born. Looking back on that now, it all makes sense to me, how can your class be good when its simply an afterthought of another class lol.

 

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{old}Jaavon 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
iirc the smite cleric stun is a baseline smite spell ... meaning all clerics have it.

besides the point though. a stun or aoe stun would be a great addition to theurgists and to albion in general.

/sigh.

/bump.

 

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Xxtayce 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Yeah, theurgists were the overpowered abilities of a wizard, taken out of the wizard, left with a gimp class.

And yes, smite is baseline, but as very few clerics spec smite, it's less effective. With the few number of theurgists we have today, and the massive underpopulation of real clerics (read: not bots, but played characters) in Albion, I doubt it'd be overpowering either.

 

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Karios 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
i didnt read through all 7 pages, but i have played an earth theurg a wind theurg and a tri-spec theurg, the only viable spec has been wind, plz fix earth theurgs

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump
agreed on granting theurgist stun spell

 

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Unpluged3 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Too many pages back, no one will see this anyway. But theurgs do need love.

 

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_Arandal_ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Nope... the essay is too long for the TA's at Mythic to read. So the only thing left to do is ...

KEEP IT BUMPED

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Anyone that knows my char and me knows that i'm a earth theurg to heart and never plan to respec out of it, I enjoy being support but we do need serious help still. BUMP

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Late Sunday pre-Mythic reading bump.

 

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{old}Deathtoll2 
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Bumpity bump bump, bumpity bump bump, look at where it goes...

 

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Kaolla_Nut 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Earth thuergs need fixing, please fix this broken line.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
yet another BUMPer
earth needs help by granting offensive spell or another utility (DD or AE DD, GTAOE...)
ice line needs help too
wind mezz range is supposed to be 1500

and again we need to have stun

 

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oxedus 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
BUMPalicous to the class billed as siege master. This class needs tremendous help. So cast that PBT (Pulsing Bump Turn)until Mythic listens.

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"They can't realistically ignore theurgists forever."

You want to bet? The earth theurgist line has been broken forever and no one and Mythic has ever even noticed it.

This will show you how bad off the earth theurgist line is. Here are the PBT lines for the two directly-comparable cloth-caster PBT classes in the game:

Runemaster Suppression spec line: Direct Damage/Snare, AE Direct Damage/Snare, Confusion, Nearsight, Bladeturn

Theurgist Earth spec line: Summon Ally, Lower Attack Speed Shout (worthless), and Bladeturn

Runemasters rule and theurgists suck, and the above explains why.

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
back to top always on top you should be YES

 

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GoldManiac 
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Remember us!!

 

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Crandell 
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Bump

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump if you like it

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Runemaster Suppression spec line: Direct Damage/Snare, AE Direct Damage/Snare, Confusion, Nearsight, Bladeturn

Theurgist Earth spec line: Summon Ally, Lower Attack Speed Shout (worthless), and Bladeturn

Runemasters rule and theurgists suck, and the above explains why. "


That doesn't fully explain why.

A better way to put it is that Suppression Ruinmasters (and Wardens) have a valid purpose in RvR regardless of PBT, where Earth Theurgists do not (unless you count Friction on opponents, think of all the slow you can cause).

 

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ShivasRegal 
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BUMP....

 

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_Arandal_ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
ya. wow.

the Increase in DPS (Damage per SWAT) you can give your opponents by using SLOW is just amazing.

which side is the theurgist on anyway?

 

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Crandell 
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Personally I enjoy making the monsters and enemy hit harder, it just allows them to kill me quicker, mythic explain this one to me please? and while you are at it, GIVE US LOVE

 

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AquaBlaze 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Incase some of you don't know, in the begging (early beta) Theurgist and Wizards were one class (Wizard) . Mythic decided that having so many abilitys in one class was overpowering and thus the Theurgist was born."

No...I think that's how Runemasters & Wardens were made. ^_^

 

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{old}wHo_yO_dAddY 
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Theurgists are some of the most powerful casters in the game imo. My theurg is 47+15 wind and 26 earth. He usually nukes for 400 - 500+(with mom2) and criting for 200 - 300 sometimes(with wp3), nuking for every 2 seconds(with moa). I'm always fully buffed also. I've nuked ppl for 900+ dmg before(including crit) and without power relics. I couldn't be happier with the power of the theurg. This class is perfect the way it is imo, why would anyone choose earth over wind? only god knows why. PBT is good to have, but don't over do it. 10 seconds is enough, dump the rest into wind and you'd have a pretty powerful caster.

 

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{old}AlbinoSqrl 
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People would like 3 viable spec lines, not 1.

Give those poor Theurgists some love!

 

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ShivasRegal 
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bump from an earth theurgy

 

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_Arandal_ 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
page two
just won't do


<neither will inaction, but that's a different matter>

DAOC is in need of a new EARTHDAY
happy

edit: bah, wrong tense

 

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Pritcon 
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Theurgists are SO bad, Other realms don't even have the Earth,Ice,Air Elementals on their wish lists......

"Albion gets so many more abilities...WHY?"

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=52009374&replies=11

 

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{old}Jaavon 
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...

bump

...




nothing more to see here. move along.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Tuesday, let's see some theurgist love in 1.63b bump.

 

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Crandell 
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bump to the top


 

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oxedus 
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so i wonder how long would this thread last...

BUMPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

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GoldManiac 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Until we get to 1400 postes, mods lock it, and we get a mention of "upcoming boosts" in the grab bag.

 

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Xxtayce 
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"Theurgists are some of the most powerful casters in the game imo. My theurg is 47+15 wind and 26 earth. He usually nukes for 400 - 500+(with mom2) and criting for 200 - 300 sometimes(with wp3), nuking for every 2 seconds(with moa). I'm always fully buffed also. I've nuked ppl for 900+ dmg before(including crit) and without power relics. I couldn't be happier with the power of the theurg. This class is perfect the way it is imo, why would anyone choose earth over wind? only god knows why. PBT is good to have, but don't over do it. 10 seconds is enough, dump the rest into wind and you'd have a pretty powerful caster."

Theurgists of the Earth spec do not WANT to be powerful nukers. If that was their intent, they would have been wizards. How is this fine? Our job is protection and support, not to be "a pretty powerful caster".

/bump

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump

I am a earth theurg, I would like the ability to at least attack someone so that they don't destroy me in two hits, being able to survive is a big issue with most casters, but theurgs with me 800 hit points its a joke.

 

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{old}fludane 
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here is another bumper
i don't know why i keep crying for this but: it is nice if theurgist have stun.

 

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KnumbKnuts 
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my thuerg is now my dragon raid bot...

he got wtfpwned the last time, too

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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bumpo

 

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{old}jakedomino 
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It's 6/17 and theurgists still suck.

 

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Crandell 
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bump

 

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hastemerlin 
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OMG

This has to be the worst caster toon I have ever played. I tried all 3 flavors with /level and all I can say is OMG. I can not even imagine the dissatisfaction a level 50 player would feel.

Help these guys out

 

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Crandell 
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bump

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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"This has to be the worst caster toon I have ever played. I tried all 3 flavors with /level and all I can say is OMG. I can not even imagine the dissatisfaction a level 50 player would feel."

Damn, Hastemerlin, that's a lot of casters in your .sig.
50 Void-eldi/igraine/Dei/retired
50 Light-chanter/merlin/Haste/retired
50 Mana-chanter/igraine/Tosa/simi-retired

Air spec is pretty decent. It would be better if the AoE mez was at the same range (1500) as everyone else's; but it's still pretty good to RvR with.

You're right about the other 2. Ice is more useless than earth. Both specs are awful RvR.

 

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{old}Jaavon 
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i beg to differ.

ice has a castable spell. that means you can't play your character better while afk than you can while at the keyboard. that means earth is still the winner for this years 't3h suck' award.

 

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Orwyn 
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Whine more. You didn't mention though the single unique ability Theurgs got over any other caster or pet mage in any realm: you can set pets on just about everyone and unless they got at least some defensive skills all they can do is run. That's 12% of your mana bar completely negating Mr. Enemy Caster's ability to contribute anything useful. If that's not powerful enough, well...

 

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Crandell 
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Yeah your right, we can cast pets at 12% of our power also while running pbt, that means you should get off maybe 12 pets maybe a little more or less depending on many issues but after you cast one pet you are target number one for easy and fast RPs, any caster can now nuke kill us in two hits, any tank can easily get rid of us in two hits. So by casting a pet we are just painting a BIG YELLOW HIT ME sign on our freakin face and thats that. Oh and pets don't even hit for much and also it takes them forever to even interrupt the caster, that caster is going to at least get off 2 nukes before he even feels the pet on him, thats also if we aren't already dead by many other means.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Well Orwyn, I can kill yelllow casters with less 12% of my power as my wizard, so yes 12% power to "distract" a caster is horrible. Masters of siege we are not. The only time theurgists are good at anything is 1 on 1 battles.

 

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Demonic_Apparition 
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bump

 

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{old}Procifica 
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Please explain how anyone will let a theurgist spam pets continously without doing SOMETHING to them to make them stop?

Simple solution to those pets: kill them. Its not hard.

Theurgists need more spells.

/bump

Mythic: Listen to your player base for a change. It might help your $$$$.

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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"Whine more. You didn't mention though the single unique ability Theurgs got over any other caster or pet mage in any realm: you can set pets on just about everyone and unless they got at least some defensive skills all they can do is run. That's 12% of your mana bar completely negating Mr. Enemy Caster's ability to contribute anything useful. If that's not powerful enough, well... "

Yeah. If it lasted 2 mins instead of the 20 seconds that a pet lasts, they'd call it Nearsight and give it a 2 sec cast time.

We can't have that.

 

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{old}Jaavon 
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first page pls.

does anyone know why theurgists are the only class that I am yet to see an 'official thread' for?

 

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{old}fludane 
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i wonder if earth and ice got some fixes, would mythic grant respec?

 

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GoldManiac 
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I'm getting tired of this. Maybe I should just delete my theurgist so I don't even have to think about it any more. Of course the next day the patch would come out that gives theurgists a dozen new spells.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bumpadelic
fludane cast slevel 26 pulsing bumping turn
fludane casts might earth shout, "FIX THEURGIST!"

 

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oxedus 
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while i have the time
why not as well contribute to more bumpings

theurgist ice line might as well get a unique spell.....

oh well keep dreaming

 

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Gilimyr 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
How's this for a useless statistic?

Theurgists: last in realm point gains among all cloth casters for over a year

Necros seem to be lower since SI was introduced, but my guess is that's because most L50 necros are primarily used as PvE powerleveling toons for wannabe d00dfiltrators.

 

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Orwyn 
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Crandell, I can't count the number of classes who say they are No 1 target in RvR if they do anything to show their class (or often by their looks already). You are a cloth caster, and yes people will try to prevent you from casting. They will also go for the Cleric, the Sorcerer and others... Anything new there?

Goldmaniac, it is definitely a difference if your character (without any pet) is occupied with interrupting an enemy character or if it's one of so many pets in a fire&forget manner... Pets also are how Theurgist kill their enemies, if you want the Wizard style spamming the better DD versions, play Wizard? If it was anything lower than 12% power, imagine the number of pets a Theurgist could pump out... scary.

Fire&forget pets are just limited by power cost. Of course I expect Theurgist players to demand it to be cheaper... just how I expect Animists to want more mushrooms at once. Hopefully not going to happen anytime soon though.

 

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Big_Twinky 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
/bump for some long overdue theurgist love.

 

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veleuk 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
"Fire&forget pets are just limited by power cost."

False. They're limited by time and by distance from the person you are attacking. VERY commonly I've casted pets upon someone and all they do is sprint and my "Fire & Forget" pets do absolutely......nothing.

How would every other caster like it if their DDs did less damage if they took one step backwards?

 

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Orwyn 
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"and all they do is sprint and my "Fire & Forget" pets do absolutely......nothing"

Like I said in an earlier post, your pet has actually done something... it made someone sprint instead of contributing anything useful. I consider making people run for their life quite powerful. Sure, a group can help the poor healer with pets on him, yet this will occupy more characters than it took to create the menace - one Theurgist.

 

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GoldManiac 
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Why don't I just use my level 1 nuke then? Maybe I can distract them by making them laught at getting hit by 3(-2) damage.

 

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Goryion 
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Lol I love how the "Theurgs are fine" crowd always uses the "You interupt casters" as our defining feature.

Uhm, if that's my feature, fine, but there ain't NO WAY it should cost 12% of my power to inturupt a caster for 10 seconds, when said caster can use 12% of his mana and KILL me in 10 seconds.

Now think about the whining and crying that would start if EVERY caster had to empty their mana bar to kill a single opponent. Or if every tank had to empty thier End bar (well with regen it's kinda moot) to kill a single enemy (caster or tank.)

If Theurgs are going to be utility, fine, but having 2 viable spells, isn't much of a class.

Gor

 

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JohnM81 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Hey guys....


Just checking in again to see if I will be reactivating my account. From the looks of it I wont sad .

Well Ill be stoping in later to see if we have got any love.

Owyn? Please tell me you are a old player that made a new VN account. That way your words can have some small bit of validity.

IF you arent please shut the hell up and take your 14 post self out of here and dont come back till you are a bit older.


 

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GoldManiac 
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At least I can use my theurgist to farm cash for the upcoming housing. That and him being a spellcraft bot.

 

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Orwyn 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Thanks for inviting me to join, I guess you reached your post count by backing off at a post number of 10 too. Btw. I'm playing in Europe and have just recently noticed these boards.

Anyway, I'm all for filled spec lines and less of cookie-cutter-spec classes. And the Ice line looks all attractive to me. But plz don't try to suggest you can't kill anyone 1 on 1. And on top of that, you can choose to split up your damage to keep multiple opponents busy for much longer than just the casting time of a single spell. That's more than most other classes can do.

 

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Azhrarn_Alb 
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"Like I said in an earlier post, your pet has actually done something... it made someone sprint instead of contributing anything useful. I consider making people run for their life quite powerful. Sure, a group can help the poor healer with pets on him, yet this will occupy more characters than it took to create the menace - one Theurgist. "

A couple of problems with that statement.

Based upon the 'healer' comment above, I assume that you're a midgard player. At speed 6, it takes a Savage about 2 seconds to find and kill the theurgist. When the theurgist dies, the elementals die.

If the theurgist was Air instead of Earth and had spent the 12 seconds nuking with an air DD instead of stacking earth pets the healer would probably be dead instead of 'irritated because he can't cast anything but instas'. OMG fear the power of the interrupt. Maybe the earth theurgist will cast Friction on the enemy tanks as well so they hit harder?


If you've been in the theurgist's shoes playing against Hibernia; StT sends all your elementals back to the caster. The only person they'll be menacing is the theurgist if they cast more than one pet vs Hibernia. The theurgist doesn't have the luxury of a stun to act as CC on the elemental that comes back to them.


Earth / Ice and Ice / Earth Theurgists have huge power problems. Say you've been given the luxury of 10-12 uninterrupted seconds cast 4 earth elementals, then you're at about 60% power. Worse, if you're using 6 sec PBT, your high power cost ice baseline nuke with huge variance (at about 8-10% of your mana per nuke) won't really let you kill anyone - l. You'll be out of power and unable to do anything but sprint (sound familiar?).

Ice elementals are completely worthless. They can never seem to find LoS. When they do find LoS and don't move to interrupt their own slow cast, the DD that they hit with isn't even worth it - like the level 18 specline ice nuke (<100 dmg). Sometimes they go into 'melee mode' and hit like a marshmellow.


It's ok, though. Continue to try to convince people that earth and ice spec theurgists are 'just fine'. Eventually there will be no more non-bot earth and ice theurgists.

Since earth and ice theurgists are gimp anyways, you'll essentially be doing Albion a favor. Once more players lose hope that their earth or ice theurgist will ever be of any use RvR, they'll be respeccing Air or rerolling as body Sorc's. And you and your realmmates keep wondering why Albion has so many hard hitting DD nukers.

Since you think that earth and ice theurgists are 'just fine as they are', I'd welcome you to try /levelling up an earth/ice theurgist on Albion Lancelot. Send me a /tell ingame and I'll even set you up with some gold and equipment.

 

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{old}fludane 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
my average life expectancy in RVR after casting 3-4 pets in most cases is 4 seconds.

 

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ShivasRegal 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
bump for theurgy love

 

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Crandell 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Does anyone else have a valid agruement that theurgs are fine, I would love to hear something other then "YOU HAVE PETS"

 

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Orwyn 
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Subject: Theurgists: They need some loving..
Actually I