Author Topic: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
All the news stories are about old people getting laid off and how awful that is, but in truth what's going to be much more damaging in the long term is the reduced opportunities for people coming into the job system.

The tendency of companies to hunker down in recessions and keep on their existing staff and not hire anyone new is admirable in some ways but in others it is really destructive.

Japan is a good example of what happens in the long term. There are a whole generation of Japanese people now making int into their mid 30s who couldn't get real jobs because they went into the job force right around when the bubble burst. My wife's older sister's husband is 42 and he is still the most junior member of his division at a big Japanese manufacturer he has worked for for the last 18 years. They have not hired a single new worker in 18 years. This is going to have massive consequences in the next 4-5 years because there is going to be a huge national shortage of qualified people to fill management positions since there's a 10-15 year gap where very little hiring was occuring.

Things won't be quite as bad in America because the labor market isn't as rigid. But right now there are millions of young people who are graduating from high school or college with no good job prospects. If things don't improve soon we're going to have a lost generation of our own and it's going to be more costly here than it was in Japan because in Japan at least the parents of the lost generation are well off and have massive savings.

 

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the_great_intex 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
It is the truth. My generation is going to be one with lots of degrees but no jobs and experience. Granted, I can see how many stupid people there are shooting out of college these days with my own eyes so I can't completely blame a bad economy for everything.

In a bad economy no one wants entry level people you have to train. Job descriptions these days are specific on who they want, and that's those with experience to back up their "knowledge"

I told my brother it's not the degree that makes a difference, build a portfolio. No one wants to hire someone who sits around all day watching cartoons hoping to get a job so he can "finally do something." People want to hire people who want to "do something" so bad that they do it in their free time, for free to use as a testament that they can do what they say they can do.

In summary, my generation is unfortunately going to be lost in the job market but a lot of it has to do with how many self-entitled lazy douchebags that are also in my generation

 

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Bowlartz 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment


While the job market is far from "prime" I think there is a bit of a disconnect at least here in America. Students are graduating with significant debt (by their own choice) and finding entry level positions starting at 34-40K and saying "No way I can live on that". They don't think through the process that often they end up moving up quickly as the aging are replaced with...them. After 3-5 years they are making 60K+.

I work for a very large company that is almost exclusively hiring recent college grads as they prefer the "cradle to grave" type employee. They are started out on crappy salaries but will quickly move up if they prove they are worth it. Quite a few are proving they are worth it.

There is plenty of good work out there if you narrow your field choices. Information Technology work might not be exciting but it damn well pays the bills and there is plenty of work to be had. Perhaps if they skipped the studies that no one wants or needs they might find stability and ultimately a good lifestyle, maybe not in their dream field but you can't have it all.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Bowlartz posted:
I think there is a bit of a disconnect at least here in America. Students are graduating with significant debt (by their own choice) and finding entry level positions starting at 34-40K and saying "No way I can live on that".


I think there is a disconnect and you are showing it. Most graduates would love to have a bunch of jobs available to them making 35-40k.

 

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Elocism 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
snotty punk kids are not willing to work for those 'low wages'

especially not since Obamatard has forced insurance companies to keep them on their parents tit until they are 26 or whatever

 

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NuEM 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
That's because they want 20 year olds with 10 years of experience in the job.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yes, because the reason young people want to work is so they can get health care.

plain

 

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bstulic 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Capitalism in unsustainable

 

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Elocism 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
Yes, because the reason young people want to work is so they can get health care.

plain


apparently you would be surprised

just wait until no one needs to work to get health insurance

 

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Sin_of_Onin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Elocism posted:
Yukishiro1 posted:
Yes, because the reason young people want to work is so they can get health care.

plain


apparently you would be surprised

just wait until no one needs to work to get health insurance


You do realize that other countries already do more than this.

Employment is largely based on opportunity, not whether or not there is UHC.

 

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Elocism 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
you underestimate the entitlement mindset of the retarded American tv watching zombies

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
"The problem isn't a lack of good jobs for young people, the problem is young people are spoiled entitled brats!" is hardly a novel theory. It's never been right in the past in terms of explaining macroeconomic activity and it's unlikely to be true in the future.

Something like 85% of college grads these days are back living with their parents, compared to about 50% before the economic downturn. There was not some day 20 years ago where everyone born after was 30% more likely to be an entitled brat.

 

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theredkay1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Bowlartz posted:

There is plenty of good work out there if you narrow your field choices.


There is not enough work (good or bad) for all the people who want to work. The country just doesnt have a massive backlog of job openings.

My own experience the last 6 months really contradicts the notion that kids are turning down jobs. We have hired 7 people, the majority are recent college grads, for a new division that might not exist in a year. These people are told up front that their job may be temporary and if it does continue may not be in Houston. The resumes fly in.

 

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Elocism 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
Something like 85% of college grads these days are back living with their parents, compared to about 50% before the economic downturn.


Elocism posted:
especially not since Obamatard has forced insurance companies to keep them on their parents tit until they are 26 or whatever


i know right

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yes, clearly it was Obamacare in 2010, not a huge global recession in 2008.

plain

 

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GrilledCheez 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
same problem different angle. We never should have opened the flood gates of free trade without answering a lot of questions. Even if our economy was smoking there are still ethical/worker rights questions that need answered.

Where would our labor movement have been if there were crushing external forces putting pressure on it to continue to grow inorganically?

genie's out though. All we can do is keep driving.

 

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ZigmundZag 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Right. Because living with mom and dad is so much fun when you're 25 it's totally worth it for that free birth control!

 

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GrilledCheez 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
You will never make liberals think welfare is bad. I am a liberal and I talk to them all the time. I have semi regular discourse with people you have heard of, and I can assure you that to them the monied interests are always screwing everyone over so anything you can take back and hand out is a win.

 

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Brother_Tempus 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
High youth unemployment should be expected in countries that use fiat currency and are heavily in debt

The payment for high debt is laid on the shoulders of future generations to deal with, this debt was started 4 decades ago....

Now those future generations are here, paying the price of the debt created by their parents and grandparents

once their suffering balances the debt on the books .. Things will get better

Sadly we are nowhere close to that point yet

 

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Sin_of_Onin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Elocism posted:
you underestimate the entitlement mindset of the retarded American tv watching zombies


Which has little to do with health care. Especially with young people.

 

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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment


Plenty of jobs here in the North East and Mid-Atlantic.

Folks might prefer to live in the South West, Cali and the like but if there are no job there...move.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Uh huh. Plenty of jobs.

plain

 

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the_great_intex 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
I couldn't find a job in the mid Atlantic, so I moved to Cali cool

 

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Phlegm573 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Part of the problem is, even when a company does decide to hire, they only hire people who are a) already employed with b) 5+ years of experience.

This pretty much rules out anyone in their early-mid 20s unless they have connections.

It's a dysfunctional corporate belief system. They could easily get entry-level people on pennies to the dollar compared to how much it costs to headhunt & poach experienced workers from other firms. If the entry-level cannonfodder don't work out, they are much easier to get rid of. And, if they do work out, the firms can mold them into whatever they want.

Of course, firms are too shortsighted and calcified in their ways, and the highest unemployment rate for every country is always people under 30.

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
So, are you hiring these people yourself Yuki? Are you traveling to Japan to meet with corporate headquarters to show them the error of their ways? How about corporations here in the US? You told me that the standard for having a valid beef on a message board is whether or not you're actually doing something yourself directly to benefit those on whose behalf you're complaining.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Holy butthurt, Batman. laugh

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
Holy butthurt, Batman. laugh


So you're not doing anything. I'm sad to hear that. I actually think your beef is valid but, if we are to apply your standard for having a valid beef, it cannot legitimately be so... sorry bro.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
My disgust had to do with your stringing some poor guy who's already suffered up on the cross to suffer some more for your pet cause which has little to do with him, even though you don't give a crap about him personally at all. I never said you couldn't express your opinion on a message board. grin

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
My disgust had to do with your stringing some poor guy who's already suffered up on the cross to suffer some more for your pet cause which has little to do with him, even though you don't give a crap about him personally at all. I never said you couldn't express your opinion on a message board. grin


Now... we both know better Yuki. Your posts were an attempt to discredit me because you see my position in that thread as an indictment of the system of which you are a part. But that's really neither here nor there as it pertains to this thread.

I just want to know what you're DOING for these folks yourself and whether or not you still want to stand on that as the acid test for whether a person has a valid beef or not.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
I'm sorry if you really got that butthurt from my comments in the other thread.

Maybe next time rather than nancy gracing it up and flogging the bones of some poor guy while gleefully talking about how he has zero chance of having a decent life, you could just say what you think instead. That way you wouldn't end up butthurt when someone calls you on your vampirism.

How any of this relates to this thread about youth unemployment I don't know.

 

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Abaddon_Ambrosius 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
@ The first two posts, by Yuki and Intex: I agree with you.

I'm not sure what that means when I agree with both of you, in the same thread, at the same time, but there you go.

Don't be surprised if I later chalk it up to a stroke I don't yet realize I had.

 

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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
There are many factors that contribute to all these job market problems. Until people are willing to bbq a few sacred cows it won't change.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Sacred cows like lower taxes for capital gains than working income? mischief

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
How any of this relates to this thread about youth unemployment I don't know.


Well Yuki, you are doing exactly what you accused me of doing - bitching about something you're unwilling to actually DO something about. That's how it relates. I'm sorry if you don't think you should have to follow the standards you propose for others, but that's how it goes.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
I didn't say you couldn't bitch about something without doing anything about it. I said it was kinda gross to wallow in some guy's misfortune to make an ideological point when you clearly don't actually care about him as evidenced by the fact you are not going to actually do anything. grin

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
I didn't say you couldn't bitch about something without doing anything about it. I said it was kinda gross to wallow in some guy's misfortune to make an ideological point when you clearly don't actually care about him as evidenced by the fact you are not going to actually do anything. grin


Really? Hmm...

Yukishiro1 posted:
I'm sad but not surprised that we've established you're going to do nothing about this situation at all besides use it as a prop for your whining on an internet messageboard.



So... I'll ask again:

What are you DOING about this issue yourself Yuki? It's kind of gross that you're wallowing in these folks' misfortune to make some ideological point when you clearly don't actually care about them as evidenced by by the fact that you are not going to actually do anything.

 

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Groucho48 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
There was a similar trend going on where I worked. They hired virtually no full time workers after around 2000. All part-timers. It was pretty stupid, actually. Yes, they saved a bit on benefits, but, there was constant turn over as the part timers would leave as soon as they got a full time job somewhere else. When I left there were people who had been there 15+ years and people who had been there 3 years or less and not many in between.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Cawlin posted:
What are you DOING about this issue yourself Yuki? It's kind of gross that you're wallowing in these folks' misfortune to make some ideological point when you clearly don't actually care about them as evidenced by by the fact that you are not going to actually do anything.


This is becoming embarassing to watch. How am I wallowing in anything? If anything the post was about the macroeconomic effects of not hiring youth 20 years down the road, not about crying crocodile tears for the kids who don't have jobs.

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Yukishiro1 posted:
Cawlin posted:
What are you DOING about this issue yourself Yuki? It's kind of gross that you're wallowing in these folks' misfortune to make some ideological point when you clearly don't actually care about them as evidenced by by the fact that you are not going to actually do anything.


This is becoming embarassing to watch. How am I wallowing in anything? If anything the post was about the macroeconomic effects of not hiring youth 20 years down the road, not about crying crocodile tears for the kids who don't have jobs.




I agree. It must be very embarrassing for you to have the inanity of your own statements thrown back in your face.


 

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Subject: First world economies are shooting themselves in the foot re: youth unemployment
Ok, Chief.

 

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