Author Topic: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Koneg 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB_htqDCP-s laugh laugh

 

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tenkly 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
applause

 

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Koneg 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGuXCuDb1U animated version applause

 

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IMHO 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
It's impressive how Atheists have such strong faith.

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Koneg posted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGuXCuDb1U animated version applause


That was truly brilliant..

Had a similar discussion with a acquaintance that flat out told me that there are ghosts and energies everywhere. Was fun, I ended up being a dick and she ended up being a moron.. she still likes me grin

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
It's impressive how Atheists have such strong faith.



All of that was common knowledge backed up by science, I know slightly complicated things scares you but we're okay with you thinking that it's all magic and that a wizard did it. happy

 

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Coriolus 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Where'd ya dig that up? applause

 

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Sansfear 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Notice how many of these complete airheads are attractive? Their entire lives they've been lied to by guys who would rather sleep with them than correct their fantasies.

 

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IMHO 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:
It's impressive how Atheists have such strong faith.



All of that was common knowledge backed up by science, I know slightly complicated things scares you but we're okay with you thinking that it's all magic and that a wizard did it. happy


My reasoning is logical an science based. You are just to caught up in your own beliefs to even consider anything other than what is your biased opinions. batting

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:
It's impressive how Atheists have such strong faith.



All of that was common knowledge backed up by science, I know slightly complicated things scares you but we're okay with you thinking that it's all magic and that a wizard did it. happy


My reasoning is logical an science based. You are just to caught up in your own beliefs to even consider anything other than what is your biased opinions. batting


All I need is some proof you seem so sure provide me with some of your logical and proper scientific proof and I will accept it.

That should not be to hard I mean you seem so caught up in your belief so you must be sitting on some really convincing evidence. happy

 

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IMHO 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
All I need is some proof you seem so sure provide me with some of your logical and proper scientific proof and I will accept it.

That should not be to hard I mean you seem so caught up in your belief so you must be sitting on some really convincing evidence. happy



Some? laugh

Your mind is crystallized. I'd have more luck tricking you into having sex with Reese than you gaining knowledge in this arena.

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
All I need is some proof you seem so sure provide me with some of your logical and proper scientific proof and I will accept it.

That should not be to hard I mean you seem so caught up in your belief so you must be sitting on some really convincing evidence. happy



Some? laugh

Your mind is crystallized. I'd have more luck tricking you into having sex with Reese than you gaining knowledge in this arena.


You're still not presenting me with any of this logical science based proof of yours.. I mean if it's based on proper science I will have to accept it, this is how my mind works. Observation and the scientific method, this is how I define reality.

Don't start with that tirade I've always said that I'm open to the idea of god or unicorns if just presented with proper evidence, and you claim you have proper evidence so just show it to me. happy

 

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Caoilin 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
i love tim minchin. i posted this on acf a while ago and they all scoffed and said it was bad. assholes. not_talking

 

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NuEM 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Koneg you bastard ive been holding back for months now waiting for just the right Coriolus thread and then you go like BAM in his face!

 

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IMHO 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
You're still not presenting me with any of this logical science based proof of yours.. I mean if it's based on proper science I will have to accept it, this is how my mind works. Observation and the scientific method, this is how I define reality.

Don't start with that tirade I've always said that I'm open to the idea of god or unicorns if just presented with proper evidence, and you claim you have proper evidence so just show it to me. happy


Proper science? See That's your out card.

I can present you with scientific facts but you will claim it is not "proper" science (what ever that means). You are totally no different than Fred Phelps, there is NOTHING I can show to change your mind. I know it's a hard concept for you to accept, but you mind has crystallized. As much as you think to the contrary, you have a closed mind.

 

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Coriolus 
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NuEM posted:
Koneg you bastard ive been holding back for months now waiting for just the right Coriolus thread and then you go like BAM in his face!


In my face? laugh

 

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IMHO 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Coriolus posted:
NuEM posted:
Koneg you bastard ive been holding back for months now waiting for just the right Coriolus thread and then you go like BAM in his face!


In my face? laugh


BAM!!! laugh

 

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Coriolus 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Coriolus posted:
NuEM posted:
Koneg you bastard ive been holding back for months now waiting for just the right Coriolus thread and then you go like BAM in his face!


In my face? laugh


BAM!!! laugh


Wham!

laugh



I dedicate this thread to all those affected by me.. applause

 

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IMHO 
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ROFL applause laugh

 

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Ptilk 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
I love that bit. I remember when Cao posted it on ACF, I was like "I love that bit, glad someone posted it". tongue

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
You're still not presenting me with any of this logical science based proof of yours.. I mean if it's based on proper science I will have to accept it, this is how my mind works. Observation and the scientific method, this is how I define reality.

Don't start with that tirade I've always said that I'm open to the idea of god or unicorns if just presented with proper evidence, and you claim you have proper evidence so just show it to me. happy


Proper science? See That's your out card.

I can present you with scientific facts but you will claim it is not "proper" science (what ever that means). You are totally no different than Fred Phelps, there is NOTHING I can show to change your mind. I know it's a hard concept for you to accept, but you mind has crystallized. As much as you think to the contrary, you have a closed mind.


You told me you had logical scientific proof now present it, and I can read it and make up my mind.. If you don't that just shows that you're a liar.

You don't know anything about me, I'm a lot more open minded then most Outposters I've told you numerous times that all I need is proof and evidence and I will believe.. The burden of proof is not on me I'm not the one who claims god exists or claims that there is magic, how much more open minded can I become? I've told you that I believe in knowledge, observation and science, calling me Phelps is just inaccurate Phelps could be shown that there is no god without a doubt and he'd still be a beliver. My thought process just does not work like that, if I'm shown proof of something and it's valid then I'll have to change my mind according to new facts, this is what open minded means.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
I can read it and make up my mind..


laugh You're a atheist laugh Your mind is made up all ready. All this "I have the mostest open mind in the WORLD", is just you lying to yourself. laugh You crack me up, Mammy. Why is the people that say they have an open mind, don't? laugh

 

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NuEM 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
I don't believe your "I am so religious" shtick. grin

 

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confused

 

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NuEM 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
I said

NuEM posted:
I don't believe your "I am so religious" shtick. grin

 

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tenkly 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
I can read it and make up my mind..


laugh You're a atheist laugh Your mind is made up all ready. All this "I have the mostest open mind in the WORLD", is just you lying to yourself. laugh You crack me up, Mammy. Why is the people that say they have an open mind, don't? laugh


What part of show him proof and he'll change his mind eludes you? Putting a bunch of laughing faces and telling him he's not open minded makes you look stupid. just sayin'

Durr god is real - imho

I'll believe it if you can prove it to me and I can see it, because I believe in what I can study and prove. - manny

LOLOL UR DUMB ATHEIST LOLOL CLOSED MINDED - imho

unhh what?

 

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Jorrdan 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Koneg posted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhGuXCuDb1U animated version applause


This is fantastic.

applause

 

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Eh.
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Sansfear 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
You can't prove that God exists (just like you can't prove that he doesn't exist).

What you CAN prove, however, is the impact that the belief in God has on many people.

I realize that, in and of it self, that doesn't prove the existence of God. An atheist might argue that the change was a result of the individual themselves (as it might be for someone who turns their life around for non-religious reasons).

But when someone has a 'born-again' experience specifically because of their belief in God and you see their personality transformed, it is a powerful argument for the existence of God.

I realize that these cases are not the majority. Most Christians grow up in Christian families and are 'born into' their religion. But if you've ever been to newly established churches, especially in other countries (or immigrant churches at home), you'd see a lot more of it.

Conversions like these are not typically the result of being 'struck by lightning'. They are the result of someone else who believes in God sharing their faith and being a living testimony of the impact of God in their life.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Sansfear posted:

But when someone has a 'born-again' experience specifically because of their belief in God and you see their personality transformed, it is a powerful argument for the existence of God.


That doesn't make any sense. Whenever anyone goes crazy and murders people because they think they're being possessed by the flying spaghetti monster is that a powerful argument against the existence of God?

 

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IMHO 
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Well reasoned Sansfear. applause

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Yukishiro1 posted:
Sansfear posted:

But when someone has a 'born-again' experience specifically because of their belief in God and you see their personality transformed, it is a powerful argument for the existence of God.


That doesn't make any sense. Whenever anyone goes crazy and murders people because they think they're being possessed by the flying spaghetti monster is that a powerful argument against the existence of God?




laugh Yuki.

 

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Coriolus 
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I love it when my girl yells 'Ohh god!' when we are engaged in slutlust ..that's my proof some form of god exists..

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
I can read it and make up my mind..


laugh You're a atheist laugh Your mind is made up all ready. All this "I have the mostest open mind in the WORLD", is just you lying to yourself. laugh You crack me up, Mammy. Why is the people that say they have an open mind, don't? laugh


Okay, so you can't actually provide me with any scientific data that proves that god exists?

I have an open mind, I happen to believe that there is no god. You said you had logical scientific proof that proves that there is a god.. If there is proof that would prove my assertions wrong then I would really much like to read it to change my mind according with reality, in the same way that I would very much like to know the proper way to use say multiplication or algebra.

This is called critical thinking IMHO.

Now present me with the scientific proof or forfeit the discussion to me.

 

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Manegarm 
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Sansfear posted:
You can't prove that God exists (just like you can't prove that he doesn't exist).

What you CAN prove, however, is the impact that the belief in God has on many people.

I realize that, in and of it self, that doesn't prove the existence of God. An atheist might argue that the change was a result of the individual themselves (as it might be for someone who turns their life around for non-religious reasons).

But when someone has a 'born-again' experience specifically because of their belief in God and you see their personality transformed, it is a powerful argument for the existence of God.




I don't have to prove that god does not exist. There is no proof for his existence; which is more then enough proof for me.

I mean except the proof that IMHO is sitting on which he won't divulge for some reason. grin

as for 'born-again', it's in no way a argument that there is a god.. It's proof of mental conditioning nothing else and it's not anything new.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
There is no proof for his existence


See.

There is no proof that you will accept of Gods existence. Period. Your whole world view is that he doesn't exist. It's a fool's game to try and show you proof. It would be like trying to prove to Fred Phelps that gays aren't evil. He has a his world view and there's no changing it. Just like you.

 

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Derasio 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
One of my fav comedians another excellent bit from him, starts slow but stick with it, NSFW.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lktd1OBHVI

 

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hmmmm
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
There is no proof for his existence


See.

There is no proof that you will accept of Gods existence. Period. Your whole world view is that he doesn't exist. It's a fool's game to try and show you proof. It would be like trying to prove to Fred Phelps that gays aren't evil. He has a his world view and there's no changing it. Just like you.


Are you seriously stupid? I wrote this one paragraph down.

"I mean except the proof that IMHO is sitting on which he won't divulge for some reason."

You haven't shown me any proof, you have not tried to reason with me.. I have pointed out time and time and again that I'm waiting tapping my foot to the revelation that will be brought forth by your evidence.

All you have done is gone "DERP DEPR U R MINDED CLOSED HERP PHELPS HERP" Like earlier posters pointed out.. You told me you had proof, and I told you that if you don't present it you're going to loose this discussion in walk over, the whole premise of our debate got to the point where you said you had proof and was willing to divulge and I said sure hit me, and then you just went on your usual retarded girlish tirade about how close minded I am.

I could not be any more emphatic, if there is proof of existing gods I will embrace it. Now either present it or just walk away like the looser you are.

 

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Sorry brother you're not worth it.

Matthew 7:6 (King James Version) posted:
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.


Maybe Someday when you mature and can handle a reasoned debate.

 

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IMHO posted:


Sorry brother you're not worth it.

Matthew 7:6 (King James Version) posted:
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.


Maybe Someday when you mature and can handle a reasoned debate.


Your admission of defeat is noted, very christian of you to scurry away with your tail between your legs. grin

 

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Manegarm posted:
cry


There is no defeat here and I'm not going anywhere. Some day when you want to really debate this we can talk. Right now your just a child crying because I won't throw you the ball.

 

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IMHO posted:
You're a big meanie! I'm not going to play anymore! But I did not loose!


Oh you can stay if you want to, you still lost.. You're not carrying any ball to throw, you've already run off the pitch, nice forfeit.

laugh

 

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Manegarm posted:




laugh

 

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It's nice to see that you've taken your defeat so well. happy

 

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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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No you can't IMHO, this is why it's so nice to see you're being so gracious about it. happy

 

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Manegarm posted:

shock

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
It's funny to see IMHO revert to his " you don't don't get it/ you don't care/ you're too closed minded" shtick every time there's a point he can't answer.


Typical religious moran


 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Sansfear posted:
You can't prove that God exists (just like you can't prove that he doesn't exist).

What you CAN prove, however, is the impact that the belief in God has on many people.

I realize that, in and of it self, that doesn't prove the existence of God. An atheist might argue that the change was a result of the individual themselves (as it might be for someone who turns their life around for non-religious reasons).

But when someone has a 'born-again' experience specifically because of their belief in God and you see their personality transformed, it is a powerful argument for the existence of God.

I realize that these cases are not the majority. Most Christians grow up in Christian families and are 'born into' their religion. But if you've ever been to newly established churches, especially in other countries (or immigrant churches at home), you'd see a lot more of it.

Conversions like these are not typically the result of being 'struck by lightning'. They are the result of someone else who believes in God sharing their faith and being a living testimony of the impact of God in their life.



born again though doesn't just apply to christians or the belief in the christian god, born again muslims/hindus/buddhists do the same things.

 

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tenkly posted:
It's funny to see IMHO revert to his " you don't don't get it/ you don't care/ you're too closed minded" shtick every time there's a point he can't answer.


Typical religious moran






RACIST ! ! !

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
I just read this thread for the first time and I don't know Manegarm or IMHO, but from what I have read, you lost this one IMHO.


You claimed there was scientific proof that God existed Manegarm asked you to divulge it and then you dodged. Him or you calling each other close minded and argle bargling each other is a way to deflect.



The simple fact is, you made a claim, he called you on it and then you dodged answering.





Case closed, court is adjourned until the next debate. Probably about the Trayvon Martin shooting lol.

 

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Hah, Mammogram, scientifically prove to me that George Washington was the first American president. Scientifically prove to me that anyone of your dead relatives loved you. Scientifically prove to me that Bach symphony's are superior to Mozart's. Etc.... or you can admit that science isn't the only way to show evidence for something to be true. There is historical proof as in Washington's case, testimony for your relatives love of you, etc.

PS Demon, he has many times before, but Mammogram doesn't like science that points to evidence of a creator. The creation of the universe itself from nothing, the universal constants of the universe that make the universe even possible, the language of DNA, the apparent design of the world, etc, etc.

 

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DemonicXH posted:
I just read this thread for the first time and I don't know Manegarm or IMHO, but from what I have read, you lost this one IMHO.


You claimed there was scientific proof that God existed Manegarm asked you to divulge it and then you dodged. Him or you calling each other close minded and argle bargling each other is a way to deflect.



The simple fact is, you made a claim, he called you on it and then you dodged answering.





Case closed, court is adjourned until the next debate. Probably about the Trayvon Martin shooting lol.


I can see how you may construed that I had lost this thread since you know neither of us and are a relative noOb to this board. but may I submit to you that I have gave my "proof" in several other threads of this nature. In each case he had completely ignored my answer and attacked my grammar or veered the thread in a completely different direction. He never even acknowledged my proof.

My tact in this thread was to let him know that I know that he is closed minded, it wouldn't have mattered if I laid my cards (proof) on the table he would have shifted tables.


 

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IMHO posted:
DemonicXH posted:
I just read this thread for the first time and I don't know Manegarm or IMHO, but from what I have read, you lost this one IMHO.


You claimed there was scientific proof that God existed Manegarm asked you to divulge it and then you dodged. Him or you calling each other close minded and argle bargling each other is a way to deflect.



The simple fact is, you made a claim, he called you on it and then you dodged answering.





Case closed, court is adjourned until the next debate. Probably about the Trayvon Martin shooting lol.


I can see how you may construed that I had lost this thread since you know neither of us and are a relative noOb to this board. but may I submit to you that I have gave my "proof" in several other threads of this nature. In each case he had completely ignored my answer and attacked my grammar or veered the thread in a completely different direction. He never even acknowledged my proof.

My tact in this thread was to let him know that I know that he is closed minded, it wouldn't have mattered if I laid my cards (proof) on the table he would have shifted tables.





applause

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Snarf_Igraine posted:
Hah, Mammogram, scientifically prove to me that George Washington was the first American president. Scientifically prove to me that anyone of your dead relatives loved you. Scientifically prove to me that Bach symphony's are superior to Mozart's.



I don't think he ever claimed any of that so it's not his job to provide evidence. Btw science doesn't "prove" anything.

And if you guys claim George Washington was your first president then I'll gladly take your word for it.

 

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IMHO posted:
but may I submit to you that I have gave my "proof" in several other threads of this nature.


Yes, "proof" laugh -good one.

Still a sore looser I see, and no you haven't.. You said scientific proof, the most you've done in other threads is regurgitated "herp depr, close minded.. derp"

Same shtick as in this thread.. shame_on_you

 

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Snarf_Igraine posted:
Hah, Mammogram, scientifically prove to me that George Washington was the first American president. Scientifically prove to me that anyone of your dead relatives loved you. Scientifically prove to me that Bach symphony's are superior to Mozart's. Etc.... or you can admit that science isn't the only way to show evidence for something to be true. There is historical proof as in Washington's case, testimony for your relatives love of you, etc.

PS Demon, he has many times before, but Mammogram doesn't like science that points to evidence of a creator. The creation of the universe itself from nothing, the universal constants of the universe that make the universe even possible, the language of DNA, the apparent design of the world, etc, etc.


Keep the stupid flowing Snarf, it's impressive. happy

 

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Manegarm posted:
the most you've done in other threads is regurgitated "herp depr, close minded.. derp"


See? How am I suppose to argue against that? He can't even give references to what I had said. He is so closed minded that his brain translates anything I say in to, "herp depr, ...derp". They say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result. For me to give him anymore proof, again and again and again so he could cogitate on it, would be insanity on my part.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Late to the thread, but...great skit!


applause

 

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IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
the most you've done in other threads is regurgitated "herp depr, close minded.. derp"


See? How am I suppose to argue against that? He can't even give references to what I had said. He is so closed minded that his brain translates anything I say in to, "herp depr, ...derp". They say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result. For me to give him anymore proof, again and again and again so he could cogitate on it, would be insanity on my part.


I don't need to give a reference.. It's like the third thread you play this shtick in a thread and then you just keep on regurgitating it.

I know NuEM remembers your Evolution thread where you basically repeated it for 3 pages.

tenkly posted:
It's funny to see IMHO revert to his " you don't don't get it/ you don't care/ you're too closed minded" shtick every time there's a point he can't answer.





Well herp derp is actually a abbreviation for Fred Phelps of Phelps, which you basically always bring up when you're stranded by your own incompetence on a island of stupidity.

You've even got it in your sig, so you're not even original since you stole it from Bubble. laugh

Well then you must be insane because you keep on repeating the same "close minded, phelps" bit, I've met you with the same thing over and over.. "I'm ready to see your scientific proof hand it to me" which you never do because you're to occupied repeating the same tired diatribe about how close minded I am.

So yes you're probably insane. happy

 

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Now now mammo, just because you have no answer doesn't mean you have to insult. You lose. laugh

 

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Snarf_Igraine posted:
Now now mammo, just because you have no answer doesn't mean you have to insult. You lose. laugh


Oh hello there..



Sorry, several people have already given me the win.. Does not work that way on the Outpost, I know you desperately want to help out your Brother in Delusion but it's a no go.. happy

Nice try tho, very christian of you and very weak.

 

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I understand you don't have a rational response any of the premises I laid out, I could care less about your .jpg war with IMHO, even though you clearly lost that one as well. kiss

 

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Snarf_Igraine posted:
I understand you don't have a rational response any of the premises I laid out, I could care less about your .jpg war with IMHO, even though you clearly lost that one as well. kiss


I did not care about any of the premises you laid out, I did not even engage.. Argue with NuEM if you feel the need to untwist your panties.

 

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He avoided also. Because he knows what science can and can't do and that is prove any of those things I listed or God. Though science can support specific claims in cosmological arguments either way for God or against God. It is wasted words as this is too deep for someone of your intelligence and education level but by all means, I will let you continue to have your "open mind".



 

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You're really prissy about me not bothering to engage you... stove the butthurt little christian and soldier on grin

 

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Manegarm posted:

 

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Nawh, your opinions are just not valid, I've had and won my debate in this thread..

There is really no need for this degree of butthurt, just turn the other cheek like a good little boy. happy

 

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You are inconsistent in your blatherings. Even your chum Nuem says science can't prove anything. Yet in one of your first posts in this thread to IMHO you seek scientific proof for God. You or anyone else calling your stance in this thread a win is sharing in your incoherence. The only butt hurt going on is the spanking that logic is giving you.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Then how about scientific evidence?

 

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Snarf_Igraine posted:
You are inconsistent in your blatherings. Even your chum Nuem says science can't prove anything. Yet in one of your first posts in this thread to IMHO you seek scientific proof for God. You or anyone else calling your stance in this thread a win is sharing in your incoherence. The only butt hurt going on is the spanking that logic is giving you.


did not read, don't care.. laugh

 

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Groucho48 posted:
Late to the thread, but...great skit!


applause

 

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Scientific Evidence of God

Bob Dutko posted:
While Intelligent Design skeptics may claim there is no evidence of God, the actual scientific evidence for God's existence is overwhelming, scientifically answering the question, "does God exist?".

In science there is a Law of Physics called the 1st Law of Thermodynamics. Within it is a Conservation of Energy Law that states, as a key principle that all energy in a closed system must be conserved. Okay, fancy language, but what does that mean? It means that while energy can convert into matter (physical “stuff”), and matter into energy, however much total “stuff” there is (matter and energy), there can never be an increase in that total amount or a decrease in that total amount. So however much total “stuff” there is in the universe, (matter and energy combined), there can never have been more and never have been less. All it can do is convert to different forms, like matter to energy or energy to matter, but the total amount of all of it has to remain the same.

The “closed system” is a scientific term that refers to a system or an “area” that has no outside influence, like the universe. Now, as believers we know, of course, that God does influence the universe, so many believers would consider the universe an “open system”, (one that does get outside influence), but for the atheist who says there is no God, the universe is all there is, so from their perspective and for the sake of conventional science, the universe would get no outside influence and would therefore be considered a “closed system”.

Back to the 1st Law of Thermodynamics. If it states that you can never have an increase or decrease of energy/matter, which means that matter/energy can not be created from nothingness, how did we get all the matter and energy in the universe? If science is all there is and there is no God, then the 1st Law of Thermodynamics reigns supreme and therefore it would be impossible to have matter and energy in existence right now. Simply put, when you open your eyes and see matter and experience energy, what you see is impossible according to the known Laws of science if, in fact, there is no God. Therefore, science itself says there must be a God.

Plain and simple, matter/energy can not come into existence. It is scientifically impossible, yet here we see everything around us, so how can that be? There are really only 3 possibilities. Option A: Everything came into existence by itself anyway, without the help of God, (even though science has proven that impossible). Option B: Everything in the universe has always existed for all of eternity, (which, by the way is also scientifically impossible as explained in the Top Ten Proofs for God's Existence CD due to something called the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics), or Option C: There must be a God, a Being greater than science, who created the Laws of science and has the ability to disobey them. Not only is a belief in God the only logical conclusion to draw, it's the only one scientifically possible because remember, if there is no God, the first two options are scientifically impossible according to the actual Laws of Physics.

Believe it or not, a 5 year old child could be an atheistic scientist's worst nightmare by merely asking him “where did everything come from if God didn't make it?” What that child is actually asking in scientific terms is “how do we have a violation of the 1st Law of Thermodynamics by the creation of energy and matter in the closed system of the universe if there is no Creator capable of doing that?”

Many times people who do not believe there is evidence of God have claimed that a faith in God is only a matter of faith and that it can not be proven scientifically. They say "does God exist ?....if so, prove it to me". When confronted with this, we must fully understand what it means to “prove” something. The fact is that none of us were there when the universe came into being, so technically, none of us can “prove” what happened. We can't “prove” God did it and the atheists can't “prove” everything came into being on it's own, so what we have to do is examine the evidence based on science to determine the most plausible explanation. For example, if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.


coffee

 

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IMHO posted:
Scientific Evidence of God

Bob Dutko posted:
While Intelligent Design skeptics may claim there is no evidence of God, the actual scientific evidence for God's existence is overwhelming, scientifically answering the question, "does God exist?".

In science there is a Law of Physics called the 1st Law of Thermodynamics. Within it is a Conservation of Energy Law that states, as a key principle that all energy in a closed system must be conserved. Okay, fancy language, but what does that mean? It means that while energy can convert into matter (physical “stuff”), and matter into energy, however much total “stuff” there is (matter and energy), there can never be an increase in that total amount or a decrease in that total amount. So however much total “stuff” there is in the universe, (matter and energy combined), there can never have been more and never have been less. All it can do is convert to different forms, like matter to energy or energy to matter, but the total amount of all of it has to remain the same.

The “closed system” is a scientific term that refers to a system or an “area” that has no outside influence, like the universe. Now, as believers we know, of course, that God does influence the universe, so many believers would consider the universe an “open system”, (one that does get outside influence), but for the atheist who says there is no God, the universe is all there is, so from their perspective and for the sake of conventional science, the universe would get no outside influence and would therefore be considered a “closed system”.

Back to the 1st Law of Thermodynamics. If it states that you can never have an increase or decrease of energy/matter, which means that matter/energy can not be created from nothingness, how did we get all the matter and energy in the universe? If science is all there is and there is no God, then the 1st Law of Thermodynamics reigns supreme and therefore it would be impossible to have matter and energy in existence right now. Simply put, when you open your eyes and see matter and experience energy, what you see is impossible according to the known Laws of science if, in fact, there is no God. Therefore, science itself says there must be a God.

Plain and simple, matter/energy can not come into existence. It is scientifically impossible, yet here we see everything around us, so how can that be? There are really only 3 possibilities. Option A: Everything came into existence by itself anyway, without the help of God, (even though science has proven that impossible). Option B: Everything in the universe has always existed for all of eternity, (which, by the way is also scientifically impossible as explained in the Top Ten Proofs for God's Existence CD due to something called the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics), or Option C: There must be a God, a Being greater than science, who created the Laws of science and has the ability to disobey them. Not only is a belief in God the only logical conclusion to draw, it's the only one scientifically possible because remember, if there is no God, the first two options are scientifically impossible according to the actual Laws of Physics.

Believe it or not, a 5 year old child could be an atheistic scientist's worst nightmare by merely asking him “where did everything come from if God didn't make it?” What that child is actually asking in scientific terms is “how do we have a violation of the 1st Law of Thermodynamics by the creation of energy and matter in the closed system of the universe if there is no Creator capable of doing that?”

Many times people who do not believe there is evidence of God have claimed that a faith in God is only a matter of faith and that it can not be proven scientifically. They say "does God exist ?....if so, prove it to me". When confronted with this, we must fully understand what it means to “prove” something. The fact is that none of us were there when the universe came into being, so technically, none of us can “prove” what happened. We can't “prove” God did it and the atheists can't “prove” everything came into being on it's own, so what we have to do is examine the evidence based on science to determine the most plausible explanation. For example, if I see a beautiful sand castle on the beach with intricate design, but no one there along with it, I can not “prove” someone made it, just as someone else can not “prove” the sand castle made itself from the wind, waves and sand randomly interacting with one another, so we have to determine what logic and reason tell us is the most plausible explanation, based on scientific evidence and examination.


coffee


That disingenuous essay written by a liar has been debunked.

here: http://www.amazon.com/God-Failed-Hypothesis-Science-Shows/dp/1591024811

here: http://www.amazon.com/The-Grand-Design-Stephen-Hawking/dp/055338466X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1333735094&sr=1-1

and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzEbpcUf7rE -there are 10 episodes where all of the nonsense you just blathered is ripped to bits.

and a list of different lies that he's spreading: http://bobdutko.blogspot.se/2009/01/refutations-of-bob.html

and the reason is as always financial, because you people eat this shite like chocolate because you're so utterly desperate to cling with the tips of your fingers to that pipe dream: http://toptenproofs.com/product_ge.php

I wish I was as good at selling snake oil as this dude: http://toptenproofs.com/products.php

So your proof came from the forked tongue of a liar, awesome IMHO awesome.. applause laugh doh!

coffee

 

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Manegarm posted:
That disingenuous essay written by a liar has been debunked.

here: http://www.amazon.com/God-Failed-Hypothesis-Science-Shows/dp/1591024811

here: http://www.amazon.com/The-Grand-Design-Stephen-Hawking/dp/055338466X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1333735094&sr=1-1

and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzEbpcUf7rE -there are 10 episodes where all of the nonsense you just blathered is ripped to bits.

and a list of different lies that he's spreading: http://bobdutko.blogspot.se/2009/01/refutations-of-bob.html

and the reason is as always financial, because you people eat this shite like chocolate because you're so utterly desperate to cling with the tips of your fingers to that pipe dream: http://toptenproofs.com/product_ge.php

I wish I was as good as selling snake oil as this dude: http://toptenproofs.com/products.php

So your proof came from the forked tongue of a liar, awesome IMHO awesome.. applause laugh doh!

coffee


Typical.

You say I don't have any proof, I show you proof, you pig pile this tripe and say it isn't proof.

There are always two sides to a coin. You believe that by happenstance that a tornado ripped through a junk yard and in the after math a computer was there fully functioning, I say the computer was created by an intelligent design, to me that is only logical. Your idea is insane. Get over your self.

 

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IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
That disingenuous essay written by a liar has been debunked.

here: http://www.amazon.com/God-Failed-Hypothesis-Science-Shows/dp/1591024811

here: http://www.amazon.com/The-Grand-Design-Stephen-Hawking/dp/055338466X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1333735094&sr=1-1

and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzEbpcUf7rE -there are 10 episodes where all of the nonsense you just blathered is ripped to bits.

and a list of different lies that he's spreading: http://bobdutko.blogspot.se/2009/01/refutations-of-bob.html

and the reason is as always financial, because you people eat this shite like chocolate because you're so utterly desperate to cling with the tips of your fingers to that pipe dream: http://toptenproofs.com/product_ge.php

I wish I was as good as selling snake oil as this dude: http://toptenproofs.com/products.php

So your proof came from the forked tongue of a liar, awesome IMHO awesome.. applause laugh doh!

coffee


Typical.

You say I don't have any proof, I show you proof, you pig pile this tripe and say it isn't proof.

There are always two sides to a coin. You believe that by happenstance that a tornado ripped through a junk yard and in the after math a computer was there fully functioning, I say the computer was created by an intelligent design, to me that is only logical. Your idea is insane. Get over your self.




That wasn't proof because it's just not true, it was only proof that Bob is a disingenuous person who distorts knowledge to fit his agenda.. He's a snake oil salesman who wants to make money out of religious people and to push the agenda of the christian right, just look at his other pieces this guy is so caught up in his own religious fervor that he's totally blind to reality.

No there isn't two coins to reality to knowledge and especially not when it's badly presented and skewed to serve the purposes of a known liar and debunked by actual science..

Just because you wish it too be true does not make it true IMHO, I'm sorry but the world does not work that way..

I'm not saying you should not believe, you should if it makes you happy.. hugs

 

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Like I said you're blind.

It is scientific proof. All your rhetoric doesn't change that.

Your thinking that life sprang out of primordial ooze and became what we are today without the hand of a creator defies the natural order of logic.

 

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IMHO posted:
Like I said you're blind.

It is scientific proof. All your rhetoric doesn't change that.

Your thinking that life sprang out of primordial ooze and became what we are today without the hand of a creator defies the natural order of logic.


You're the one who refuse to see that the "proof" you hold on to for dear life isn't real, it's bad science it's a distorted lie made by a RWN radio talk show host that's basically in bed with every RW christian ideal there is.

Look at the links I provided the video's are easy to grasp and well made.. The other link holds the issues this guy is crusading, he's a total RWN, poster child of the christian right and I know for a fact that you have nothing but disdain for those guys.

laugh

I simply don't know what happened before the big bang or how it happened.. I'm fine with that, does not make Bob less of a liar and you less of a idiot for listening to him just because it fits your world view, just because you want it to be true does not make it true.. hugs

 

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Rhetoric.... still doesn't change the proof I presented.

Here's a novel idea. Tell me IN YOUR OWN WORDS why you think God doesn't exist.

 

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IMHO posted:
Rhetoric.... still doesn't change the proof I presented.



Semantics, there wasn't any actual proof.. Just lies and faulty assumptions made by a source whose a known liar, which defacto changes it from 'proof' to 'tripe'.

 

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IMHO posted:


Here's a novel idea. Tell me IN YOUR OWN WORDS why you think God doesn't exist.



I can't disprove gods existence more then you can prove he exists, my reasons for not believing is based on observations mostly historical ones.

Has to do with historical science, how historians write history and what tools we use to come to the conclusion that something took place.

My problems with the idea of god begins with the idiots who think they have talked to him or have taken it upon themselves to represent him or sketch down what he has done.

Example: We know for a fact that the battle of Hastings was on October the 14th 1066 we know who won and we know whom the combatants were, why we know this is because we compiled the accounts that corroborated each other this then goes through the process of peer review where historians more or less write history by a general consensus, this is basically how all sciences works the majority rules, until proven wrong.. Then we rewrite and correct.

Here I come to a problem because I can't give that much merit to the Bible or any other "holy" book, some of it is corroborated most of it isn't.. And the magic parts are not corroborated, its mostly folk tales and hearsay.

The New testament was written 30 years after the alleged death of Jesus, this makes it even less viable as a historical document.. Especially since most of it is written by Paul who wasn't even there, and again magic.

So that more or less discounts the validity of the Bible.. So I have little reason to believe that there is a Christian god.

Along the bible I discount both Islam and the Jewish faith, add to that the fact that in the books a new prophet pops up every hundred years or so. We've not had one for quite a while.

Also with all that magic one would think that it should reoccur on our planet from time to time, it does not.

and that way it goes Religion after religion are alike in their childish way of explaining the world around us with the idea that it was magic, we know better now.

This does not discount that there is a god only that every religion out there is basically nuts.

I simply don't believe in god because I find the notion of a sapient omnipotent entity that watches over humanity to be illogical, I simply don't believe in magic and I have no need to wish for a life after this one.. I did not exist before and I shall cease to exist again. happy

And all the things that science can not explain yet, does not scare me in the least.. Just makes me curious, and the theory of evolution and the magnificent complexity of life on this planet is enough for me to marvel at without having to rely on magic to explain things.

That is more or less the short version.






 

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaqRwFyoGgQ

 

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More of a steppenwolf magic fan..

 

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Really?

The lead singer for steppenwolf is a tile layer now. I worked with him on a job in Evergreen CO. Nice enough guy. I didn't learn who he was until after the job was over.

 

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IMHO posted:
Really?

The lead singer for steppenwolf is a tile layer now. I worked with him on a job in Evergreen CO. Nice enough guy. I didn't learn who he was until after the job was over.


weird! how the f'k are they still not touring and making money? I'd pay to see them.

 

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Manegarm posted:
I can't disprove gods existence more then you can prove he exists, my reasons for not believing is based on observations mostly historical ones.

Has to do with historical science, how historians write history and what tools we use to come to the conclusion that something took place.

My problems with the idea of god begins with the idiots who think they have talked to him or have taken it upon themselves to represent him or sketch down what he has done.

Example: We know for a fact that the battle of Hastings was on October the 14th 1066 we know who won and we know whom the combatants were, why we know this is because we compiled the accounts that corroborated each other this then goes through the process of peer review where historians more or less write history by a general consensus, this is basically how all sciences works the majority rules, until proven wrong.. Then we rewrite and correct.

Here I come to a problem because I can't give that much merit to the Bible or any other "holy" book, some of it is corroborated most of it isn't.. And the magic parts are not corroborated, its mostly folk tales and hearsay.

The New testament was written 30 years after the alleged death of Jesus, this makes it even less viable as a historical document.. Especially since most of it is written by Paul who wasn't even there, and again magic.

So that more or less discounts the validity of the Bible.. So I have little reason to believe that there is a Christian god.

Along the bible I discount both Islam and the Jewish faith, add to that the fact that in the books a new prophet pops up every hundred years or so. We've not had one for quite a while.

Also with all that magic one would think that it should reoccur on our planet from time to time, it does not.

and that way it goes Religion after religion are alike in their childish way of explaining the world around us with the idea that it was magic, we know better now.

This does not discount that there is a god only that every religion out there is basically nuts.

I simply don't believe in god because I find the notion of a sapient omnipotent entity that watches over humanity to be illogical, I simply don't believe in magic and I have no need to wish for a life after this one.. I did not exist before and I shall cease to exist again. happy

And all the things that science can not explain yet, does not scare me in the least.. Just makes me curious, and the theory of evolution and the magnificent complexity of life on this planet is enough for me to marvel at without having to rely on magic to explain things.

That is more or less the short version.


I think I said it earlier in this thread, you can't tell the difference between religion and God. You seem to view them as one in the same.

God is. Like I said before a tornado can't rip threw a junk yard and create a computer. You saying that there is no God is saying that that's possible, that's crazy. The Laws of Nature are God's paint brushes.

My faith is my religion. There is no way I can prove a religious God that looks out for me i.e. faith.

Why can't you see the difference?

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:


I think I said it earlier in this thread, you can't tell the difference between religion and God. You seem to view them as one in the same.

God is. Like I said before a tornado can't rip threw a junk yard and create a computer. You saying that there is no God is saying that that's possible, that's crazy. The Laws of Nature are God's paint brushes.

My faith is my religion. There is no way I can prove a religious God that looks out for me i.e. faith.

Why can't you see the difference?


Well you can have God without religion you just can't worship with others, why do you people need to converge? I mean if the mana of God was so potent why do you need to organize yourself and since he is everywhere why do you need churches..

And why do you need scripture? what makes you think you guys are right out of all the hundreds of alternatives out there, many of whom are way older then any of the Judeo-christian faiths.

The laws of nature are defined by physics.. which we can measure, has nothing to do with a entity that there is no proof of.

I have no idea what you meant with your last paragraph.




 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
I have no idea what you meant with your last paragraph.


Well that's a start.

You can't seem to separate God from religion.

I'll keep it short and sweet....

God is.

and

Religion is man made and all about faith.

I know you call yourself an Atheist, but you seem more anti-religion to me.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
I have no idea what you meant with your last paragraph.


Well that's a start.

You can't seem to separate God from religion.

I'll keep it short and sweet....

God is.

and

Religion is man made and all about faith.

I know you call yourself an Atheist, but you seem more anti-religion to me.


It was just a grammatical trainwreck..

Oh I have nothing against the entity that does not exist, it's his followers who present the problem.

Still makes me an atheist, who is critical of religion.. which every thinking democratic individual should be since most religious institutions are by definition fascistic.

 

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Groucho48 
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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Great stuff!

M. Show me your proof

I. 1 + 1 = 3

M. That's been shown to be false.

I. See! That's why I don't bother. I provide scientific proof and you refuse to accept it.

 

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What's wrong with my math Groucho48? Saying I am adding 1+1 to get 3 is disingenuous.

My math is.... building a computer takes a creator.

Mammy's math is.... building a computer takes a tornado and time.

Whose math is skewed?

I can understand not liking religion, but putting on a blinder and denying God exists that's silly

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:


I can understand not liking religion, but putting on a blinder and denying unicorns exists that's silly


fixed.

I can sit here and claim that unicorns, ghosts, ghouls, goblins and vampires exist and it won't be true, same with god.

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?"

- Epicurus somewhere around 341 BC

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:


I can understand not liking religion, but putting on a blinder and denying unicorns exists that's silly


fixed.

I can sit here and claim that unicorns, ghosts, ghouls, goblins and vampires exist and it won't be true, same with god.

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?"

- Epicurus somewhere around 341 BC



That's all very good rhetoric, but that's all that is.

 

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It's reasoning, critical thinking, logic and rhetoric.. tools to dissuade people from the delusion of god.

I mean since you can't measure or in any way observe god because he does not exist..

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
It's reasoning, critical thinking, logic and rhetoric.. tools to dissuade people from the delusion of god.

I mean since you can't measure or in any way observe god because he does not exist..


See this is why I didn't cough up my proof. You ignore it.

You are so Fred Phelped you probably didn't even see my proof.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
It's reasoning, critical thinking, logic and rhetoric.. tools to dissuade people from the delusion of god.

I mean since you can't measure or in any way observe god because he does not exist..


See this is why I didn't cough up my proof. You ignore it.

You are so Fred Phelped you probably didn't even see my proof.


IMHO.. stop trolling, your RWN talkshow loverboy probably built his McMansion with the money he got from fooling stupid Christians like you with his pseudo-science crap.

 

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Manegarm posted:
IMHO.. stop trolling, your RWN talkshow loverboy probably built his McMansion with the money he got from fooling stupid Christians like you with his pseudo-science crap.


Not trolling.

It's just your blind spot. We all have them. I have a knack of finding blind spots in others and poking them.

I was hoping you'd be open minded like you have repeatedly said you are... but alas you are not.

I know I am sounding like an idiot to you. But that's because I am going totally against your world view and for you to actually see what I am saying would mean you would have to admit you are the idiot and with the level of arrogance you have, that won't happen laugh

 

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IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
IMHO.. stop trolling, your RWN talkshow loverboy probably built his McMansion with the money he got from fooling stupid Christians like you with his pseudo-science crap.


Not trolling.

It's just your blind spot. We all have them. I have a knack of finding blind spots in others and poking them.

I was hoping you'd be open minded like you have repeatedly said you are... but alas you are not.

I know I am sounding like an idiot to you. But that's because I am going totally against your world view and for you to actually see what I am saying would mean you would have to admit you are the idiot and with the level of arrogance you have, that won't happen laugh


Listen to me, you did not present any proof you presented faulty, defunct, non functioning pseudo-science.. We do not accept pseudo-math when we build bridges, neither does the scientific community or any college or any school accept pseudo-physics to explain anything your doctor is not educated with pseudo-biology.. Just not the way civilization does things.

See what I'm trying to get across, you basically said "here's a map of Austria" and you handed me a map of Australia.

Your "facts" weren't facts, they were lies made up by a dude who wants to sell his stupid crap to stupid people like you.

There is no way you can waltz around this, this has nothing to do with being open minded.. This has all to do with you accepting lies just because it happens to coincide with your religion.

Here I can dream up some math that will prove god's existence.. Hold it!

"2 + 4 + CAKE = GOD

Buy my book on this it's only 35.99$ and you'll get a fridge magnet in the shape of a dancing Jesus with a sombrero on his head for free!"

You can have any world view you want, your world view does not factor into this.. Facts are facts what you handed me was debunked and laid to waste.

Hey next time you need to see a doctor do not go to a hospital find some back alley clinic, because you do not really need someone who knows doctoring, whose certified and competent you just need someone who can wing it. happy

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Instead of just saying he is a lair, point out where he lied. Don't link a video, I want to hear your words.

What I hear you saying is that we evolved from nothing, i.e. a tornado in a junk yard produced a working computer. Show me how that is possible in your world view. Because that sounds utterly insane to me.

 

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IMHO posted:
Instead of just saying he is a lair, point out where he lied. Don't link a video, I want to hear your words.

What I hear you saying is that we evolved from nothing, i.e. a tornado in a junk yard produced a working computer. Show me how that is possible in your world view. Because that sounds utterly insane to me.


You did not write that wall of stupid so I responded in kind, and the FACTS debunked those lies.. When you formulate your own physics thesis on the existence of god I'll answer in kind.

You keep blathering on and on about this, I'm not going to answer your delusional analogies on tornado's and junkyards... It's immaterial to the discussion at hand, which is how you post lies which I then destroy with facts this is what the whole discussion was about on the first page.

 

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I won man.. happy

have a nice one.

 

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Subject: Coriolus, is your real name... "Storm" ?
Manegarm posted:
You keep blathering on and on about this, I'm not going to answer your delusional analogies on tornado's and junkyards... It's immaterial to the discussion at hand, which is how you post lies...




Very Open minded of you.....





















 

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still won!

 

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Manegarm posted:



laugh

 

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IMHO posted:
What's wrong with my math Groucho48? Saying I am adding 1+1 to get 3 is disingenuous.

My math is.... building a computer takes a creator.

Mammy's math is.... building a computer takes a tornado and time.

Whose math is skewed?

I can understand not liking religion, but putting on a blinder and denying God exists that's silly



As Bertrand Russell put it...


Many orthodox people speak as though it were the business of sceptics to disprove received dogmas rather than of dogmatists to prove them. This is, of course, a mistake. If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time. It is customary to suppose that, if a belief is widespread, there must be something reasonable about it. I do not think this view can be held by anyone who has studied history.



In the quote you produced as scientific evidence of God, the whole premise is that the laws of thermodynamics existed before the Big Bang. They didn't. And, even if they did, that wouldn't be proof of God. It would mean there is still stuff we don't know about the Big Bang.

As long as the universe can be explained without the necessity of a God, then, it is the burden of folks who say there is a God to prove it, if they also want everyone else to believe in God. Then, if Christians, they would have to prove that their God is the only possible God.

 

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My thread has taken on a life of it's own, albeit a sad, strange life but a life nonetheless..

 

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Scientific Method Of Determining If There Is a God/Creator*

STEP ONE - Ask a Question.

Is there or isn't there a God or Creator?

STEP TWO - Construct a Hypothesis

If there is a God/Creator, Then He could create everything. If there is no God Then Nothing could be created.

STEP THREE - Test Hypothesis by Doing an Experiment


Science Experiment #1 -

Take all the disassembled parts for a Swiss watch and put them in a jar. Now keep shaking it until it magically puts itself back together.

Science Experiment #2 -

Take all those same parts and give them to a Swiss watch maker.


STEP FOUR - Analyze The Data and Draw a Conclusion

Experiment #1 - After shaking and wobbling the jar for 30 years there is no sign that the watch is reassembling. In fact it appears that the parts are wearing them selves into dust.

Experiment #2 - Much success. after only a short period of time the Swiss Watch Creator was able to put the parts of the Swiss watch back together.


CONCLUSION - Creation needed a creator. If there is no creator then nothing will be created. There were no Dogmas or religious principles introduced in the making of this Scientific Study.








*Even though this was a scientific method to prove a theory, I have faith Mammy will completely reject this study.

 

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Coriolus posted:
My thread has taken on a life of it's own, albeit a sad, strange life but a life nonetheless..


Koneg did you log on using the wrong account?

 

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IMHO posted:
Coriolus posted:
My thread has taken on a life of it's own, albeit a sad, strange life but a life nonetheless..


Koneg did you log on using the wrong account?


My thread, MIIIiiiIIInnnneeeee...

 

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IMHO posted:
Scientific Method Of Determining If There Is a God/Creator*

STEP ONE - Ask a Question.

Is there or isn't there a God or Creator?

STEP TWO - Construct a Hypothesis

If there is a God/Creator, Then He could create everything. If there is no God Then Nothing could be created.

STEP THREE - Test Hypothesis by Doing an Experiment


Science Experiment #1 -

Take all the disassembled parts for a Swiss watch and put them in a jar. Now keep shaking it until it magically puts itself back together.

Science Experiment #2 -

Take all those same parts and give them to a Swiss watch maker.


STEP FOUR - Analyze The Data and Draw a Conclusion

Experiment #1 - After shaking and wobbling the jar for 30 years there is no sign that the watch is reassembling. In fact it appears that the parts are wearing them selves into dust.

Experiment #2 - Much success. after only a short period of time the Swiss Watch Creator was able to put the parts of the Swiss watch back together.


CONCLUSION - Creation needed a creator. If there is no creator then nothing will be created. There were no Dogmas or religious principles introduced in the making of this Scientific Study.








*Even though this was a scientific method to prove a theory, I have faith Mammy will completely reject this study.



/crickets

 

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The problem with the "but it's so big and complex that it must have a creator!!" theory is that something bigger and more complex must have built the creator. Either that or you're stuck saying "well, God just IS" at some point...which is pretty much the same argument that atheists make about energy and matter.

 

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IMHO posted:
Coriolus posted:
My thread has taken on a life of it's own, albeit a sad, strange life but a life nonetheless..


Koneg did you log on using the wrong account?
Cori is mentioned by name in the thread title - so I suppose he's entitled to consider it his. tongue

 

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"Any sufficiently advanced idiocy is
indistinguishable from trolling." -- Arthur C Clarke
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