levgre
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Why do people still believe religious myths?
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I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
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HeartView
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Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
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pkhere
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HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
nicely put
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JD_HOGG
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Same reason people believe in science tales.
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jonus156
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pkhere posted:
HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
nicely put
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http://www.hulu.com/watch/337498/jesus-camp
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levgre posted:
I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Oh, I absolutely admit that there is no scientific proof for this sort of thing. It's just a gut feeling.
Also, you have to realize that a lot of stuff in the Bible - especially the old testament - is either a metaphor/allegory, or something that probably happened on a much smaller scale (like Noah's Ark. I mean...40 days and 40 nights of rain? Hell, we get double that in Seattle most winters, you don't see me out there collecting animals)
Although...with a garden hose and some sandbags, I might be able to trick Ticky into mating with me... 
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iknowrite .. like threatening to burn a book half way around the world justifies dozens of people getting murdered. and the person threatening to burn the book has to apologize for the murders. they just must be uneducated no good knuckle dragers.
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HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
religion is not only something you cannot prove directly, it is something that you can't disprove. every time i talk to a friend i have experience with that person to draw upon that tells me he/she is reliable. unlike religion, he/she could be proven wrong if the friend said something incorrect. unless the friend was saying how awesome God was. then we would be trapped in some kind of confusing cycle.
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levgre
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HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
Yeah but the difference is I don't take something I hear from a friend and base tremendously important beliefs off of it, like that I could face an eternity of pain once I die.
My point being that they may both be faith of some kind (although I don't flat out assume whatever my friends say is true), but the religious faith is definitely being used very differently.
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JD_HOGG
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levgre posted:
HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
Yeah but the difference is I don't take something I hear from a friend and base tremendous beliefs off of it, like that I could face an eternity of pain once I die.
You believe in Global Warming don't you? So you take something you hear from a total stranger and base tremendous beliefs off of that, like we could all die in a horrible flood if we don't stop using all fossil fuels.
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levgre
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JD_HOGG posted:
levgre posted:
HeartView posted:
Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
Yeah but the difference is I don't take something I hear from a friend and base tremendous beliefs off of it, like that I could face an eternity of pain once I die.
You believe in Global Warming don't you? So you take something you hear from a total stranger and base tremendous beliefs off of that, like we could all die in a horrible flood if we don't stop using all fossil fuels.
As a science-minded person I don't believe in any scientific fact in that manner. My mind would not be blown if global warming ended up not existing. Although since scientific knowledge is linked from one piece of knowledge/logic to another, there'd be a very extraordinary explanation as to why all the data supporting global warming was so neatly misleading.
And the melting of glaciers would just flood lower elevation shorelines... New York, Netherlands, etc. Not everyone.
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JD_HOGG
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levgre posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
levgre posted:
[quote=HeartView]Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
Yeah but the difference is I don't take something I hear from a friend and base tremendous beliefs off of it, like that I could face an eternity of pain once I die.
You believe in Global Warming don't you? So you take something you hear from a total stranger and base tremendous beliefs off of that, like we could all die in a horrible flood if we don't stop using all fossil fuels.
As a science-minded person I don't believe in any scientific fact in that manner. My mind would not be blown if global warming ended up not existing. Although since scientific knowledge is linked from one piece of knowledge/logic to another, there'd be a very extraordinary explanation as to why all the data supporting global warming was so neatly misleading.
And the flooding from the melting of glaciers flood all of us, just lower elevation shorelines... New York, Netherlands, etc.[/quote]
Again, you are taking something you hear from a total stranger and basing your belief off of that. You aren't out there measuring things are you? You aren't out there investigating other possibilities are you? You're just taking the body of work that total strangers choose to reveal to you and accepting that as the truth.
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levgre
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JD_HOGG posted:
levgre posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
[quote=levgre][quote=HeartView]Belief in religion is no different than belief in anything else you cannot prove directly yourself. You may not pray to a god but you take things on "faith" daily. Every time you hear something from a friend that you trust and accept it as fact (or at least don't question it) then you might as well be practicing religion. Consider religion as proof from within.
Yeah but the difference is I don't take something I hear from a friend and base tremendous beliefs off of it, like that I could face an eternity of pain once I die.
You believe in Global Warming don't you? So you take something you hear from a total stranger and base tremendous beliefs off of that, like we could all die in a horrible flood if we don't stop using all fossil fuels.
As a science-minded person I don't believe in any scientific fact in that manner. My mind would not be blown if global warming ended up not existing. Although since scientific knowledge is linked from one piece of knowledge/logic to another, there'd be a very extraordinary explanation as to why all the data supporting global warming was so neatly misleading.
And the flooding from the melting of glaciers flood all of us, just lower elevation shorelines... New York, Netherlands, etc.[/quote]
Again, you are taking something you hear from a total stranger and basing your belief off of that. You aren't out there measuring things are you? You aren't out there investigating other possibilities are you? You're just taking the body of work that total strangers choose to reveal to you and accepting that as the truth. [/quote]
Science is just as much about developing a community of knowledge, as it is about individual research. They anticipated your concern, and developed a robust language/system to combat it. Few major scientific advances are done by just one person, yet we still have somehow managed to develop nanotechnology and super computers.
A final test for truth/accuracy is if one scientist's research ends up accurate and useful in other scientists' works... then you become increasingly sure the research was an accurate measurement of reality.
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Belief in the literal truth of religious myths is, I think, rather rare.
Most folks today realize that most of religious texts' narrative is purposely allegorical in order to make larger points about how we should be behaving.
Rho
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levgre posted:
I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
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levgre posted:
Science is just as much about developing a community of knowledge, as it is about individual research. They anticipated your concern, and developed a robust language/system to combat it. Few major scientific advances are done by just one person, yet we still have somehow managed to develop nanotechnology and super computers.
A final test for truth/accuracy is if one scientist's research ends up accurate and useful in other scientists' works... then you become increasingly sure the research was an accurate measurement of reality.
I think we're getting off track from the question, "why do people still believe in religious myths?" You are talking about stories like Noah's ark, aren't you? There certainly are people who take that myth literally, and to that I have to say, because they are brainwashed. There can be no other explanation because even a person of below average intelligence can look at the vast number of species that are alive today and see that the size of a boat needed to fit 2 of each would far exceed the dimensions specified in the bible, an ark which would be smaller than a modern cargo ship.
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faefrost posted:
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
http://climate.nasa.gov/
oh nooo, there is no separation of church and state. noooooo
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difference between literal religion and science is simple.
Religion: this is how it is and that's that.
Science: this is how we think it is, please review and prove us wrong.
When shown proof that their claims are highly unlikely or wrong-
Religion: I don't believe you the book says it's not so and as such it is not so.
Science: Wow awesome findings, I now have to come up with an theory that explains it. Once I'm done can you review it and try to prove us wrong again? thanks you're the man!
again this is the religious nut job freaks who take a 2000 year old book as literal, not the ones who use it as metaphor and allegory to teach life lessons. It's also not the fake science perpetual motion machine freaks either.
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levgre
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faefrost posted:
levgre posted:
I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
Yeah... I don't give global warming any pass. I don't think we are in imminent danger, damage will occur more progressively so we will see critical impacts coming to an extent. However when you already see changes happening at record rates, and we really have no way to quickly reverse the process, you SHOULD proceed with caution.
If everyone was like you and disregarded the impact we can have on the global environment, we'd be in pretty horrible shape with CFCs depleting the Ozone layer.
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Lyndrek posted:
difference between literal religion and science is simple.
Religion: this is how it is and that's that.
Science: this is how we think it is, please review and prove us wrong.
When shown proof that their claims are highly unlikely or wrong-
Religion: I don't believe you the book says it's not so and as such it is not so.
Science: Wow awesome findings, I now have to come up with an theory that explains it. Once I'm done can you review it and try to prove us wrong again? thanks you're the man!
again this is the religious nut job freaks who take a 2000 year old book as literal, not the ones who use it as metaphor and allegory to teach life lessons. It's also not the fake science perpetual motion machine freaks either.
Not true... many scientists are more fanatical about their findings than some religious zealots are about their god. There are folks out there who believe so strongly in THEIR research that no matter how many people prove it wrong and refute it, they will just cover their ears, stomp their feet and pretend not to hear it. Or they will ATTACK said scientists personal life or somehow try to destroy the other scientists credibility just so their flawed research remains undisputed.... Sounds an awful lot like some religions.
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Caledric
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levgre posted:
faefrost posted:
levgre posted:
I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
Yeah... I don't give global warming any pass. I don't think we are in imminent danger, damage will occur more progressively so we will see critical impacts coming to an extent. However when you already see changes happening at record rates, and we really have no way to quickly reverse the process, you SHOULD proceed with caution.
If everyone was like you and disregarded the impact we can have on the global environment, we'd be in pretty horrible shape with CFCs depleting the Ozone layer.
Its also been PROVEN that what is occurring is actually a cyclical event in the earth's history... but the Global warming people don't want to hear that... they want to continue to push their agenda. And its not even really "record" rates. Its record rates for the past 200 years, which in the 2500 years this planet is existed... isn't really that long.
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The thing I love about religious myths.... is someone will take their own religion's stories and myths and fully believe it, but then look at another religion's stories and myths and laugh at them for being silly and unbelievable.
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Caledric posted:
levgre posted:
faefrost posted:
[quote=levgre]I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
Yeah... I don't give global warming any pass. I don't think we are in imminent danger, damage will occur more progressively so we will see critical impacts coming to an extent. However when you already see changes happening at record rates, and we really have no way to quickly reverse the process, you SHOULD proceed with caution.
If everyone was like you and disregarded the impact we can have on the global environment, we'd be in pretty horrible shape with CFCs depleting the Ozone layer.
Its also been PROVEN that what is occurring is actually a cyclical event in the earth's history... [/quote]
Yah no it hasn't... you are ignorant of the facts. Just accept it and maybe you'll actually learn something.
The temp is increasing at record rates for as long as we have tracked temperatures, and even compared to historical warming trends the current one is rapid and extreme. There is a lack of evidence preceding this upswing to show that it's natural, even natural temperature cycles have causes. Plus the temperature increase is just one aspect of the evidence that proves global climate change.
And the Earth has existed for only 2500 years? Wut?? Are you trolling?
Read this
http://grist.org/climate-energy/current-global-warming-is-just-part-of-a-natural-cycle/
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Religion keeps you civilized. Without Religion everyone would be a murdering, raping, ringworm infested, OWS protesting libtard.
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levgre posted:
Caledric posted:
levgre posted:
[quote=faefrost][quote=levgre]I'm not saying all religion is stupid or that faith can't be intelligent... but some of it seems so far-fetched.
Like hell and the rapture, it's so blatant as a fear-mongering control device.
And then you have wars between angels, Noah's Ark, Garden of Eden, and so much more.
It just seems to all be too much.
Good discussion starting place. Now apply your logic and thought process to some "none religious" similar myths and see how they stack up. I recommend starting with "Global Warming"
Yeah... I don't give global warming any pass. I don't think we are in imminent danger, damage will occur more progressively so we will see critical impacts coming to an extent. However when you already see changes happening at record rates, and we really have no way to quickly reverse the process, you SHOULD proceed with caution.
If everyone was like you and disregarded the impact we can have on the global environment, we'd be in pretty horrible shape with CFCs depleting the Ozone layer.
Its also been PROVEN that what is occurring is actually a cyclical event in the earth's history... [/quote]
Yah no it hasn't... you are ignorant of the facts. Just accept it and maybe you'll actually learn something.
The temp is increasing at record rates for as long as we have tracked temperatures, and even compared to historical warming trends the current one is rapid and extreme. There is a lack of evidence preceding this upswing to show that it's natural, even natural temperature cycles have causes. Plus the temperature increase is just one aspect of the evidence that proves global climate change.
And the Earth has existed for only 2500 years? Wut?? Are you trolling?
Read this
http://grist.org/climate-energy/current-global-warming-is-just-part-of-a-natural-cycle/ [/quote]
Thanks for proving my point for me 
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levgre
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Why do people still believe religious myths?
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I don't know what point you were trying to make, but you made none. Every conclusion you presented was erroneous, and every fact you presented you have horribly misinterpreted.
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Caledric
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Why do people still believe religious myths?
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levgre posted:
Just accept it and maybe you'll actually learn something.
Isn't this exact statement what made you post this thread complaining about religion?
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Caledric
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Why do people still believe religious myths?
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levgre posted:
I don't know what point you were trying to make, but you made none. Every conclusion you presented was erroneous, and every fact you presented you have horribly misinterpreted.
So basically you are the Christian saying that Islam is wrong... gotcha.
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-Mithan-
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Why do people still believe religious myths?
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Religion is based on faith, period.
I believe in God and Jesus but I don't "know" they exist. There is no empirical evidence to support that they do exist. I've heard lots and lots of stories from people saying an "Angel saved me" or whatever, but at the end of there day, there is no "proof".
When you start to break down things even further and listen to dumb people, like Born Again Christians who will tell you flat in the face that God is going to burn people in hell who have never even heard of the Bible as "sinners", then you realize how fu**ing stupid religion really is.
However, this is why I do not believe Religion should have much bearing on government either and why I think people who are against things like Homosexuality or Abortion based on "religious beliefs" and think that those belief's should be forced on OTHER people are assholes and useless. Muslims countries are crap because they allow their religious views to dominate their political views and that is just wrong.
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levgre
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Subject:
Why do people still believe religious myths?
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Caledric posted:
levgre posted:
Just accept it and maybe you'll actually learn something.
Isn't this exact statement what made you post this thread complaining about religion?
No. Scientific claims are of a very different nature than mythical/religious ones.
You can be right or wrong on scientific facts, but that rightness/wrongness only extends to the realm of science. Science is far from perfect, it is our incomplete understanding of the universe. But it is still a system built on observed and recorded evidence, linked by reason and logic. Even though Science's scope is limited, each piece of the puzzle is substantiated (and this is why we can create otherwise unimaginable technology).
In your case, you are horribly wrong because you tried to make an argument in the realm of science. That means you have to actually use facts and strong logic-based arguments to support your conclusions. That's why creationism is not accepted as a scientific theory, because there is nothing scientific about it. But of course science can never disprove God planted dinosaur bones into the ground 5000 years ago.
Your claim that the current warming trend is just a natural cycle is not too far off from creationism. There is little to no supporting evidence.
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