cobane
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According to a Creationist.
 posted:
What do creationists say regarding the origin of the oceans? We look to the Biblical model and find that our planet began cool and covered with water (see Genesis 1:2) as opposed to the secular model stating it was molten rock with no water! On the third day of creation, the waters under the heaven were gathered into one place which God called Seas (see Genesis 1:9-10). Centuries later, at the Flood, He again covered the land with water, until the fountains of the deep were closed and the water receded steadily from the earth. As the fountains closed, the ocean floor sank, forming new and much deeper ocean basins (such as the 36,163 foot deep Mariana Trench), permitting the continents to drain and emerge from the waters.
Biblical! Accurate! Certain!
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IMHO
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Sounds reasonable for me.
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cobane
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No one's buying your evangelist schtick, IHMO.
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Tych2
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IMHO posted:
Sounds reasonable for me.
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Manegarm
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I'd be careful or the local theists will start to attack you for spreading malicious ideas around.
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You guys are so closed minded you make Pat Robertson look Liberal.
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cobane
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Creationist science is the easiest science!
#14. How do volcanoes form?
a. Plate subduction
b. God did it
c. The devil did it
d. Both a & c
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Manegarm
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IMHO posted:
You guys are so closed minded you make Pat Robertson look Liberal.
We've actually just evolved beyond the reasoning level of small children. You can't really say your're serious with this creationism shtick?
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Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:
You guys are so closed minded you make Pat Robertson look Liberal.
We've actually just evolved beyond the reasoning level of small children. You can't really say your're serious with this creationism shtick?
No you haven't. You are one of the most closed minded persons I have met.
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Manegarm
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IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:
You guys are so closed minded you make Pat Robertson look Liberal.
We've actually just evolved beyond the reasoning level of small children. You can't really say your're serious with this creationism shtick?
No you haven't. You are one of the most closed minded persons I have met.
I told you earlier today that I would accept god without any problems if you just presented me with some proof, how much more open minded can I be?
Also creationism isn't a matter of open mindedness or faith or opinion, it's simply not true, the facts are wrong.
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I believe in both creationism and evolution.
Genesis 1:2 posted:
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
Genesis 1:9-10 posted:
And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.†And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground “land,†and the gathered waters he called “seas.†And God saw that it was good.
Not listening to how other idiots interpret the Bible, I don't see where what the Bible passages they quoted can't be seen as both evolution and creationism.
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NuEM
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No one needs to be open minded to acknowledge reality. It hits you right in the face.
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You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
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IMHO posted:
I believe in both creationism and evolution.
Genesis 1:2 posted:
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
Genesis 1:9-10 posted:
And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.†And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground “land,†and the gathered waters he called “seas.†And God saw that it was good.
Not listening to how other idiots interpret the Bible, I don't see where what the Bible passages they quoted can't be seen as both evolution and creationism.
I'm glad you agree with me. The thing is creationism just isn't real it's just pseudo-science at best, this is even acknowledged by a multitude of religious people.
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cobane
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IMHO posted:
You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
Maybe next time you should ask him to aim for your mouth. It's only polite.
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IMHO posted:
You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
Now if that was true we'd all see it, or you'd at least have some proof to back up your claim.. which you don't. Then again you've just closed your mind that he exists and is not letting any dissenting ideas in.
Unlike me whom would embrace the Christian god in an instant if you only provided me with some proof. 
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Manegarm posted:
Now if that was true we'd all see it
There are none so blind as those that choose not to see.
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IMHO posted:
Manegarm posted:
Now if that was true we'd all see it
There are none so blind as those that choose not to see.
No if there was any reality to whatever lies you need to use as a bulwark against your alcoholism we'd all see it without having to drink ourselves into hopelessness first.
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Scarne
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IMHO posted:
You guys are so closed minded you make Pat Robertson look Liberal.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2010/12/pat-robertson-marijuana.html
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Why do religious groups find it necessary to try and "explain" how they fit into scientific evidence/theories?
Your whole paradigm is built on faith.
Stick to what you are good at.
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cobane
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They say it took God an entire day to create the oceans. Not so. Why? Because He's God. It took him a few minutes at most to dump his magic bucket of seas over the globe. He spent the rest of the day putting in place a hilarious fart gag in Lake Nyos.
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
Genesis 1:2 posted:
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
I don't see where what the Bible passages they quoted can't be seen as both evolution and creationism.
For starters - darkness wasn't over the surface... Earth came after the Sun - shit was bright as eff, ya hear me?
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reesescups posted:
Earth came after the Sun
Can you show me the science that says the sun came first or, better yet, that the sun was ignited before the formless earth?
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
Earth came after the Sun
Can you show me the science that says the sun came first or, better yet, that the sun was ignited before the formless earth?
You need me to send you back to middle school science class?
Can I get a note from your mom first?
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If the earth came AFTER the sun where did it come from?
Myself I can see the big bang happening and all this matter is spewed out into darkness and is starting to coagulate together. There are giant clouds of dust, God puts the earth together because it is small then the sun stats up. It makes scientific sense to me.
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
If the earth came AFTER the sun where did it come from?
Myself I can see the big bang happening and all this matter is spewed out into darkness and is starting to coagulate together. There are giant clouds of dust, God puts the earth together because it is small then the sun stats up. It makes scientific sense to me.
That makes 'scientific' sense to you because your retarded...
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reesescups posted:
You need me to send you back to middle school science class??
Would that be public or private? 
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reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
If the earth came AFTER the sun where did it come from?
Myself I can see the big bang happening and all this matter is spewed out into darkness and is starting to coagulate together. There are giant clouds of dust, God puts the earth together because it is small then the sun stats up. It makes scientific sense to me.
That makes 'scientific' sense to you because your retarded...
You know I'm right or you would counter me with logic instead of calling me names
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
You need me to send you back to middle school science class??
Would that be public or private?
Haha
As long as its not one of those private church run schools either should suffice!
Mostly messing with ya. If I wasn't about to fall asleep I'd go through it with ya. But the internets are open 24/7 I am sure you could find a legit site that can walk ya through it.
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IMHO posted:
[image=http://forum.alanwake.com/picture.php?albumid=75&pictureid=513]
You can't even figure out how to post a pic....
How long you been posting here?
Hint: google solar system formation.
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Wikipedia posted:
The formation and evolution of the Solar System is estimated to have begun 4.568 billion years ago with the gravitational collapse of a small part of a giant molecular cloud.[1] Most of the collapsing mass collected in the centre, forming the Sun, while the rest flattened into a protoplanetary disk out of which the planets, moons, asteroids, and other small Solar System bodies formed.
That is basically what I said. The theory NEVER states when the sun ignites. Being that the sun was much bigger than the earth and other planets I bet they were in the process of forming just before the sun ignited.
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God created, then nature did it's thing.
The curious thing about creation I have is how was a day measured? I have read a small amount of time to God is like centuries to a man.
I can understand how people who do not believe there is a God want proof. I wish there was some way I could put it into words to inspire someone enough to seek God, but I am not gifted like that.
I have no problem sharing ..I have twice here with something real to me. I think I shared my kidney story and the butterfly one when i was little. I had never even heard of God on the little girl story. My parents never took me to church.
I have had a couple other definent things happen to me. I have also had a dark expierience happen to me.
I don't think I am special or important. Even tho I think i have always believed in God, I spent many years ignoring Him. It wasn't until my kidney ordeal that opened my eyes again, and I knew i needed more than a doctor. I promised i wouldn't forget Him again.
I am going to share another moment that happened to me. This is not made up or just in my head..I never have taken drugs in my life..lol. It's ok if you want to make fun of me.I can roll with that .
Ok..here it goes, it's short and sweet.
I was alone..daytime..praying to God, as much as I hate to admit..I was praying for more.
As I was praying..i was admiring how beautiful the oaks leaves were..the sun was glittery..bouncing off all the leaves.
I promise you that exact moment as I was praying for more..I heard the Voice of God..clear..not in my head..and this is what he said.
"If I gave you all you asked for, would this moment be any more beautiful."
That was it, no more no less. All I could say was no..it shook me up for real.
It really did happen, just like that.
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
Earth came after the Sun
Can you show me the science that says the sun came first or, better yet, that the sun was ignited before the formless earth?
Are you goddamn high?
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
Earth came after the Sun
Can you show me the science that says the sun came first or, better yet, that the sun was ignited before the formless earth?
Are you goddamn high?
Nope.
I'm giving you what I think. You can't counter it with logic? I'm not the one you should be questioning as to who is high.
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Manegarm
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Halloweve posted:
God created, then nature did it's thing.
The curious thing about creation I have is how was a day measured? I have read a small amount of time to God is like centuries to a man.
I can understand how people who do not believe there is a God want proof. I wish there was some way I could put it into words to inspire someone enough to seek God, but I am not gifted like that.
I have no problem sharing ..I have twice here with something real to me. I think I shared my kidney story and the butterfly one when i was little. I had never even heard of God on the little girl story. My parents never took me to church.
I have had a couple other definent things happen to me. I have also had a dark expierience happen to me.
I don't think I am special or important. Even tho I think i have always believed in God, I spent many years ignoring Him. It wasn't until my kidney ordeal that opened my eyes again, and I knew i needed more than a doctor. I promised i wouldn't forget Him again.
I am going to share another moment that happened to me. This is not made up or just in my head..I never have taken drugs in my life..lol. It's ok if you want to make fun of me.I can roll with that .
Ok..here it goes, it's short and sweet.
I was alone..daytime..praying to God, as much as I hate to admit..I was praying for more.
As I was praying..i was admiring how beautiful the oaks leaves were..the sun was glittery..bouncing off all the leaves.
I promise you that exact moment as I was praying for more..I heard the Voice of God..clear..not in my head..and this is what he said.
"If I gave you all you asked for, would this moment be any more beautiful."
That was it, no more no less. All I could say was no..it shook me up for real.
It really did happen, just like that.
Yes your delusions are obviously evidence enough..
Of course God would manifest himself in some obscure emotional sense instead of any actual real sense, and of course he spoke to you..
You're obviously more important then the millions of people he does not speak too I mean he'd obviously take time to speak to you instead of saving the life of some starving child in Africa and I mean it had to have been the Juedo-Christian god too not Ganesh or Thor. I mean that seems a lot more plausible then the notion that you just imagined it all because of stress or conditioning? It's not like the human mind is awesome at tricking itself..
I love how this self delusion is actually socially accepted, when other idiots like you hear you tell your story they don't ask you "are you mentally sound?" they instead applaud your for your "spirituality", no wonder this crap is rampant in the world when you've got a multitude of hopeful desperate idiots leading on another flock of equally stupid desperate people.
Instead of thinking "okay what the f'k just happened to me and what is wrong" you had the brilliant notion "THE CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE AND ALL IN IT SPOKE TO ME!"
Give me a break, you people are so caught up in the drama of your own existence that you actually believe for a second that you're anything special.
IMHO I can actually understand he's a weakling and needed support..
edit: The best thing is that you'll probably smile and not take any of this in or even spend a moment being critical of what you really experienced you'll go on your emotions or your "faith" and just shrug it off.
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reesescups
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For your glorious benefit since I had to get up to answer an email anyway...
IMHO posted:
Wikipedia posted:
The formation and evolution of the Solar System is estimated to have begun 4.568 billion years ago with the gravitational collapse of a small part of a giant molecular cloud.[1] Most of the collapsing mass collected in the centre, forming the Sun, while the rest flattened into a protoplanetary disk out of which the planets, moons, asteroids, and other small Solar System bodies formed.
That is basically what I said.
Not even close to what you said...
IMHO posted:
Myself I can see the big bang happening and all this matter is spewed out into darkness and is starting to coagulate together.
The big bang happened about 10 Billion years before our solar system formed. Our Sun is a 3rd or 4th generation star.
IMHO posted:
There are giant clouds of dust, God puts the earth together because it is small then the sun stats up. It makes scientific sense to me.
You said 'God' puts the earth together AND THEN 'starts' up the sun.
As you just quoted from WIki - the first solar system formation that happens is the gravity collapse of the dust cloud - this is the material that eventually forms the Sun. - for a time line of when it 'ignited' look up solar density related to gravity nuclear reactions... In the mean time - the mass of the forming Sun is what is the driving force to coalesce the other material of the planetary disk into planets... By the time 'water' makes it onto the surface of the planet in any measurable amount - trust me, there be light up in this bitch, ya hear me???
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IMHO posted:
You can't counter it with logic?
Why would I want to?? I don't care to educate you. I am not your teacher. Laughing at you is much more entertaining.
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
You can't counter it with logic?
Why would I want to?? I don't care to educate you. I am not your teacher. Laughing at you is much more entertaining.
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
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That is old and busted. You need to try much harder. I am not Bonk.
You used to be much more... sane. Not sure what happened recently to you. You didn't fall off the wagon a while back and jump back on board did you?
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Manegarm I like you none the less, and I knew you would be the one . And I did smile.
Anyhow the one thing I will defend is i know I am nothing special..i think we are loved equally, believers and non. I doubt it makes a difference because you think I'm nuts..lol..but anyhow I wasn't praying to hear Him...i never have. And I was more than shook up over it..it was not something I took lightly.
like i said..i'm ok with being teased..or even insulted. I keep my word
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Tych2 posted:
That is old and busted. You need to try much harder. I am not Bonk.
You used to be much more... sane. Not sure what happened recently to you. You didn't fall off the wagon a while back and jump back on board did you?
If I started drinking again I sure as hell wouldn't be posting here. I would be out having fun.
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
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Halloweve posted:
Manegarm I like you none the less, and I knew you would be the one . And I did smile.
Anyhow the one thing I will defend is i know I am nothing special..i think we are loved equally, believers and non. I doubt it makes a difference because you think I'm nuts..lol..but anyhow I wasn't praying to hear Him...i never have. And I was more than shook up over it..it was not something I took lightly.
like i said..i'm ok with being teased..or even insulted. I keep my word
See you're even horribly predictable..
what makes you think it was god, and not thor, ganesh or just Satan or any other evil one?
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reesescups posted:
For your glorious benefit since I had to get up to answer an email anyway...
IMHO posted:
[quote=Wikipedia]The formation and evolution of the Solar System is estimated to have begun 4.568 billion years ago with the gravitational collapse of a small part of a giant molecular cloud.[1] Most of the collapsing mass collected in the centre, forming the Sun, while the rest flattened into a protoplanetary disk out of which the planets, moons, asteroids, and other small Solar System bodies formed.
So these dust clouds weren't spewed out at the time of the big bang
That is basically what I said.
Not even close to what you said...
IMHO posted:
Myself I can see the big bang happening and all this matter is spewed out into darkness and is starting to coagulate together.
The big bang happened about 10 Billion years before our solar system formed. Our Sun is a 3rd or 4th generation star.[/qoute]
reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
There are giant clouds of dust, God puts the earth together because it is small then the sun stats up. It makes scientific sense to me.
You said 'God' puts the earth together AND THEN 'starts' up the sun.
As you just quoted from WIki - the first solar system formation that happens is the gravity collapse of the dust cloud - this is the material that eventually forms the Sun. - for a time line of when it 'ignited' look up solar density related to gravity nuclear reactions... In the mean time - the mass of the forming Sun is what is the driving force to coalesce the other material of the planetary disk into planets... By the time 'water' makes it onto the surface of the planet in any measurable amount - trust me, there be light up in this bitch, ya hear me???
yea... no.
It's science. Gravity is the driving force for forming the sun AND coalescing the planets. The sun keeps us in our orbit but the fact we are in orbit shows we were far enough away from the sun that we coalesced on our own. ...and while all this coalescing was happening the earth was without form. When the earth did start taking form that is when the sun ignited and the earth came together. Just like the Bible says.
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cobane posted:
IMHO posted:
You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
Maybe next time you should ask him to aim for your mouth. It's only polite.
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The creation stories of the bible are irrelevant from the standpoint of the physical creation of the world. It is more of a metaphysical story.
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F is for Fake-believe
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IMHO posted:
yea... no.
It's science. Gravity is the driving force for forming the sun AND coalescing the planets. The sun keeps us in our orbit but the fact we are in orbit shows we were far enough away from the sun that we coalesced on our own. ...and while all this coalescing was happening the earth was without form. When the earth did start taking form that is when the sun ignited and the earth came together. Just like the Bible says.
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reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
yea... no.
It's science. Gravity is the driving force for forming the sun AND coalescing the planets. The sun keeps us in our orbit but the fact we are in orbit shows we were far enough away from the sun that we coalesced on our own. ...and while all this coalescing was happening the earth was without form. When the earth did start taking form that is when the sun ignited and the earth came together. Just like the Bible says.
I'm sad this is all over your head 
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IMHO posted:
I'm sad this is all over your head
Delusions of grandeur...
Hows that adderall working out for you?
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I take all the parables in the bible literally.
It makes it more fun.
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-----signature-----
you are broken now
but faith can heal you
just do everything i tell you to do
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and people are surprised why america is getting dumber.
i want to be far, far away from any of you retards that believes in creationism. you got some open spots in sweden manny?
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Akza posted:
and people are surprised why america is getting dumber.
i want to be far, far away from any of you retards that believes in creationism. you got some open spots in sweden manny?
Have you been here for an evolution thread yet?
Oh the dumb ones come running from all over the place to get a bite of that one...
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IMHO posted:
It's science. Gravity is the driving force for forming the sun AND coalescing the planets. The sun keeps us in our orbit but the fact we are in orbit shows we were far enough away from the sun that we coalesced on our own. ...and while all this coalescing was happening the earth was without form. When the earth did start taking form that is when the sun ignited and the earth came together. Just like the Bible says.
The dust that coalesced to form Earth was created in previous generations of stars that had been ignited, fused hydrogen into heavier elements, and exploded. Earth can't even be in a formless state without light and stars in the sky existing previously.
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Akza posted:
and people are surprised why america is getting dumber.
i want to be far, far away from any of you retards that believes in creationism. you got some open spots in sweden manny?
I think you should take it upon yourself to do what you want. I don't think many will stand at the border and plead with you to stay.
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Akza posted:
and people are surprised why america is getting dumber.
i want to be far, far away from any of you retards that believes in creationism. you got some open spots in sweden manny?
I think we're going to close to border to avoid the stampede of well you idiots because within 5 years of that this continent would be just as filled with your Jesus cancer and f'kin idiotic 24/h FOX new ARGHEBLARGH.
So no thanks, stay on your side of the pond.
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Scarne posted:
IMHO posted:
It's science. Gravity is the driving force for forming the sun AND coalescing the planets. The sun keeps us in our orbit but the fact we are in orbit shows we were far enough away from the sun that we coalesced on our own. ...and while all this coalescing was happening the earth was without form. When the earth did start taking form that is when the sun ignited and the earth came together. Just like the Bible says.
The dust that coalesced to form Earth was created in previous generations of stars that had been ignited, fused hydrogen into heavier elements, and exploded. Earth can't even be in a formless state without light and stars in the sky existing previously.
Sure...
There are billion and billions of stars in the sky right now, yet at night I still need a flash light.
Are you guys purposely being dense?
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IMHO posted:
Are you guys purposely being dense?
Says the guy who believes Genesis is a literal description for how all this shit happened...
That's just effing awesome, right thar.
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reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
Are you guys purposely being dense?
Says the guy who believes Genesis is a literal description for how all this shit happened...
That's just effing awesome, right thar.
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cobane posted:
IMHO posted:
You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
Maybe next time you should ask him to aim for your mouth. It's only polite.
ROFLMAO...
Goddamnit Cobane that was a gem right there...
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Reading this thread has given me some good laughs today. The stuff the you creation guys write about is hilarious. It's like you don't know there are thousands of people around the world who really know this stuff and work on it everyday. You might want to read something serious once in awhile before you come here and look insane. Actually, disregard that. I need my morning chuckle with my coffee.
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I think Genesis is a pretty good explanation considering how long it has been around. It still fits into what science says had happened.
You guys are too fear full to let your guards down and think if you agree with any thing in the Bible you will be zombified. Where as actually you are looking pretty stupid .
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IMHO posted:
I think Genesis is a pretty good explanation considering how long it has been around. It still fits into what science says had happened.
Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 don't even agree on the order of things.
Science does not agree with either order.
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IMHO posted:
I think Genesis is a pretty good explanation considering how long it has been around. It still fits into what science says had happened.
You been borrowing that biblical decoder ring from Snarf or Mastboro???
Your parents should really pay more attention to who's trying to shove their junk in your mouth...
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You guys are just as stupid as the religious nuts you guys hate because of their stupidness.
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
You guys are just as stupid as the religious nuts you guys hate because of their stupidness.
Yeah, ok chief...
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IMHO
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reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
You guys are just as stupid as the religious nuts you guys hate because of their stupidness.
Yeah, ok chief...
You even have their smug elitist retorts
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You're Right ~ Koneg
He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
You guys are just as stupid as the religious nuts you guys hate because of their stupidness.
Yeah, ok chief...
You even have their smug elitist retorts
Seriously
What are expecting?
You appear to be lacking in about 5-6 years worth of basic level education in the topic and another 2-8 years of applied science on top of that... Which whatever if that kind of ignorance is acceptable to you, effing awesome - moar powa to ya!
But this is the outpost. You cann't come up in here with that level of ignorance and expect us to educate you. You know we are going to mock you. And not just mock your ignorance on the topic but also mock your scapegoat 'God' answer as well!
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Manegarm
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reesescups posted:
You appear to be lacking in about 5-6 years worth of basic level education in the topic and another 2-8 years of applied science on top of that... Which whatever if that kind of ignorance is acceptable to you, effing awesome - moar powa to ya!
But this is the outpost. You cann't come up in here with that level of ignorance and expect us to educate you. You know we are going to mock you. And not just mock your ignorance on the topic but also mock your scapegoat 'God' answer as well!
QFT!
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IMHO
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I have said nothing that isn't in tune with science.
It's your hostility towards religion that is blinding you.
If the Bible was never brought up and I explained the start of our planet you would have acknowledged I was right.
Your diminish brain capacity in this area is no better than the Phelps.
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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Manegarm
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As said not our job to educate you.. Your willful ignorance is impressive however.
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IMHO
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I'm not the one being willfully ignorant. I am finding out that closed minded people have closed minds.
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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Manegarm
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Noep, you're being obtuse and stupid it's not our job to educate you, your disinterest in seeing reality and instead replacing it with your archaic fantasy literature is probably the most blatant ignorant act I've seen here in weeks.
Your shit is weak.
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Nein mann ich will noch nicht gehen
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
I have said nothing that isn't in tune with science.
The truly funny part is, you believe this...
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Manegarm
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I suggest we get IMHO a doctorate in phrenology, and the Nobel price in pseudo-science.
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Nein mann ich will noch nicht gehen
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Scarne
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IMHO posted:
I am ... closed minded
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No one is telling you to stop believing IMHO.
We are saying stop thinking Genesis was written by God and is actually the way it happened.
A man wrote it and used his limited knowledge to explain what happened.
If you believe in it and believe that God created the earth and that Genesis is a holy mans attempt to explain what he saw then fine.
Just stop trying to make it fit with what science has discovered.
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Tych2
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imaloon1 posted:
cobane posted:
IMHO posted:
You're right. God is reality and it hits me every time I open my eyes.
Maybe next time you should ask him to aim for your mouth. It's only polite.
ROFLMAO...
Goddamnit Cobane that was a gem right there...
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IMHO posted:
I'm not the one being willfully ignorant.
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 Where is Skinnyrumcakes when you need him.
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Akza
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reesescups posted:
Akza posted:
and people are surprised why america is getting dumber.
i want to be far, far away from any of you retards that believes in creationism. you got some open spots in sweden manny?
Have you been here for an evolution thread yet?
Oh the dumb ones come running from all over the place to get a bite of that one...
hrmm havent been in an evolution thread here.
not sure that i would want to be 
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Manegarm
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IMHO posted:
Where is Skinnyrumcakes when you need him.
Oh not even that chasm of stupidity, ignorance and bigotry can help you now.
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cobane
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Goddamnit, the grass is greener on IMHO's side of the fence.
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Derasio
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Not sure if this is one of the most polished trolls I have ever seen or if you really are batshite crazy, well done.
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hmmmm
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There are plenty of ways to make the creation story in Genesis work with what science predicts happened. For instance light before the sun? Actually there are many sources of light, not just the sun. There are also many types of light, not just visible light. Short-wave light includes ultraviolet light, X-rays, and others. Long-wave light includes infrared light, radio waves, etc. Light is produced by friction, by fire, by numerous chemical reactions, as well as the nuclear reactions of atomic fission and fusion, which is what we think is occurring in the sun. God had at His fingertips many options to accomplish His purposes. Light does not automatically require the sun. Furthermore, we have important data given by the Hebrew words used in the creation account. When God created "light" in verse 3, the word used connotes the presence of light only, while the word used for "lights" on Day Four is best translated "light bearers," or permanent light sources. I believe in the NT it states in John that God Himself is light. As you can see there are a lot of possibilities that can explain light being present before the sun.
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snarf posted:
God had at His fingertips many options to accomplish His purposes.
could you point us to this finger maybe you have some pictures or some valid evidence of god having to do anything with creation? I mean except your archaic hobby literature?
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IMHO they cannot believe 1 truth, they wont believe 1000. Its not surprising that they wont open their eyes. But if it was as blatantly obvious that science is the only way creation happened, as they say, there wouldn't be so many like you and I here claiming that God did it. Some will believe while others wont. We plant the seed, yet God is the only one that can make it grow. If God has a plan for them they will come to know it. Not on our time or theirs, but Gods.
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The fact is, its not as cut and dry as their God (science) makes it seem. The two are at odds and have been and will always be. The word is foolishness to those that are perishing, they cannot understand it because its spiritually discerned. God made it this way for a reason. Perhaps he knew what he was doing 
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Scarne
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Mastara posted:
IMHO they cannot believe 1 truth, they wont believe 1000. Its not surprising that they wont open their eyes. But if it was as blatantly obvious that God is the only way creation happened, as they say, there wouldn't be so many like you and I here claiming that science did it. Some will believe while others wont. We plant the seed, yet science is the only one that can make it grow. If science has a plan for them they will come to know it. Not on our time or theirs, but science's.
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Mastara posted:
We plant the seed, yet God is the only one that can make it grow.
Light, water, nutrients, and the process of photosynthesis that makes seeds grow. Goof.
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He is speaking metaphorically, Tych... You know.. the seeds of truth, etc.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
He is talking out of his ass, Tych... You know.. the Jesus stuff, etc.
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Case in point IMHO. The same problem existed when Jesus himself walked this earth, people still could not understand and didnt want to believe. The two are always at odds as it must be, it was before Jesus walked this earth, while he was here and is still here long after he raised from the dead.
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:
“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.â€[c]
20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.
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Would The Mist have been more accurate if Carmody and her stooges were atheists?
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Wow snarf entered and then the stupid just slithered in like a foul smelly drugfiend miasma..
Mascara no one cares about you or takes you seriously, you're a fundamentalist nut and a very stupid uneducated one at that.. You're on the lowest wrung of our evolutionary societal ladder, me being a gentleman and a scholar mostly just look at your childish blather with scorn I place a few well versed insults and then I move on.
I'm so happy I live in a nation devoid of people like you.
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Nein mann ich will noch nicht gehen
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Eager_Igraine
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Scarne posted:
IMHO posted:
I think Genesis is a pretty good explanation considering how long it has been around. It still fits into what science says had happened.
Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 don't even agree on the order of things.
Science does not agree with either order.
Of course, Genesis 1 and 2 are different (regional) versions of the same story intertwined. Good stories don't have to be factual to be meaningful and the folks who redacted the Torah were hip to that.
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My day will continue just fine with or without any of you liking me. My family and God are the only opinions I need concern myself with. The rest are like chasing the wind.
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reesescups
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And these people interact with the modern world, vote, and think they 'fit in'...
Holy fuck you creationilist morons are effing hysterical!
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Literal interpretations of the bible as absolute facts...are stupid.
If the god literalists believe in actually exists....he is evil.
Not only evil, he is also a prick, and an asshole...and worshiping him/her/it is an exercise in self flagellation and masochism.
Just sayin....
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The Outpost is always so comical when it tries to talk about religion vs science.
Edit: also,
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_Enkidu_
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Most folks who believe the bible tend to be pricks themselves. The really funny thing is most of them have never even read it. It's literally the stupid leading the lazy.
It's comic gold everytime!
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Wonder how you can call yourself a believer and yet not read the bible. How do you find out who the God you serve is? Or what he is like? Or how he would like you to be? Kind of hard to walk that line without knowing the boundaries. I doubt that statement holds any weight at all. At least about those that believe and have never read the bible.
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_Enkidu_ posted:
Most folks who believe the bible tend to be pricks themselves. The really funny thing is most of them have never even read it. It's literally the stupid leading the lazy.
It's comic gold everytime!
I wasn't just mocking one side.
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_Enkidu_
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Lyken-P posted:
_Enkidu_ posted:
Most folks who believe the bible tend to be pricks themselves. The really funny thing is most of them have never even read it. It's literally the stupid leading the lazy.
It's comic gold everytime!
I wasn't just mocking one side.
Like anyone cares...lol
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Mammogram, nothing I have said is unfactual or metaphysically impossible. As for creationism or a literal interpretation of the creation account in Genesis 1, I do not subscribe to it literally as do some in this thread. I do not argue against it though, because it is metaphysically possible, just improbable.... however IF there is a God then nothing is out of the realm of possibility.
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Scarne
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Mastara posted:
Wonder how you can call yourself a believer and yet not read the bible. How do you find out who the God you serve is? Or what he is like? Or how he would like you to be? Kind of hard to walk that line without knowing the boundaries. I doubt that statement holds any weight at all. At least about those that believe and have never read the bible.
For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
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Lyken-P
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Scarne posted:
For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
It's kinda like science classes. Teacher say "this is what happened"... students say "ok".
It's funny how both are similar in that sense.
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_Enkidu_
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Mastara posted:
Wonder how you can call yourself a believer and yet not read the bible. How do you find out who the God you serve is? Or what he is like? Or how he would like you to be? Kind of hard to walk that line without knowing the boundaries. I doubt that statement holds any weight at all. At least about those that believe and have never read the bible.
Really that's pretty much the whole point of religion, isn't it? Just believe what the clergy is telling you, ignore any facts that get in the way. I mean I get why people a didn't object a couple hundred years ago, but today? It's crazy how people can still buy into this absurdity, but watching them try and make it fit into reality is really entertaining.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
Mammogram, nothing I have said is unfactual or metaphysically impossible. As for creationism or a literal interpretation of the creation account in Genesis 1, I do not subscribe to it literally as do some in this thread. I do not argue against it though, because it is metaphysically possible, just improbable.... however IF there is a God then nothing is out of the realm of possibility.
So no creationism has no validity what so ever in a civilized world, it's thoroughly debunked and anyone sprouting it is a braindead moron.
Zombies and flying unicorns are also possible.. And if there is anything more improbable then undead flesh eaters and flying equines sporting horns it's the idea of God.
You people with your magic and your silly little hopes, it's cute.
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Lyken-P posted:
Scarne posted:
For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
It's kinda like science classes. Teacher say "this is what happened"... students say "ok".
It's funny how both are similar in that sense.
Yeah, except for the fact that that's not science, nor the way it is taugh...
But other than being completely not similar, yeah they are very similar..
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reesescups posted:
Lyken-P posted:
Scarne posted:
For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
It's kinda like science classes. Teacher say "this is what happened"... students say "ok".
It's funny how both are similar in that sense.
Yeah, except for the fact that that's not science, nor the way it is taugh...
If you say so...
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Mastara posted:
Wonder how you can call yourself a believer and yet not read the bible.
The exact same why someone can say god speaks to them. They lie.
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Lyken-P posted:
reesescups posted:
Lyken-P posted:
[quote=Scarne]For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
It's kinda like science classes. Teacher say "this is what happened"... students say "ok".
It's funny how both are similar in that sense.
Yeah, except for the fact that that's not science, nor the way it is taugh...
If you say so... [/quote]
Clearly you've never seen science taught in grad school...lol
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sweeny_comodore
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lol
and i havent even finished reading the first page
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does snarf still need his god shaped hole filled by the one and only, original monothiestic diety?
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Manegarm posted:
IMHO posted:
Where is Skinnyrumcakes when you need him.
Oh not even that chasm of stupidity, ignorance and bigotry can help you now.
Bawhaha
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Manegarm posted:
critical of what you really experienced
I was and am more critical than you can even comprehend. My experiences are mine, and they don't lie.
Spew some more crap to make yourself feel better. Have another drink while you're at it.
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Sezyrrith
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IMHO posted:
Sure...
There are billion and billions of stars in the sky right now, yet at night I still need a flash light.
Are you guys purposely being dense?
So what, you think there's a black velvet screen with holes in it and a flashlight on the other side?
Seriously, try this. Put your flashlight on a windowsill at night, with the flashlight turned on. Walk away from it. When you're 100 feet away from it, does it still seem just as bright to you as it does when you put it an inch from your eyeball?
No, it doesn't. That's because light disperses from its source, not in a straight line (which is about what a laser does, though even that isn't perfect). So, given that information, contrast our sun, which is relatively close, to a star 500 million light years away. Do you REALLY think you get anywhere near 1x10^-15 percent of the total light emanated from it? Not if you understand radiation from a central point vs. distance from the central point. A thousandth of a degree difference between two photons would easily put them at opposite ends of the solar system, if not farther.Lyken-P posted:
Scarne posted:
For the majority of the history of Christianity, only the priesthood read the Bible. Lay people reading the Bible is a relatively modern phenomenon.
It's kinda like science classes. Teacher say "this is what happened"... students say "ok".
It's funny how both are similar in that sense.
Yeah, except science provides actual numbers, along with the ability to find the documented experiment and perform it yourself. Not to mention that the things in science textbooks have been proven by dozens of scientists before even considering acceptance by the scientific community, then scrutinized many times over before finally being written into that textbook. In general, the scientific community as a whole is VERY skeptical about new information. It often takes years for new concepts to gain credibility, and decades to become truly popular.
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I have to agree with you Bubble. Mammy is the Fred Phelps of Atheism. I always find it amazing how they call for logic and then start talking trash and arblegrable. I've done nothing but try to educate him on my faith and he turns it into he's no going to try and educate me
Kind of like someone trying to educate Fred Phelps on homosexuality. Phelps or Mammy won't have anything to do with it. They can't prove it is wrong but will insist that it should be obvious to everyone. What a weak way to debate.
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic and they just return fire with insults. They are like scared children in the dark unwilling to face the monster under the bed, which isn't a monster at all.
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IMHO posted:
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic
I haven't insulted you once. I have laughed at you a lot though.
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youre fail is thinking belief is logic
i dont think you truly understand what logic is.
we dont have to prove you wrong.
you have to prove your worthiness to stand along side true science.
you dont get to put forth a belief, with no evidence, experiments, or even hypothesis, and expect us to accept it just because you feel it in your heart (which by the way, doesnt feel anything except a heart attack).
so while we stand here mocking and ridiculing you for your beliefs, you act as if we are dumb for not believing an unproven and illogical feeling that you have in your ass.
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IMHO posted:
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic...
I have to seriously question this from the guy who doesn't seem to believe in stars.
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Atheist posted:
Here is my paradigm, which I broadcast loudly whenever spirituality is even hinted at...
Theist posted:
I hear and have considered your paradigm. Now here is my paradigm...
Atheist posted:
HAHAHA SHUT UP YOU STUPID CHURCHIE! UR DUMB LOL!
This is what we deal with every single day.
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ZigmundZag
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Right, because believers are the only rational people on this board.
Both sides have their militant morons. For every Enkidu and Mammogram, there's a Mastboro and IMHO.
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BubbleDude posted:
Atheist posted:
Here is my paradigm, which I broadcast loudly whenever spirituality is even hinted at...
Theist posted:
I hear and have considered your paradigm. Now here is my paradigm...
Atheist posted:
HAHAHA SHUT UP YOU STUPID CHURCHIE! UR DUMB LOL!
This is what we deal with every single day.
lol
bad troll is bad troll
at least i hope thats a bad troll
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If both sides feel slighted then here is a novel idea. Stop making threads about religion and no one will be butthurt.
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I was a more militant moron when I was on the atheist side.
I don't have to shout my Christanity in everybody's face. I'm happy with my beliefs, and I persuade by example, not by shoving my smugness up everyone's ass.
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic
I haven't insulted you once. I have laughed at you a lot though.
Logic posted:
There is an event horizon to our knowledge. We will take great steps forward but like chasing a mirage our knowledge will never be complete. We will never know it all. Without "knowing it all" there is no way to see the complete full picture. So to say you know there is no God is the ultimate in human arrogance.
I may never know if God actually exists, but looking at the miracle of our universe, I have faith He does. If you guys choose to hold on to your limited reality, who am I to stop you.
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cobane posted:
According to a Creationist.
posted:
What do creationists say regarding the origin of the oceans? We look to the Biblical model and find that our planet began cool and covered with water (see Genesis 1:2) as opposed to the secular model stating it was molten rock with no water! On the third day of creation, the waters under the heaven were gathered into one place which God called Seas (see Genesis 1:9-10). Centuries later, at the Flood, He again covered the land with water, until the fountains of the deep were closed and the water receded steadily from the earth. As the fountains closed, the ocean floor sank, forming new and much deeper ocean basins (such as the 36,163 foot deep Mariana Trench), permitting the continents to drain and emerge from the waters.
Biblical! Accurate! Certain!
That portion of Genesis is correct, just like a lot of genesis... If you replace days with millions of years.
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Onslaught. posted:
That portion of Genesis is correct, just like a lot of genesis... If you replace the story with science.
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BubbleDude posted:
I was a more militant moron when I was on the atheist side.
I don't have to shout my Christanity in everybody's face. I'm happy with my beliefs, and I persuade by example, not by shoving my smugness up everyone's ass.
you follow that good feeling you have.
the rest of us will rely on testable logic.
when you can show us ANY testable, no matter how remotely innacurate it may be, evidence or experiment to support your feeling, then we will stop mocking you and possibly even allow you to call your feeling a paradigm.
in the mean time, youre just a dumb sap who cant follow logical thought before your own blind feelings.
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IMHO posted:
I may never know if God actually exists, but looking at the miracle of our universe, I have faith He does. If you guys choose to hold on to your limited reality, who am I to stop you.
You are making a critical mistake. I don't care about your faith and you think I do. I don't care what you believe that's personal to you. Why do you fundies just as fundie atheists feel the need to tell us your beliefs? You both make threads like what you think is important to everyone and you NEED everyone to know it.
I am laughing at you, but not for the reason you think.
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Eager_Igraine posted:
Onslaught. posted:
That portion of Genesis is correct, just like a lot of genesis... If you replace the story with science.
Hey, even broken clocks... you know
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
I may never know if God actually exists, but looking at the miracle of our universe, I have faith He does. If you guys choose to hold on to your limited reality, who am I to stop you.
You are making a critical mistake. I don't care about your faith and you think I do. I don't care what you believe that's personal to you. Why do you fundies just as fundie atheists feel the need to tell us your beliefs? You both make threads like what you think is important to everyone and you NEED everyone to know it.
I am laughing at you, but not for the reason you think.
I've noticed, you don't care about my faith and you can't argue with my logic.
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Onslaught. posted:
That portion of Genesis is correct, just like a lot of genesis... If you replace days with millions of years.
Nope. It is still wrong even then.
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Onslaught. posted:
cobane posted:
According to a Creationist.
posted:
What do creationists say regarding the origin of the oceans? We look to the Biblical model and find that our planet began cool and covered with water (see Genesis 1:2) as opposed to the secular model stating it was molten rock with no water! On the third day of creation, the waters under the heaven were gathered into one place which God called Seas (see Genesis 1:9-10). Centuries later, at the Flood, He again covered the land with water, until the fountains of the deep were closed and the water receded steadily from the earth. As the fountains closed, the ocean floor sank, forming new and much deeper ocean basins (such as the 36,163 foot deep Mariana Trench), permitting the continents to drain and emerge from the waters.
Biblical! Accurate! Certain!
That portion of Genesis is correct, just like a lot of genesis... If you replace days with millions of years.
so you believe that the earth originally formed with water, over millions of years. and was once again covered by magical water, that later disappeared, millions of years later?
i think you need to realize that these verses were written, and quite possibly handed down orally over thousands of years before that, in an area where "the world" was litteraly only as far as the eye could see.
if they are living in a fertile area along the medeteranian where the majority of water is held back by sand bars/low lying natural levys, or even locked up in early "frozen earth" glaciers, then its entirely possible that their "entire world" flooded. it is inpossible to determine (and highly unlikely) if they meant pole to pole covered in water. this is an area where your feelings tell you to believe what they say and exaggerate the stories.
evidence does exist to show that the entire mediteranian area has flooded in the past when former "frozen earth" glaciers busted (at least thats the hypothesis put forth) and let loose their tidal waves of water. but even that is impossible to test and can only be guessed at through geological evidence.
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IMHO posted:
I've noticed, you don't care about my faith and you can't argue with my logic.
Why do I want to? What do I get out of it? How does that entertain me?
BT says the same thing. You both have inflated egos if you think you are so important that I must debate you. Your laughing is nervous laughter. Call your sponsor.
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Sezyrrith posted:
IMHO posted:
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic...
I have to seriously question this from the guy who doesn't seem to believe in stars.
Who left the door open?
Where exactly did I say I didn't believe in stars?
What a moran
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Sezyrrith
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IMHO posted:
Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
I may never know if God actually exists, but looking at the miracle of our universe, I have faith He does. If you guys choose to hold on to your limited reality, who am I to stop you.
You are making a critical mistake. I don't care about your faith and you think I do. I don't care what you believe that's personal to you. Why do you fundies just as fundie atheists feel the need to tell us your beliefs? You both make threads like what you think is important to everyone and you NEED everyone to know it.
I am laughing at you, but not for the reason you think.
I've noticed, you don't care about my faith and you can't argue with my logic.
Logic doesn't apply to faith. Logic applies to facts - not to be confused with experiences and beliefs.
Facts have to be supported and provable. You can't prove God exists, therefore that is a belief, which is why it's called faith. If you could prove God existed, then it would no longer be faith, and you wouldn't have to believe - you would know, and it would be a fact.
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[Edit:]Deleted. Exhausted and sick, so it apparently doesn't make as much sense as I'd thought. Would have helped if I weren't distracted while posting.
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Sezyrrith posted:
Logic doesn't apply to faith. Logic applies to facts - not to be confused with experiences and beliefs.
Facts have to be supported and provable. You can't prove God exists, therefore that is a belief, which is why it's called faith. If you could prove God existed, then it would no longer be faith, and you wouldn't have to believe - you would know, and it would be a fact.
you should have just left it with that.
everything you posted afterwards makes you look stupid and kinda negates what i quoted.
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO posted:
I may never know if God actually exists, but looking at the miracle of our universe, I have faith He does. If you guys choose to hold on to your limited reality, who am I to stop you.
You are making a critical mistake. I don't care about your faith and you think I do. I don't care what you believe that's personal to you. Why do you fundies just as fundie atheists feel the need to tell us your beliefs? You both make threads like what you think is important to everyone and you NEED everyone to know it.
I am laughing at you, but not for the reason you think.
That actually makes sense to me. As far as making it plain on how you feel, rather than just throwing up insults. Clear and to the point.
We can't show one another proof, no matter how strongly we feel one way or the other.
It is up to each individual to choose his way and it is pointless beyond measure to argue our points.
~peace
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Sezyrrith posted:
]Logic doesn't apply to faith.
Logic can influence faith.
Can you show me any fault in my logic?
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youre wrong.
there is scientific evidence of everything we have said.
there is valid evidence to support our side.
there is nothing on your side
which, by definition, supports our side.
we dont have to disprove god.
burden of proof on you. not us.
if you want to be taken seriously, then show us even a hint of proof, something we can test and hypothesize around.
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BubbleDude posted:
Manegarm posted:
critical of what you really experienced
I was and am more critical than you can even comprehend. My experiences are mine, and they don't lie.
Spew some more crap to make yourself feel better. Have another drink while you're at it.
Sorry a critical functioning mind would not plummet to the depth of accepting magic just because it "feels right", that's the absence of critical thought.
I love how you people always talk about your faith and substance abuse in the same breath.. It's almost like you weaklings would not have the one without the other.
IMHO posted:
I have to agree with you Bubble. Mammy is the Fred Phelps of Atheism. I always find it amazing how they call for logic and then start talking trash and arblegrable. I've done nothing but try to educate him on my faith and he turns it into he's no going to try and educate me
Kind of like someone trying to educate Fred Phelps on homosexuality. Phelps or Mammy won't have anything to do with it. They can't prove it is wrong but will insist that it should be obvious to everyone. What a weak way to debate.
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic and they just return fire with insults. They are like scared children in the dark unwilling to face the monster under the bed, which isn't a monster at all.
Aaaw you found another uneducated plebe to pat your back how cute.
The only thing you've slapped around is the quality of whatever education you got in your formative years, they obviously did a poor job with you since you seem to adhere to pseudo-science instead of facts.
Faith and scripture and science can NOT be used in the same way. Science is derived from clinical observation, the scientific process and peer review. While religion never changes it just schisms when two parties disagree on which hat is more godly, same book same religion different hats and a few million casualties. And what you've been waving around isn't logic, it's ignorance.
And you've if anything been ridiculed and mocked by every sane person in this thread, not even Snarf is as bold as to go as far off into the deep end as you.. Then again he does have a college degree so that might explain why.
As for open minded you've even give the slightest hint that you could be persuaded to the idea that there is no god, your mind is shut.. Hell you've even gone so far as to replace facts with religious pseudo-science.
I on the other hand I am just asking for a bit of proof, I mean just a sliver of proof.. My mind remains open to the idea of god.
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
]Logic doesn't apply to faith.
Logic can influence faith.
Can you show me any fault in my logic?
you misunderstand the difference between logic and feelings
knowing there isnt a god is the same as knowing there isnt a santa clause or unicorn.
stop being retarded and childish
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IMHO posted:
I've slapped Mammy, Reese and Tych around with logic and they just return fire with insults.
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Halloweve posted:
We can't show one another proof, no matter how strongly we feel one way or the other.
It is up to each individual to choose his way and it is pointless beyond measure to argue our points.
~peace
All I have attempted to do was show my logic at how I arrived at my faith. My logic shows that it is arrogant to not have faith.
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
Logic doesn't apply to faith.
Logic can influence faith.
Can you show me any fault in my logic?
Absolutely. Your 'logic' operates under a faulty assumption, that an atheist specifically 'knows' there is no God. By definition, an atheist has no belief in a God. Not even close to the same thing.
[Edit:]Okay, replace the underlined portion with 'all atheists specifically 'know'. Everyone has a different definition of how they feel about God or the lack thereof.
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You guys would drive Spock MAD!!
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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IMHO posted:
Halloweve posted:
We can't show one another proof, no matter how strongly we feel one way or the other.
It is up to each individual to choose his way and it is pointless beyond measure to argue our points.
~peace
All I have attempted to do was show my logic at how I arrived at my faith. My logic shows that it is arrogant to not have faith.
if your logic lead you to "believe" in magic, then it is flawed.
you might as well have ended up with a belief in leprachauns.
logic does not lead one to make leaps of faith.
is it logical to believe the wind will carry you away to safety if you jump off this cliff?
its illogical to hold that kind of faith. would you try it if your faith was strong enough?
if you felt it in your heart that it was true, would it not still be illogical to jump?
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IMHO posted:
All I have attempted to do was show my logic at how I arrived at my faith.
No one cares though. Why do you think we HAVE to know how you arrived at your faith? Why is it important to you for us to know how you arrived at your faith?
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IMHO posted:
My logic shows that it is arrogant to not have faith.
Whoever taught you logic, find them and get your money back, ASAP!
HTH
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reesescups posted:
IMHO posted:
My logic shows that it is arrogant to not have faith.
Whoever taught you logic, find them and get your money back, ASAP!
HTH
>_<
He does seem to lack some of the cardinal tenets of logic. Faulty assumptions seem to be strongly represented in his statements.
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IMHO.V.2012 is improved and very entertaining. 
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Sezyrrith posted:
Absolutely. Your 'logic' operates under a faulty assumption, that an atheist specifically 'knows' there is no God. By definition, an atheist has no belief in a God. Not even close to the same thing.
Mammy has said he knows there is no God.
Correct they are both beliefs. Why would one persons belief be above anthers? I haven't called anyone names for their beliefs but the Atheists on this broad do nothing but insult, degrade, and whine about people of different beliefs.
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sweeny_comodore posted:
logic does not lead one to make leaps of faith.
Logic built the airplane, faith made the man get in it and fly.
You sir are wrong.
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
Absolutely. Your 'logic' operates under a faulty assumption, that an atheist specifically 'knows' there is no God. By definition, an atheist has no belief in a God. Not even close to the same thing.
Mammy has said he knows there is no God.
Correct they are both beliefs. Why would one persons belief be above anthers? I haven't called anyone names for their beliefs but the Atheists on this broad do nothing but insult, degrade, and whine about people of different beliefs.
symantecs games are semantics games.
from youre point of view one would have to have faith that there is no god.
from a neutral point of view there is no faith in an absence of something.
faith is that your parachute will work when you jump from a plane. its not faith that youre going to die if you jump without one, its fact.
youre semantics are off and the game your playing is for children and people of lower intellect who would need to rely on faith to validate their pathetic existence.
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
Absolutely. Your 'logic' operates under a faulty assumption, that an atheist specifically 'knows' there is no God. By definition, an atheist has no belief in a God. Not even close to the same thing.
Mammy has said he knows there is no God.
Correct they are both beliefs. Why would one persons belief be above anthers? I haven't called anyone names for their beliefs but the Atheists on this broad do nothing but insult, degrade, and whine about people of different beliefs.
Please, find where I've said my belief is above yours. Find where I've called you a name because of your belief. Find my direct insult that wasn't preceded by another. Find where I degrade someone for their beliefs.
Blanket assumptions like this are where your logic has problems.
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Atheist posted:
HAHAHA SHUT UP YOU STUPID CHURCHIE! UR DUMB LOL!
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
Absolutely. Your 'logic' operates under a faulty assumption, that an atheist specifically 'knows' there is no God. By definition, an atheist has no belief in a God. Not even close to the same thing.
Mammy has said he knows there is no God.
Correct they are both beliefs. Why would one persons belief be above anthers? I haven't called anyone names for their beliefs but the Atheists on this broad do nothing but insult, degrade, and whine about people of different beliefs.
Hey, you say there is a god.. Point him out? It should be fairly simple to hand me some reliable facts, it should clear this right up.
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Moe_Nox posted:
IMHO.V.2012 is improved and very entertaining.
That is basically the only logically conclusion, right?
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BubbleDude posted:
Atheist posted:
HAHAHA SHUT UP YOU STUPID CHURCHIE! UR DUMB LOL!
If it bothers you being called stupid I know your imaginary friend is a good listener..
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reesescups posted:
Moe_Nox posted:
IMHO.V.2012 is improved and very entertaining.
That is basically the only logically conclusion, right?
I'm entertained..
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IMHO posted:
Logic built the airplane, faith made the man get in it and fly.
OMG...
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sweeny_comodore posted:
from youre point of view one would have to have faith that there is no god.
from a neutral point of view there is no faith in an absence of something.
So you know it all?
Just because you look around and can't see God doesn't mean he is absent. It means you can't see him. You have to have faith that there is no God.
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IMHO posted:
sweeny_comodore posted:
from youre point of view one would have to have faith that there is no god.
from a neutral point of view there is no faith in an absence of something.
So you know it all?
Just because you look around and can't see God doesn't mean he is absent. It means you can't see him. You have to have faith that there is no God.
lame argument is lame
show me a unicorn.
i dont need faith to know theres no santa clause. why do i need faith to know theres no god?
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IMHO posted:
sweeny_comodore posted:
logic does not lead one to make leaps of faith.
Logic built the airplane, faith made the man get in it and fly.
You sir are wrong.
Actually no, not faith in any god.. Faith in the hypothesis that lead to the construction of the plane through precise calculations and tests that involves elements of the scientific process and observations. Which is a totally different thing.
Now if he was really religious like you he would have leaped off without the plane all together and just died, once again giving Darwin a point in the score column. It's like when one of you retards blow yourself up to dent a Humwee.
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Manegarm posted:
Actually no, not faith in any god.. Faith in the hypothesis that lead to the construction of the plane through precise calculations and tests that involves elements of the scientific process and observations. Which is a totally different thing.
It's called evidence...
Totally foreign concept to IMHO apparently...
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Evidence of God...
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You actually think that there are no logical arguments for God, no inferrential logical deductions, philosophical arguments, no personal testimoy of a person's inner knowledge, and more... You demand evidence, but immediatly cry out you don't like that evidence. Manny claims he is open to the idea of God but then says it is an imaginary belief... that is a contradiction. Now since there is this kind of of evidnence in God, as mentioned above, show me some of this same kind of evidence for a unicorn or santa claus. You can't. Therefore they are not the same at all.
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IMHO posted:
Evidence of imperfect concrete slab created by, mixed and installed by man, infected with a wandering and pollinated seed that happen to take root and enjoy the process of photosynthesis...
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The lovely thing about these Creationism idiots is that they aren't by any means mainstream, most Christians do not believe in it. It's the same sort of people who used to deny that the world is a sphere.
I'd give them a few hundred years to re-align their thinking to reality.
IMHO posted:
Evidence of God...
Evidence of basic biology.. Not proof of any god what so ever.
Pretty flower tho.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
You actually think that there are no logical arguments for God, no inferrential logical deductions, philosophical arguments, no personal testimoy of a person's inner knowledge, and more... You demand evidence, but immediatly cry out you don't like that evidence. Manny claims he is open to the idea of God but then says it is an imaginary belief... that is a contradiction. Now since there is this kind of of evidnence in God, as mentioned above, show me some of this same kind of evidence for a unicorn or santa claus. You can't. Therefore they are not the same at all.
You know - we were able to keep you effers in check for a few hundred years.
We freed slaves
We bumped women up to damn near equal status
Gave everyone the right to vote
Provided civil liberties to everyone (since some wouldn't do that other wise)
Got the government out of our bodies
Got the government out of our bedrooms
And then we advanced human knowledge by over 1,000,000 percent.
And now you BITCHES just want to fuck everything up and turn us into some pseudo Saudi Arabia.
Well Fuck you and Fuck your momma too!
I think it's time for you to just STFU, sit in a god damn corner and just enjoy that which is provided to your ignorant punk arrogant ass.
and by the way - you are welcome. From me and all the other hero's that have served this great country that allows you to be able to be so effing ignorant and stupid.
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Funny, Reese, everything in your list was spearheaded by Christians.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
You actually think that there are no logical arguments for God, no inferrential logical deductions, philosophical arguments, no personal testimoy of a person's inner knowledge, and more... You demand evidence, but immediatly cry out you don't like that evidence. Manny claims he is open to the idea of God but then says it is an imaginary belief... that is a contradiction. Now since there is this kind of of evidnence in God, as mentioned above, show me some of this same kind of evidence for a unicorn or santa claus. You can't. Therefore they are not the same at all.
Logical arguments = Not proof
Philosophical arguments = Not proof
Personal testimony = (Hey I once met this bloke down the pub who swears..) No proof.
That isn't evidence, claiming that it is is just a lie. Hey give me a few thousand years, a few civilizations and a very comprehensive story about Santa or my little pony's and I could easily drum up.
Logical philosophical arguments made by ancient men in togas.
Personal testimony's from men who would swear on their presents that they have actually met Santa or said horned equines.
I'm still waiting on that evidence of yours, I mean besides your gut feeling and the socialization process you've undergone probably by your parents or your social network.
It's very much the same, you guys harp on Scientology all the time and it's complete bogus I know, but give it a few hundred years and presto it's socially accepted because it's always been there.
Just look at Mormonism same thing there, or Protestantism.
edit: Or In IMHO's case his alcoholism.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
Funny, Reese, everything in your list was spearheaded by Christians.
exactly
You think spearheading slavery was a positive
You think spearheading woman oppression was a positive
You think..
You know what - I don't give a shit to go down time travel lane and speak to someone that is stuck in the 1600's.
I thank you for the privilege.
But No Thanks.
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reesescups posted:
/meltdown
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IMHO posted:
EDIT: I mean it's perfectly understandable that you have to resort to fake quote, hyperbole and all that... We get that - you have to try and save face and all...
But really - you have to degrade yourself like that on top of it?
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reesescups posted:
pollinated seed that happen to take root and enjoy the process of photosynthesis
What created photosynthesis?
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
pollinated seed that happen to take root and enjoy the process of photosynthesis
What created photosynthesis?
Evolution.
[Edit:]And yes, I can already predict your next jab at atheists. Google the words "evolution just a theory" (note: without quotes) and find a nice lengthy explanation in the first few links as to why it's called a 'theory' and not a 'law', and what the difference between the two is. Save yourself the post on this one.
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
pollinated seed that happen to take root and enjoy the process of photosynthesis
What created photosynthesis?
Physics and evolution.
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Sezyrrith posted:
Evolution.
What created Evolution?
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IMHO posted:
reesescups posted:
pollinated seed that happen to take root and enjoy the process of photosynthesis
What created photosynthesis?
I can sure as shit guarantee you it wasn't your parents.
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IMHO posted:
Sezyrrith posted:
Evolution.
What created Evolution?
I can sure as shit guarantee you it wasn't your parents.
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Scarne posted:
Physics and evolution.
What created Physics and evolution?
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Haha, Reese is raging! Slavery has always existed, Christianity led humanity to ending it! Womens rights, it was Paul the the apostle who first said the unthinkable... men and women are equal in God's eyes! Science... the fathers of most every scientific field was a Christian, etc etc!
As for Mammogram, evidence is the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid. Everythign I described is a body of information that can lead a person to decide one way or another. There are a myriad of topics that cannot be PROVEN yet we still accept as reasonable or true. Logic is evidence, inductive logic is evidence, design is evidence, thought experiments are evidence, and personal testimonyis evidence (albiet not always strong) my uneducated friend. Show me some philosophers (psst I am not talking about old guys in robes, every awesome university has a philosophy department) that advocate for the existence of santa clause. Show me the testimony of any adult with a GAF score of 90 or higher that believes in santa or unicorns.... You are blind, it is sad.
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IMHO has resorted to a five year old's tactics. You guys are playing right along. The only response that should be given to him is
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Snarf got his 40oz and his special mac daddy decoder ring on TONIGHT
preach it brother preach it!!!
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Reese you may want to go take a breather
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO has resorted to a five year old's tactics. You guys are playing right along. The only response that should be given to him is
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He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
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What I think it awesome...
I am pretty confident IMHO is just effign with everyone.
Snarf and Mastboro though - they are 100% in baby, 100% in!
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Tych2 posted:
IMHO has resorted to a five year old's tactics. You guys are playing right along. The only response that should be given to him is
Yeah, I kinda have to agree on this one. Aiming for a specific result intentionally, by asking only questions that lead to results that support your belief, is not conducive to a good conversation.
[Edit:]Tired. Hopefully fixed a redundancy.
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IMHO posted:
Reese you may want to go take a breather
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IMHO posted:
Tych2 posted:
IMHO has resorted to a five year old's tactics. You guys are playing right along. The only response that should be given to him is
It's okay. I think you should call your sponsor. I am giving you good advice. You'd be a fool to ignore it.
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That's twice or maybe even three times you brought up my alcoholism. I must must really be getting under your skin for you to resort to such tactics.
I apologize. I know you are a better man than that.
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Snarf_Igraine posted:
As for Mammogram, evidence is the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid. Everythign I described is a body of information that can lead a person to decide one way or another. There are a myriad of topics that cannot be PROVEN yet we still accept as reasonable or true. Logic is evidence, inductive logic is evidence, design is evidence, thought experiments are evidence, and personal testimonyis evidence (albiet not always strong) my uneducated friend. Show me some philosophers (psst I am not talking about old guys in robes, every awesome university has a philosophy department) that advocate for the existence of santa clause. Show me the testimony of any adult with a GAF score of 90 or higher that believes in santa or unicorns.... You are blind, it is sad.
Semantics.. /yawn.
You told me to present you with proper bonafide wastes of space that ponder the existence of Santa and Unicorns and I told you what I needed to make that happen.
I'd need a few hundred years of process to fool enough people into believing in unicorns and Santa, then there would have to be a few schism and genocides.
Then we would arrive at your sedated Philosophy major stage where it would be discussed in a proper fashion between people who are too stupid to actually matter to humanity but whom we still pay to sit around and do nothing of importance then play with the ideas of Santa and Unicorns, so that people like you can justify your delusions with a call to authority and education argument.
Religion is just a huge socialization process where magic during the course of time becomes socially accepted through tradition, it's cultural relevance and strife.
But we do not have that much time, as I said earlier Scientology is a great example of a religion which is just as made up as yours has gained some household status and is undergoing a process where it's becoming more and more accepted in society at large, and it's just a few decades old.. I have no idea if it's being discussed in philosophy institutions but if it survives the next hundred or so years it will, I mean we can't have those people actually doing some real work.
Another great example is Mormonism which is a young sprout of the Christian religion which is more or less fully accepted as a household brand even if it's based on the idea that some dude found a bunch of gold tablets out in the woods which only he could read.. Preposterous notion!
And then you have the bible and Protestantism which has just as much magic, superstition, word of mouth history and fiction as the two earlier religions mentioned. It's just that it's real to you because well all the other ones are just crock but yours is real, yeah snarfie.. You could replace Jesus with a holy Unicorn and you idiots would argue if his magical powers was to turn water into lemonade or that he could create sparkly rainbows.
You're just a lemming in a socialization process that has gone on for two thousand years, and it's finally f'kin dying.. I love civilization, overabundance and leisure.
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Origin of the Oceans
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IMHO posted:
That's twice or maybe even three times you brought up my alcoholism. I must must really be getting under your skin for you to resort to such tactics.
I apologize. I know you are a better man than that.
Two things...
One, you aren't capable of getting under my skin. You don't have the necessary tools to accomplish that (which would be knowledge). You aren't the first to claim that you can. You won't be the last.
Two, I am genuinely concerned for you. We know Mastboro is crazy as a loon, but you aren't. This new obsession with making sure everyone knows about your faith is not what you normally do here. When someone steps out of the ordinary you have to look as to why. One of the the few things I know about you is your alcoholism. It's natural for someone to inquire about it if you care about that person.
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IMHO
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Tych2 posted:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLddJ1WceHQ
fixt for accuracy.
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You're Right ~ Koneg
He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
We are here on Earth to fart around. Don't let anybody tell you any different. ~Kurt Vonnegut
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Tych2
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You wound me.
-----signature-----
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Drill Anwar!
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IMHO
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Oh bull...
You're just trying to save face. If you were really concerned you would have PM'd me and would have held back on the insults. I am touching a sore spot with you. I haven't said anything that is outrageous. I've insulted people for their poor reading comprehension not their beliefs. You, Mammy, and Reese however have shoose to insult me at every turn. You could chooose not to post here but you do and cry that I am trying to convert you
How evil are you to pretend that you are concerned about me.
-----signature-----
You're Right ~ Koneg
He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
We are here on Earth to fart around. Don't let anybody tell you any different. ~Kurt Vonnegut
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Manegarm
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I have no problems bringing up your weaknesses you lush.. You've terrorized Bonk over his to the extent that he hates you, so meh..
You're not trying to convert me we're arguing over crap that does not really matter because it's amusing.
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"Damn, Manegarm; you are HAWT!! " - Taolynn
"To the everlasting glory of the infantry, Shines the name Shines the name of Rodger Young"
ALWAYS ANGRY, ALL THE TIME!
Nein mann ich will noch nicht gehen
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reesescups
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IMHO posted:
You, Mammy, and Reese however have shoose to insult me at every turn.
First of all you drunk bastid it's choose.
Second of all - I haven't insulted you - I have insulted your beliefs.
You - You are free to do whatever you god damn please, you are able to think what ever the hell you god damn please. You know why?
Because people like me have put our god damn life on the line so that you have the cushion the freedom to be as sane or as insane as you can handle.
And you know what - I am god damn free as a muther focker to ridicule your beliefs. If you want to life in a country where you don't have to face ridicule, then by all means - hope on a effing plane and fly to religious nutso land the middle east and effing have a blast.
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IMHO
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Do you use a Handi-Wipe or a cloth towel to clean the spittle off your monitor?
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You're Right ~ Koneg
He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
We are here on Earth to fart around. Don't let anybody tell you any different. ~Kurt Vonnegut
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Tych2
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IMHO posted:
Oh bull...
You're just trying to save face. If you were really concerned you would have PM'd me and would have held back on the insults. I am touching a sore spot with you. I haven't said anything that is outrageous. I've insulted people for their poor reading comprehension not their beliefs. You, Mammy, and Reese however have shoose to insult me at every turn. You could chooose not to post here but you do and cry that I am trying to convert you
How evil are you to pretend that you are concerned about me.
You seem very emotional. I am being honest with you but for some reason you are lashing out at me. Even calling me evil. Twice you accused me of insulting you. I haven't. I've only laughed at you.
Save face? What face do I need to save? What sore spot do you think you are touching on me? Convert me? I've never made such a claim.
-----signature-----
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Drill Anwar!
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IMHO
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-----signature-----
You're Right ~ Koneg
He's [Manegarm] like the Fred Phelps of atheism. ~Bubbledude
many of you are in the Republican boat, aka the ship of fools. ~Modeeb
We are here on Earth to fart around. Don't let anybody tell you any different. ~Kurt Vonnegut
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_Enkidu_
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The thing that makes me laugh is how people who claim science gets evolution and most other science topics wrong can even post here. I guess they don't understand that it's the same science that makes their computers safe to use. If you don't think science works in one case, what makes you think it works for the other?
You should probably be living in a cave safe from all this ebil science!
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Moe_Nox
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The thing that makes me laugh is how people who claim religion gets everything wrong can even post here. I guess they don't understand that it's the same religious people (puritans) that came to America to carve out an area for acceptance and tolerance. If you don't think religion works, but dwell in the land of free speech first begun by the religious, you are pretty much a backwards thinking intolerant juvenile.
You would probably be living in racist xenophobic Europe if it wasn't for the religious.
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_Enkidu_
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Religion was such a deterent to a modern state, the people who put the US together specifically exiled religion from state decisions. America isn't great because it allows relgion, it's great because it protects the state and the people from religion.
The US became a world power by embracing science, end of story.
How are you posting from your cave?
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Moe_Nox
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_Enkidu_ posted:
The US became a world power by embracing science, end of story.
Not quite sig worthy, but funny none the less.
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Manegarm
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_Enkidu_ posted:
Religion was such a deterent to a modern state, the people who put the US together specifically exiled religion from state decisions. America isn't great because it allows relgion, it's great because it protects the state and the people from religion.
The US became a world power by embracing science, end of story.
How are you posting from your cave?
QFT.
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"Damn, Manegarm; you are HAWT!! " - Taolynn
"To the everlasting glory of the infantry, Shines the name Shines the name of Rodger Young"
ALWAYS ANGRY, ALL THE TIME!
Nein mann ich will noch nicht gehen
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_Enkidu_
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I like how the religious zealots and apologists like to frame the sides of the debate equally? Really?
It's more like this:
Religious person: I want to believe crazy stories!!
Reasoning person: Why on earth would you believe any of that?
What indication have you ever had that any of it was real?
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