Sansfear
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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This is happening to a couple here in Phoenix.
Current appraised value of the property = $48K
Total owed on 1st and 2nd mortgage = $141K
The state is going to take their home through eminent domain to build a freeway interchange and, by law, is not allowed to pay negative equity.
So while they are able to pay their current mortgage, they are going to be forced to sell and take a $93K loss.
http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_west_valley/goodyear/valley-family-close-to-moving-due-to-eminent-domain
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Bjorvald
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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>> and, by law, is not allowed to pay negative equity.
Change the law?
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cabbyman
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Start a fire.
Claim insurance.
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Aerlinthian
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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We've gone from a banana republic to a rotten banana in short order. What is being done to people by government are exactly the kind of things that lead to a hostile disaffected public who are quickly running out of options for dealing with a malicious and capricious master.
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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 (@ Cabby, not arglebargledouche).
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SoBaKi
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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cabbyman posted:
Start a fire.
Claim insurance.
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dae_trist
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Aerlinthian posted:
It's impossible for private entities to do anything bad
If we had anarchy there's nothing stopping a private military from killing the inhabitants and building a road over their house
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theredkay1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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eminent domain is always pretty shady
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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P.S. They've probably known this was going to happen for at least 5+ years and possibly since before they moved in (11 years ago). Highway construction moves sloooowly.
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Thugoneous
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Yukishiro1 posted:
P.S. They've probably known this was going to happen for at least 5+ years and possibly since before they moved in (11 years ago). Highway construction moves sloooowly.
That changes everything.
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Ashmaele
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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This looks like a matter for the courts to resolve if the legislature won't.
What constitutes "fair and just compensation?" Depends on your pov
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Brother_Tempus
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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dae_trist posted:
Aerlinthian posted:
It's impossible for private entities to do anything bad
If we had anarchy there's nothing stopping a private military
other militias
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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If you buy a house for 30k and the value is now 300k should the state have to pay 300k or just 30k?
It seems like people want to have their cake and eat it too. If you make a bad investment in a home - especially if you're aware it may get condemned in the future - it seems like blaming the state is the wrong thing to do.
Can you imagine the outrage at a contrary rule? Someone could load up debt on their property when they knew it was going to be condemned and then demand it be paid off.
Also, some of that is a 2nd mortgage. I.e. not something they used to buy the house but for other purposes.
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dae_trist
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Brother_Tempus posted:
dae_trist posted:
Aerlinthian posted:
It's impossible for private entities to do anything bad
If we had anarchy there's nothing stopping a private military
other militias
That's not going to happen. They are just as likely to take part and split the profit.
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Ashmaele
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Yukishiro1 posted:
If you buy a house for 30k and the value is now 300k should the state have to pay 300k or just 30k?
It seems like people want to have their cake and eat it too. If you make a bad investment in a home - especially if you're aware it may get condemned in the future - it seems like blaming the state is the wrong thing to do.
Can you imagine the outrage at a contrary rule? Someone could load up debt on their property when they knew it was going to be condemned and then demand it be paid off.
Also, some of that is a 2nd mortgage. I.e. not something they used to buy the house but for other purposes.
These are all good points.
But it isn't just the homeowner getting screwed. The mortgage company is getting screwed too. So I expect the law to get changed.
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reesescups
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Ashmaele posted:
These are all good points.
But it isn't just the homeowner getting screwed. The mortgage company is getting screwed too. So I expect the law to get changed.
The lender also potentially knew this was going to happen as well, if not at the initial purchase, at least by the refinance time.
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theredkay1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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But we must not hold the lender responsible for that decision. Tis unamerican! 
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Tych2
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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SoBaKi posted:
cabbyman posted:
Start a fire.
Claim insurance.
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Altra_Shadowstalker
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What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Uh, stop paying the mortgage, let the bank seize the house and it's their problem now.
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Altra_Shadowstalker posted:
Uh, stop paying the mortgage, let the bank seize the house and it's their problem now.
Yeah, except that you'll need to live somewhere else and there's no way you're getting another mortage after just having walked away from the last one.
I guess they could go rent somewhere for 7 years or however long it takes to purge that off your credit.
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Abaddon_Ambrosius
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Yukishiro1 posted:
If you buy a house for 30k and the value is now 300k should the state have to pay 300k or just 30k?
It seems like people want to have their cake and eat it too. If you make a bad investment in a home - especially if you're aware it may get condemned in the future - it seems like blaming the state is the wrong thing to do.
Forcing someone to realize a loss because the expiry on that loan has gone from 25 years out to "now"... forcing someone to realize a loss they wouldn't have otherwise realized... is not the same thing. If you're being intellectually honest, you know that.
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DemonicXH
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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cabbyman posted:
Start a fire.
Claim insurance.
You take a chance of it being ruled intentional, whether they prosecute you or not. The insurance company has no obligation to pay if it's ruled an intentional act.
Then you're stuck with a mortgage, no house to sell and the local government taking what's left of your property.
Easier to make a stink about it and let the courts decide.
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Abaddon_Ambrosius posted:
Forcing someone to realize a loss because the expiry on that loan has gone from 25 years out to "now"... forcing someone to realize a loss they wouldn't have otherwise realized... is not the same thing.
It was going to be a loss either way.
Apparently they also knew about the possibility of the property being condemned before they bought it. Certainly by the time of the 2nd mortgage. Which isn't even properly part of the "loss" because 2nd mortgages arn't about financing the house, they're about financing buying a new car or another house or sending a kid to college or something like that.
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Abaddon_Ambrosius
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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Yukishiro1 posted:
Abaddon_Ambrosius posted:
Forcing someone to realize a loss because the expiry on that loan has gone from 25 years out to "now"... forcing someone to realize a loss they wouldn't have otherwise realized... is not the same thing.
It was going to be a loss either way.
You're playing at being this obtuse, right? That must be it.
It is a loss because it is being forced "now".
That same property may not be a loss 5 years from now, or 10 years. But they no longer have the option to wait it out. They're forced to take a loss artificially now.
Jesus, this isn't even that fancy MBA stuff. Try and keep up Bloat Boy...
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Yukishiro1
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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If it's underwater by nearly as much as the article seems to imply it was going to be a loss either way. Property that lost more than half its value in the last couple years is not about to shoot back up and suddenly turn out to have been a great investment.
But maybe it isn't underwater that much because maybe most of that is the 2nd mortgage. Which really has nothing to do with whether it's underwater or not.
The article is stupid in multiple ways. And the idea the government should pay some theoretic value or whatever the person paid for it or something like that is also stupid and very prone to abuse.
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gatzby
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Subject:
What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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This is one of the few times I would be all for a strategic default.
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Bobvillas
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What should be done when the state uses eminent domain on a property that is underwater?
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cabbyman posted:
Pay neighbor to start a fire.
Claim insurance.
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