JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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True story. Look at his charitable donations.
Source
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suntzukali2
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Mitt Romney is a guy who ran a group of investors that would buy companies then basically sell them off piece by piece to foreign interest because their was quick buck in it for him and his investors. Is it illegal no. But the guy is running for President of the United States and he no moral objections to doing that.
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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suntzukali2 posted:
Mitt Romney is a guy who ran a group of investors that would buy companies then basically sell them off piece by piece to foreign interest because their was quick buck in it for him and his investors. Is it illegal no. But the guy is running for President of the United States and he no moral objections to doing that.
What does that have to do with the fact that he has given millions to help the poor when you haven't? And besides, your facts are off. His group of investors funded many startup companies, such as Staples. And yes, they also bought companies like Ampad and sold them later piece when they started having financial troubles, but after they had seen their revenue go from 100 million to over 500 million a year.
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Poit-Narf
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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It's relevant because he believes corporations are people. He made his fortune buying and selling people, as far as he's concerned.
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suntzukali2
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
suntzukali2 posted:
Mitt Romney is a guy who ran a group of investors that would buy companies then basically sell them off piece by piece to foreign interest because their was quick buck in it for him and his investors. Is it illegal no. But the guy is running for President of the United States and he no moral objections to doing that.
What does that have to do with the fact that he has given millions to help the poor when you haven't? And besides, your facts are off. His group of investors funded many startup companies, such as Staples. And yes, they also bought companies like Ampad and sold them later piece when they started having financial troubles, but after they had seen their revenue go from 100 million to over 500 million a year.
its relevant because the guy is scum. I'm not going to pretend he isn't because some ledger says he gave so much money for this or that.
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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I wouldn't expect militant leftys to understand these simple facts, but I still have to do my part on the innernets and inform you people. Maybe, just maybe one will see reality and say oh yeah, he did. And then we get down to real issues, like what's the plan to create jobs.
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Rhodoman
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
I wouldn't expect militant leftys to understand these simple facts
It's the same reason they get private equity firms' actions wrong. It's easier to put a political enemy in the same box with Gordon Gecko than it is to actually think.
Rho
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Ah-Schoo
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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I smell some partisan hackery in here.
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Ptilk
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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So....he made tens of millions putting some people out of work, destroying their retirements, and making them poor....but he gave back a small percentage of that money to other poor people (and got a huge tax break in the process)?
Wow, he sure has helped a lot of poor people. 
Mostly by helping them get poor in the first place.
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-Rando-
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I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
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Rhodoman
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
You've got your straw hat on early, this morning.
Rho
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Ah-Schoo posted:
I smell some partisan hackery in here.
I KNOW AND I AM SO TIRED OF IT!!!!!!!!!!!  It will only end when people see the light and agree with me.
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Element_X
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-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
That's easy for you to say, when you haven't been on the receiving end of Mormon tithe payers like I have. My wife is an active Mormon. I honestly had to be dragged to church with her on Sundays because Id rather stay at home and watch TV. And when she asked me early on in our marriage if I would give 10% of my income to her church I sortof balked.
That was until 2008 when my whole world was turned upside down and the company I worked with was gone overnight.
Without question, and without ever even asked to pay back, her church 1) Paid my $2500 rent/util payments for 4 months, 2) made my $600 minivan payment and insurance, and every single day members brought food from the Bishops Storehouse. Also free help watching the kids while I looked for work, and even put me into an employment services to help me find a job.
All this is possible because people like Mitt Romney paid tithing. I didnt have to turn to the government for welfare or unemployment, and they helped us to our feet.
Ever since, Ive gladly given up 10% because I see firsthand how beneficial it is.
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_Gimpzilla_
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Rhodoman posted:
-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
You've got your straw hat on early, this morning.
Rho
But is he wearing magic underpants?
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JD_HOGG
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Make your own thread for religious attacks! This thread is all about Mitt Romney's generosity, and other people's stinginess.
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-Rando-
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Element_X posted:
-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
That's easy for you to say, when you haven't been on the receiving end of Mormon tithe payers like I have. My wife is an active Mormon. I honestly had to be dragged to church with her on Sundays because Id rather stay at home and watch TV. And when she asked me early on in our marriage if I would give 10% of my income to her church I sortof balked.
That was until 2008 when my whole world was turned upside down and the company I worked with was gone overnight.
Without question, and without ever even asked to pay back, her church 1) Paid my $2500 rent/util payments for 4 months, 2) made my $600 minivan payment and insurance, and every single day members brought food from the Bishops Storehouse. Also free help watching the kids while I looked for work, and even put me into an employment services to help me find a job.
All this is possible because people like Mitt Romney paid tithing. I didnt have to turn to the government for welfare or unemployment, and they helped us to our feet.
Ever since, Ive gladly given up 10% because I see firsthand how beneficial it is.
I guess your wife gets to spend eternity making soul babies to populate planets now?
EDIT: But on a side note, if you had taken 10% of your salary and kept it for all the years you paid the tithe, how much would you have had to take care of the problems yourself?
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Rhodoman
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-Rando- posted:
EDIT: But on a side note, if you had taken 10% of your salary and kept it for all the years you paid the tithe, how much would you have had to take care of the problems yourself?
And next you'll be using this as an argument against any kind of insurance, right?
'Cause you're consistent like that.
Rho
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-Rando-
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Rhodoman posted:
-Rando- posted:
EDIT: But on a side note, if you had taken 10% of your salary and kept it for all the years you paid the tithe, how much would you have had to take care of the problems yourself?
And next you'll be using this as an argument against any kind of insurance, right?
'Cause you're consistent like that.
Rho
No, because insurance is a contract. There's no contract that says the Mormon church has to take care of people who pay tithes, how much they have to pay out, or how long. You're trusting the benevolence of people over the rigors of contract law. The two things aren't even comparable.
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Rhodoman
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Okay, so you're NOT consistent.
Shocker.
Rho
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-Rando-
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Rhodoman posted:
Okay, so you're NOT consistent.
Shocker.
Rho
How about you send me 10% of your paycheck, and then maybe if you ever need some help, I'll swoop in and save the day.
Maybe.
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JD_HOGG
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You can't compare Jesus to Allstate! Anyway back on topic. Mitt Romney has donated more of something that we all have to the poor than anyone in this thread has donated. And that something is time, what he put into the Tyler Charitable Foundation. How many of you have taken the time to set up a foundation?
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JD_HOGG posted:
You can't compare Jesus to Allstate! Anyway back on topic. Mitt Romney has donated more of something that we all have to the poor than anyone in this thread has donated. And that something is time, what he put into the Tyler Charitable Foundation. How many of you have taken the time to set up a foundation?
Bill Gates has probably saved more lives than any human being alive today. Obviously he should be crowned emperor of the world!
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Rando- posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
You can't compare Jesus to Allstate! Anyway back on topic. Mitt Romney has donated more of something that we all have to the poor than anyone in this thread has donated. And that something is time, what he put into the Tyler Charitable Foundation. How many of you have taken the time to set up a foundation?
Bill Gates has probably saved more lives than any human being alive today. Obviously he should be crowned emperor of the world!
Bill Gates is not in this here thread, and he's not dissing Romney claiming he hates the poor.
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-Rando-
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
Bill Gates is not in this here thread, and he's not dissing Romney claiming he hates the poor.
Wasn't it just yesterday that Mitt Romney said he doesn't care about the very poor?
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KonorLc
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Romney didn't just donate to the LDS church. I believe he donated around 3 million to other charities as well.
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Rando- posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
Bill Gates is not in this here thread, and he's not dissing Romney claiming he hates the poor.
Wasn't it just yesterday that Mitt Romney said he doesn't care about the very poor?
He said he wasn't concerned for the poor because they have safety nets and that his main concern is for the middle class who is getting a raw deal.
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-Rando-
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
He said he wasn't concerned for the poor
Yes he did.
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Rando- posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
He said he wasn't concerned for the poor
Yes he did.
Context taker outer ofer.
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Jezza_Belle
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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so, Element was one of the 10 poor Mormons...
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
Context taker outer ofer.
Even in context, his response was a gaffe. I know this is a troll thread, and thus I should eschew serious discussions, but the idea that a Republican presidential candidate would take for granted the existence of social safety nets like UI, Medicaid, food stamps, etc. when the overall Republican theme this election cycle has been to attack those programs is striking. I mean, if Mitt recognizes the need for social safety nets, maybe he should tell his party!
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Element_X
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-Rando- posted:
Element_X posted:
-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
That's easy for you to say, when you haven't been on the receiving end of Mormon tithe payers like I have. My wife is an active Mormon. I honestly had to be dragged to church with her on Sundays because Id rather stay at home and watch TV. And when she asked me early on in our marriage if I would give 10% of my income to her church I sortof balked.
That was until 2008 when my whole world was turned upside down and the company I worked with was gone overnight.
Without question, and without ever even asked to pay back, her church 1) Paid my $2500 rent/util payments for 4 months, 2) made my $600 minivan payment and insurance, and every single day members brought food from the Bishops Storehouse. Also free help watching the kids while I looked for work, and even put me into an employment services to help me find a job.
All this is possible because people like Mitt Romney paid tithing. I didnt have to turn to the government for welfare or unemployment, and they helped us to our feet.
Ever since, Ive gladly given up 10% because I see firsthand how beneficial it is.
I guess your wife gets to spend eternity making soul babies to populate planets now?
EDIT: But on a side note, if you had taken 10% of your salary and kept it for all the years you paid the tithe, how much would you have had to take care of the problems yourself?
You either missed the point on purpose, or by accident. Either way it doesn't matter. You missed it. And thats ok 
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Element_X posted:
You either missed the point on purpose, or by accident. Either way it doesn't matter. You missed it. And thats ok
I missed neither. If you think 10% of your pre-tax income is a good deal to have a Mormon safety net to catch you, have fun handing your money over. Don't pretend it's a "charitable donation," though. For the religious, this is an obligation, a pillar of your faith that is necessary in order to be considered righteous. Do Mormons do some good work with the money? I'm sure they do. Do they also build absurdly lavish temples, hold investments, and use the money to pay for salaries and housing for high ranking elders and bishops? You betcha. Is there any budget accountability at all for the Mormon church? From what I've read, no. Trying to find out how much money the church has and how it spends it is almost an act of futility.
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armsowned
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
True story. Look at his charitable donations.
Source
for extreme tax cuts
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Rhodoman
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Rando- posted:
I missed neither. If you think 10% of your pre-tax income is a good deal to have a Mormon safety net to catch you, have fun handing your money over. Don't pretend it's a "charitable donation," though. For the religious, this is an obligation, a pillar of your faith that is necessary in order to be considered righteous. Do Mormons do some good work with the money? I'm sure they do. Do they also build absurdly lavish temples, hold investments, and use the money to pay for salaries and housing for high ranking elders and bishops? You betcha. Is there any budget accountability at all for the Mormon church? From what I've read, no. Trying to find out how much money the church has and how it spends it is almost an act of futility.
The enormity of error in this paragraph is breathtaking.
Rho
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Immortal_Haze
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I'm not gonna comment on the Mormon thing because I'm not going to judge them for their beliefs. But I thought Element was some bigshot financial investment guy in his other life...
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JD_HOGG posted:
-Rando- posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
Bill Gates is not in this here thread, and he's not dissing Romney claiming he hates the poor.
Wasn't it just yesterday that Mitt Romney said he doesn't care about the very poor?
He said he wasn't concerned for the poor because they have safety nets and that his main concern is for the middle class who is getting a raw deal.
Safety nets that he plans to dismantle...
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-Rando-
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Rhodoman posted:
-Rando- posted:
I missed neither. If you think 10% of your pre-tax income is a good deal to have a Mormon safety net to catch you, have fun handing your money over. Don't pretend it's a "charitable donation," though. For the religious, this is an obligation, a pillar of your faith that is necessary in order to be considered righteous. Do Mormons do some good work with the money? I'm sure they do. Do they also build absurdly lavish temples, hold investments, and use the money to pay for salaries and housing for high ranking elders and bishops? You betcha. Is there any budget accountability at all for the Mormon church? From what I've read, no. Trying to find out how much money the church has and how it spends it is almost an act of futility.
The enormity of error in this paragraph is breathtaking.
Rho
Please, point out the errors then.
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-Ronsac-
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Pointing out errors would take a lot more effort than a vague one liner and a sign off, so don't hold your breath waiting for it to happen.
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Rhodoman
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-Ronsac- posted:
Pointing out errors would take a lot more effort than a vague one liner and a sign off, so don't hold your breath waiting for it to happen.
Let him hold his breath. At the very least it would be funnier.
Rho
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People turning blue is only funny when it takes place in a chocolate factory, otherwise it is tragic.
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Rhodoman
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WE are the music makers
and
WE are the dreamers of dreams.
Rho
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Second_Chance
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Made perfect sense to me Rando. /shrug
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Since Rho has posted twice now without pointing out a single error in the paragraph above, I guess it's safe to assume everything that I said is factual and unarguably accurate.
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Second_Chance
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I'm not so sure you can tell him not to call it a charitable donation. Legally it is, and I reckon on some levels that makes it more palatable individually. It sounds good to the ear (altruistic and all), and helps on the taxable bottom line.
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Element_X
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No, you did miss it. And you're mistaken about a few things.
But like I said, its ok. I don't care to waste any effort because you're not objective or open minded it seems.
So, hug?
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Hyperimiator
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Element_X posted:
-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
That's easy for you to say, when you haven't been on the receiving end of Mormon tithe payers like I have. My wife is an active Mormon. I honestly had to be dragged to church with her on Sundays because Id rather stay at home and watch TV. And when she asked me early on in our marriage if I would give 10% of my income to her church I sortof balked.
That was until 2008 when my whole world was turned upside down and the company I worked with was gone overnight.
Without question, and without ever even asked to pay back, her church 1) Paid my $2500 rent/util payments for 4 months, 2) made my $600 minivan payment and insurance, and every single day members brought food from the Bishops Storehouse. Also free help watching the kids while I looked for work, and even put me into an employment services to help me find a job.
All this is possible because people like Mitt Romney paid tithing. I didnt have to turn to the government for welfare or unemployment, and they helped us to our feet.
Ever since, Ive gladly given up 10% because I see firsthand how beneficial it is.
Communist!
actually good story 'bro but why a tax deduction still bothers me
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Anebriated
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why is it called a charity? element just explained to us how it's actually a reciprocal relationship.
plus, he's an investor! what's wrong with investing in the security of your soul? it will pay off later.
besides, he's just doing what is expected. nothing wrong with that.
what's this thread about again?
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NeoKarnak
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If I was worth as much as Romney (in dollars), I would have done way more for the poor than he has because I would have paid millions to a church. I would have used it on, you know...the poor.
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Xanzo
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I am the poor, I help myself more than Mitt Romney helps me.
Also, Mitt Romney wouldn't make donations if he didn't think it helped him.
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Xanzo posted:
Also, Mitt Romney wouldn't make donations if he didn't think it helped him.
You sound very sure.
Rho
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ACX
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Element_X posted:
-Rando- posted:
I don't think giving money to a church so that you get special favors in your next life (which for him means being the intergalactic ruler of a planet) is really all that charitable.
That's easy for you to say, when you haven't been on the receiving end of Mormon tithe payers like I have. My wife is an active Mormon. I honestly had to be dragged to church with her on Sundays because Id rather stay at home and watch TV. And when she asked me early on in our marriage if I would give 10% of my income to her church I sortof balked.
That was until 2008 when my whole world was turned upside down and the company I worked with was gone overnight.
Without question, and without ever even asked to pay back, her church 1) Paid my $2500 rent/util payments for 4 months, 2) made my $600 minivan payment and insurance, and every single day members brought food from the Bishops Storehouse. Also free help watching the kids while I looked for work, and even put me into an employment services to help me find a job.
All this is possible because people like Mitt Romney paid tithing. I didnt have to turn to the government for welfare or unemployment, and they helped us to our feet.
Ever since, Ive gladly given up 10% because I see firsthand how beneficial it is.
That's actually pretty cool. If the church actually does take care of its own like that I just might have to change my opinion on the mandatory tithing.
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notmforce2k
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He also has the means to do more than I have.
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Aerlinthian
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Corporate structures have been allowed to become wired up in such a way that ironically is anti capitalism. I'm not sure there is even a word that describes the nature of contemporary incorporation. The effect of this wiring is that small business which is where you get the greatest initial creative and motivated energy have been made to be prohibitive to get into and maintain which is bad because you want wealth potentials to be broad.
People can claim that they are capitalists but if you have an unlimited tolerance for wealth concentration, at some point that is going to bite you in the ass hard when your balance between haves and have nots is horrendously intolerable to the majority which is how societies cycle through some very bad economic times and advances the cause of socialists/communists who also don't get it right for what capitalism can do to life a society up.
If there is any doubt, look at China which is on a rocket ride of internal capitalism. Their internal expansion is happening at a rate that staggering because they are utilizing one of their biggest resources, human energy.
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Gaevren
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-Rando- posted:
Rhodoman posted:
-Rando- posted:
I missed neither. If you think 10% of your pre-tax income is a good deal to have a Mormon safety net to catch you, have fun handing your money over. Don't pretend it's a "charitable donation," though. For the religious, this is an obligation, a pillar of your faith that is necessary in order to be considered righteous. Do Mormons do some good work with the money? I'm sure they do. Do they also build absurdly lavish temples, hold investments, and use the money to pay for salaries and housing for high ranking elders and bishops? You betcha. Is there any budget accountability at all for the Mormon church? From what I've read, no. Trying to find out how much money the church has and how it spends it is almost an act of futility.
The enormity of error in this paragraph is breathtaking.
Rho
Please, point out the errors then.
I think the only temple on the planet that could be called anything close to "absurdedly lavish" would be the Salt Lake Temple. The one that was a huge community project, that nearly everyone worked on in an enormous volunteer effort. Before the church had gobs of money and most of the people had just gotten to Utah not long after being hounded, run out of their homes. Many lost most, if not all of their possessions. Many lost their lives, either at the hands of mobs or the privations from traveling to someplace they hopefully wouldn't be harassed. The rest of the temples are fairly modest. Some are large, yes (DC springs to mind) but I would hardly call them lavish.
I'm sure the church invests at least part of the money it receives. But not a single bishop, elder, priest, apostle, prophet, etc. receives a salary. They fulfill those responsibilities in addition to holding regular jobs, or they are retired. The church does employ people, but not for those working in a spiritual capacity. They employ people to run their websites, to maintain the temples and church buildings, things like that.
I couldn't tell you thing one about the overall church budget, how much money it has, or how it uses it. I've never considered it to be a good use of my time- but I also have never bothered to look at any other church's financial doings, Catholics, Scientologists, or other.
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Kanga_Roo
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There are a lot of errors here. I'm going to answer a few just to show neither side is altogether right.
The Mormon Church does not have paid clergy (sorry Rando). If you go into their churches you will probably find them quite plain. The temples are nicer but extravagant? I dunno even the Temple in SLC was mostly donated time and effort by the members.
The "welfare" program is not funded via tithing - it is funded via fast offerings. Once a month Mormons fast for a day. Then they give the cash they would have spent on food towards a "fast offering." This is what helps people in need. (Sorry Element) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_offering Frankly some tithing might end up as "welfare" but it is unknown because the church does not release financial details.
Interestingly the Mormons tried what most would call communism. According to dogma it failed not because it was immoral but because the members weren't ready for it. Church run communism is the higher law.
Tithing
In the early 19th century, Mormons adopted a communal economic system called "the United Order." Members of the Church gave everything they earned to the Church, and the Church redistributed those earnings according to individual members' needs. Some early members, however, lacking the required dedication, resisted this system. God, recognizing that the Church was not prepared for this higher law, instructed us to switch over to capitalism. In place of the United Order, God established the twin commandments of tithing, designed to care for the financial needs of the Church, and fast offerings (described above), designed to care for the financial needs of the poor.
Tithing, defined as 10% of one's earnings, is a financial offering given to God by way of the Church. Like many of God's commandments, the practice also has Old-Testament origins. Tithing funds are used to build chapels and temples, finance the Church's missionary program, and in general to build up and strengthen what Mormons consider to be God's kingdom on earth.
http://www.allaboutmormons.com/mormon_beliefs_commandments.php
Finally my opinion, not fact. Giving to your church is not at all a one to one equivalent to giving to the needy. For example, proselytizing is not the same as helping a brother out IMO. I was raised Mormon. They do take care of their own. That is good but it is not particularly admirable. It is taking care of those that are not part of your group or flock or faith that I find to be Christ-like. Mormons do some of that. We all do. We should all do more.
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notmforce2k
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Hmm.
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-Rando-
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Clearly, the Mormons above are right, and these temples aren't "lavish"
This unlavish temple that can't be seen from every mountain dominating the SLC landscape:
And this one I drive past rather often:
Certainly this isn't:
And this is basically just a store front where parishioners meet:
Nothing lavish so far..
And don't give me the b.s. about no "paid clergy." They certainly do have high ranking church officials who live in housing paid for by the LDS church and are given a "living allowance." How much this is, who knows? Nobody, because unlike most other churches, the LDS isn't accountable to church members for its budget.
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JD_HOGG
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-Rando- posted:
Clearly, the Mormons above are right, and these temples aren't "lavish"
And this one I drive past rather often:
I grew up in the Washington area, I was so disappoint to find out that wasn't Disney world
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Velvet_Ice
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-Rando- posted:
And don't give me the b.s. about no "paid clergy." They certainly do have high ranking church officials who live in housing paid for by the LDS church and are given a "living allowance." How much this is, who knows? Nobody, because unlike most other churches, the LDS isn't accountable to church members for its budget.
Source?
Never mind, found it myself.
Looky
Some members of the Church are unaware that at least some General Authorities do receive a modest living stipend. While it is true that some Church leaders receive a living allowance while they serve in a given position, it cannot be said that the Church has a professional ministry in the traditional sense.
Some positions in the Church, namely a call to serve in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles or the First Quorum of the Seventy, are “for life†positions, meaning that the man chosen to fill the position serves until the end of his life. In such cases, if required, they are also given a modest living allowance. While many members of the Church are unaware of these allowances, that they exist and that they are comparatively modest was acknowledged in general conference by President Gordon B. Hinckley: “... the living allowances given the General Authorities, which are very modest in comparison with executive compensation in industry and the professions, come from this business income and not from the tithing of the people.[1] Calls to other Quorums of the Seventy do not require the same full-time commitment, therefore those who serve these positions do not receive a living allowance.
A call to serve as a General Authority usually comes later in life, and none of these men has depended upon their Church service for their "career" or "income." Given the high caliber accomplishments of those called to full-time service, it is reasonable to expect that they could make a lot more money (with less trouble) in some other field of endeavor.
The fact that this stipend exists has not been hidden. As President Hinckley noted in General Conference:
Merchandising interests are an outgrowth of the cooperative movement which existed among our people in pioneer times. The Church has maintained certain real estate holdings, particularly those contiguous to Temple Square, to help preserve the beauty and the integrity of the core of the city. All of these commercial properties are tax-paying entities.
I repeat, the combined income from all of these business interests is relatively small and would not keep the work going for longer than a very brief period.
I should like to add, parenthetically for your information, that the living allowances given the General Authorities, which are very modest in comparison with executive compensation in industry and the professions, come from this business income and not from the tithing of the people.[2]
Many Church General Authorities come from respected professions from which they make a substantial living. Dedicating themselves full time at the sacrifice of substantial careers, these leaders live modestly, work tirelessly, keep grueling travel schedules, and continue doing so well past an age when others retire. They are also demonstrably men of education and accomplishment; one can hardly claim that they were unsuited for work in the world given their accomplishments prior to being called to full-time Church service. No tithing funds provide for stipends; such funds are drawn from business income earned by Church investments
And as to the buildings being lavish, would you say that almost all Catholic cathedrals are lavish? I've had multiple people confuse a LDS temple with a Catholic Cathedral. I personally think they are all beautiful buildings but I wouldnt call any of them lavish.
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JD_HOGG
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Velvet_Ice posted:
-Rando- posted:
And don't give me the b.s. about no "paid clergy." They certainly do have high ranking church officials who live in housing paid for by the LDS church and are given a "living allowance." How much this is, who knows? Nobody, because unlike most other churches, the LDS isn't accountable to church members for its budget.
Source?
http://mormon.org/faq/no-paid-clergy/
Why don’t Mormons have paid clergy?
Andrew answered…
The highest leaders in the LDS church do receive a "living allowance," Church-funded housing, subsidized/discounted meals at Church-owned cafeterias, and an automobile or car pool service, all of which has a monetary value. Many individuals who teach Mormon doctrine or history receive payment from the Church as professional teachers, such as religion professors at Church-owned schools and seminary instructors who teach in Utah. However, local church administrators, and seminary teachers outside of Utah, are not paid anything of monetary value for their countless hours of service to the Church.
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My life has been dedicated to the less fortunate since August 2010 (and even prior to if you count my research during Graduate School). From August 2010 - August 2011 I was available 24 hours a day/7 days a week to volunteer in my community. I continue to give every day at work, and often on weekends. If my hard work pays off 2012 is going to be a very amazing year for this community. I really hope a few things come to pass.
Emotionally, I have given so much. I wish I had the money to give instead. It would be a lot less taxing on the soul (pun sort of intended  )
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-Ducky- posted:
My life has been dedicated to the less fortunate since August 2010 (and even prior to if you count my research during Graduate School). From August 2010 - August 2011 I was available 24 hours a day/7 days a week to volunteer in my community. I continue to give every day at work, and often on weekends. If my hard work pays off 2012 is going to be a very amazing year for this community. I really hope a few things come to pass.
Emotionally, I have given so much. I wish I had the money to give instead. It would be a lot less taxing on the soul (pun sort of intended )
That's just one year. Romney has been running his foundation that is dedicated to helping the poor for decades.
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JD_HOGG posted:
-Ducky- posted:
My life has been dedicated to the less fortunate since August 2010 (and even prior to if you count my research during Graduate School). From August 2010 - August 2011 I was available 24 hours a day/7 days a week to volunteer in my community. I continue to give every day at work, and often on weekends. If my hard work pays off 2012 is going to be a very amazing year for this community. I really hope a few things come to pass.
Emotionally, I have given so much. I wish I had the money to give instead. It would be a lot less taxing on the soul (pun sort of intended )
That's just one year. Romney has been running his foundation that is dedicated to helping the poor for decades.
My time and dedication is priceless
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Second_Chance
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I care about Mormons like I give a isht about GLBTs. Who cares what they do?
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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-Ducky- posted:
JD_HOGG posted:
-Ducky- posted:
My life has been dedicated to the less fortunate since August 2010 (and even prior to if you count my research during Graduate School). From August 2010 - August 2011 I was available 24 hours a day/7 days a week to volunteer in my community. I continue to give every day at work, and often on weekends. If my hard work pays off 2012 is going to be a very amazing year for this community. I really hope a few things come to pass.
Emotionally, I have given so much. I wish I had the money to give instead. It would be a lot less taxing on the soul (pun sort of intended )
That's just one year. Romney has been running his foundation that is dedicated to helping the poor for decades.
My time and dedication is priceless
That's why you are so beloved 
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Ex-remlocke
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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LOL, Mormons.
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what the **** is a Barack?! - DMX
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-Rando-
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Velvet_Ice posted:
And as to the buildings being lavish, would you say that almost all Catholic cathedrals are lavish?
Yes. You want me to go on my rant about Catholics? Because I have and will.
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Anebriated
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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"I dunno even the Temple in SLC was mostly donated time and effort by the members."
wow that's even better than them just taking their money! what?
if you really think about it, mormonism is just another strategy for propagation. have lots of kids who have lots of kids of their own. there may not be mormon genes, but genes that come from mormons are increasing in the gene pool. an evolutionary biologist would say, "oh, good one,".
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Axispipe
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Ptilk posted:
So....he made tens of millions putting some people out of work, destroying their retirements, and making them poor....but he gave back a small percentage of that money to other poor people (and got a huge tax break in the process)?
Wow, he sure has helped a lot of poor people.
Mostly by helping them get poor in the first place.
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Immortal_Haze
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I'm sorry, I'm still laughing that people in this thread are saying paying 10% of your income to an entity on the off chance you might need to collect a tiny percentage (over the course of your lifetime) back is a sound investment plan.
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Element_X
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Immortal_Haze posted:
I'm sorry, I'm still laughing that people in this thread are saying paying 10% of your income to an entity on the off chance you might need to collect a tiny percentage (over the course of your lifetime) back is a sound investment plan.
And now we're all laughing at you, because no one has argued that. Did you have to take comprehension tests in your English classes? I didn't know stupid was your schtick. I probably didn't notice because you've never stood out in any way, until now. Really, keep going, please.
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Immortal_Haze
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Element_X posted:
Immortal_Haze posted:
I'm sorry, I'm still laughing that people in this thread are saying paying 10% of your income to an entity on the off chance you might need to collect a tiny percentage (over the course of your lifetime) back is a sound investment plan.
And now we're all laughing at you, because no one has argued that. Did you have to take comprehension tests in your English classes? I didn't know stupid was your schtick. I probably didn't notice because you've never stood out in any way, until now. Really, keep going, please.
The comment was more towards Rho than you. He tends to offer a good one liner that makes no sense and then act like anyone that disagrees is an idiot. It's your religion and you obviously hold value in that, though I am curious as to your point of view because you used to be involved in financial planning (I thought).
If you're going to try to insult me, at least have some balls and do it straight out. The implied insults are a little tame. :\
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JD_HOGG
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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How could a thread about a great man's benevolence turn out so mean? Feel the love man.
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Immortal_Haze
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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JD_HOGG posted:
How could a thread about a great man's benevolence turn out so mean? Feel the love man.
I love everyone. Except you.
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Onslaught.
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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.
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Immortal_Haze
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Okay Element, I'll explain now so you won't be as disappointed in me. I was laughing because you posted your story, then Rando did his assessment of what you said. Rho then brought up the insurance thing, which would imply you're paying 10% to the church just so you can have something to fall back on. That devolved into the "you don't get it" discussion with Rando.
The amusement was that someone implied it was an insurance plan, which made me laugh because paying 10% into that kind of insurance plan would be quite honestly idiotic. It doesn't mean that I'm laughing at Mormons paying 10%, which I very well know they do because it goes to the good of their community. I think that's great, honestly.
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Rhodoman
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Immortal_Haze posted:
Rho then brought up the insurance thing, which would imply you're paying 10% to the church just so you can have something to fall back on.
Except it didn't.
Rho
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Kanga_Roo
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Seems a lot of anger about the Mormons. I don't really mind them. They keep to themselves unless invited and only occasionally interfere with the rights of others. As far as the pictures of the temples they are nice, but not lavish. You want lavish go Catholic - Old World. I don't really care about the tithing either - it's a person's choice. Given what the church uses tithes for there is no legitimate way to argue it is "charitable" but again people can choose. Mitt has not done more than I have for the poor if you look at it as a balance sheet.
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Immortal_Haze
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Rhodoman posted:
Immortal_Haze posted:
Rho then brought up the insurance thing, which would imply you're paying 10% to the church just so you can have something to fall back on.
Except it didn't.
Rho
Yes, of course.
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Rhodoman
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Incorrect inference on your part does not constitute implication on my part.
Of course.
Rho
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Venit hiems quidquid Latine dictum sit altum viditur
Referring to illegal aliens as 'immigrants' is the same as referring to shoplifters as 'shoppers' - Dorvinion
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Immortal_Haze
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Golf clap?
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Ah-Schoo
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lol @ trying to have a conversation with Rho.
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Anebriated
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Mitt Romney has done more for the poor than you have
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Rhodoman posted:
It's the same reason they get private equity firms' actions wrong. It's easier to put a political enemy in the same box with Gordon Gecko than it is to actually think. You've got your straw hat on early, this morning. 'Cause you're consistent like that. Okay, so you're NOT consistent. Shocker. The enormity of error in this paragraph is breathtaking. WE are the music makers and WE are the dreamers of dreams. You sound very sure. Except it didn't. Incorrect inference on your part does not constitute implication on my part. Of course.
Rho
if you add up a lot of Rho's posts it's almost as good as one of my posts. I demand compensation in the post count department. it's a travesty that my post count doesn't represent the enormous content and thought of my body of posting. i propose a new post count that is determined by the content of the post, and not if everything is correctly capitalized. freeeeeedooooooommmm
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Rhodoman
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Eschew verbosity.
Rho
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Rho is correct. - Varece
Venit hiems quidquid Latine dictum sit altum viditur
Referring to illegal aliens as 'immigrants' is the same as referring to shoplifters as 'shoppers' - Dorvinion
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Anebriated
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i am a bear of brevity, sir.
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