Author Topic: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Aerlinthian 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Okay, lets hear the excuses against this one because you don't like him or his other positions.

http://youtu.be/CFe7k9_ESI8

 

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Manegarm 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Proven racist bunghole is still a proven racist bunghole..

No wonder why you love him, you know with your violent jew hate and all.

 

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Thugoneous 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
I'm okay with this. But most of these people stand to gain much more than they'd lose in benefits.l not sure how effective it would be.

 

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Aerlinthian 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Thugoneous posted:
I'm okay with this. But most of these people stand to gain much more than they'd lose in benefits.
At least it will stop adding insult to injury.

 

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Allstarslacker 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
He said it was the least they could do.

I agree with him on this issue.

 

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Altra_Shadowstalker 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
See? He's a much more effective Congressman than Presidential Candidate.

Out of curiosity, why is Ron Paul against lobbyists and congressmen? The only other citizens who get restricted from certain jobs are convicted felons. Shouldn't he be for these guys having the freedom to decide what their next job is? Why punish them for being productive members of society?

 

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Scarne 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
If the amendment is added, it could be the tipping point that makes a bill that seems to have enough support into one that doesn't pass.

It wouldn't stop people from pulling a Newt and not directly lobby themselves but just work as a consultant to a firm that does lobbying. grin

 

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Friarspam 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Altra_Shadowstalker posted:
See? He's a much more effective Congressman than Presidential Candidate.

Out of curiosity, why is Ron Paul against lobbyists and congressmen? The only other citizens who get restricted from certain jobs are convicted felons. Shouldn't he be for these guys having the freedom to decide what their next job is? Why punish them for being productive members of society?


Title says Rand Paul.

 

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Altra_Shadowstalker 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Whoops! Thanks, there's not the first time I've mistaken the two names. Good looking out.

My question remains the same, but obviously not the first paragraph.

 

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ZigmundZag 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
I doubt it's going to be worth much. Where do you draw the line between lobbying and legitimate "consulting" work? I doubt there's a former senator alive that hasn't worked for a private organization is some capacity.

 

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B_Shinkicker 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Newt himself is proof that this amendment won't work. Newt wasn't a lobbyist, he was just paid millions of dollars a year for his "advice" and for his Washington insider beltway connections!

silly

 

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Eager_Igraine 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
B_Shinkicker posted:
Newt himself is proof that this amendment won't work. Newt wasn't a lobbyist, he was just paid millions of dollars a year for his "advice" and for his Washington insider beltway connections!

silly


I was thinking. It makes for a nice sound bite, but any way you define lobbyist can easily be circumvented. Newt was a 'historian' I believe.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
B_Shinkicker posted:
Newt himself is proof that this amendment won't work.

They just need to better define what constitutes a lobbyist. Either that or expand the restriction to include former congressmen participating in lobbying related activities. The whole thing is a good idea, but you're right, it's not there yet.

coffee

 

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Tych2 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Who the hell is Rand Paul? Relative to Ron Paul?

I support this amendment.

 

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imaloon1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
It's his son, Senator from Kentucky.



Good amendment, but pretty much worthless in implementation.

 

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Tych2 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
So they are a political family, like the Bush's and Kennedy's? Well probably not as bad as both of those families.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Not exactly a political family. More like a son following in his father's footsteps.

coffee

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
This is sort of the definition of a token effort designed more to soothe people than fix any problem.

The money we're talking about is completely insignificant compared to the damage that having former congresspeople lobbying their colleagues does to the country. If you really cared about the problem you would do something more effective than cut off their congressional retirement, which is bound to be far, far less than they get paid to be a lobbyist.

I don't disagree with the basic idea underlying the legislation but it's pretty much totally pointless on a practical level.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Yukishiro1 posted:
The money we're talking about is completely insignificant compared to the damage that having former congresspeople lobbying their colleagues does to the country.

So all lobbying of this sort is bad? If the teachers union employs former congress people to lobby, you oppose that?

thinking

 

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Tych2 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
paulg_68 posted:
Not exactly a political family. More like a son following in his father's footsteps.

coffee
Can't that be said about the BushEs and Kennedys also. I will admit the Pauls probably aren't as bad as the BushEs and Kennedys.

 

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Scarne 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
I do like the basic idea of the amendment. But I don't like having him attach it to a mostly unrelated bill. Why not introduce such a lobbying rule as its own bill? Or at least as a part of another bill that is primarily focused on other lobbying rules as well. grin

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Tych2 posted:
Also when you pluralize a last name do you add 's or just s? I can never remember that.


I always mess this up too... finally googled it:

http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/how-to-make-family-names-plural.aspx

 

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Tych2 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
I did the same thing. It was annoying me as soon as I asked.

 

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Cawlin 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
There was a time in (oddly enough) grammar school, when we learned all these rules and they stayed fresh in my mind for many years afterward. Many of them I simply absorbed and use without thinking. Several though, like the one above, just never fully sunk in, or by virtue of doing so much less writing of that nature (as opposed to the technical writing I've done for the majority of my career), I have simply forgotten.

 

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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Scarne posted:
I do like the basic idea of the amendment. But I don't like having him attach it to a mostly unrelated bill. Why not introduce such a lobbying rule as its own bill? Or at least as a part of another bill that is primarily focused on other lobbying rules as well. grin


Interesting that Congress is exempt from insider trading rules, and the Stock Act has been failing to pass for five years now.

 

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theredkay1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
How libertarian of him. Its hard to remember when government stepping into the labor market with strict penalties is communism and when its the embodiement of free market principles.

Government shouldnt pass the civil rights act....but it should outlaw certain people from holding certain jobs? confused

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
theredkay1 posted:
How libertarian of him. Its hard to remember when government stepping into the labor market with strict penalties is communism and when its the embodiement of free market principles.

Government shouldnt pass the civil rights act....but it should outlaw certain people from holding certain jobs? confused

So Congress is now the free market?

Have you ever had an economics class?

And how exactly does this outlaw people from holding certain jobs?

thinking

 

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theredkay1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
paulg_68 posted:
So Congress is now the free market?
Huh? You seem confused. The labor market could be a 'free market' but Rand Paul thinks this market works best with the heavy hand of government.

paulg_68 posted:

And how exactly does this outlaw people from holding certain jobs?



Penalize, not outlaw. Bad word choice.

 

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Ashmaele 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits

Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act that will accomplish absolutely nothing but will make it appear as though he is moral, righteous and ethical.


Fight on brotha

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
theredkay1 posted:
paulg_68 posted:
So Congress is now the free market?
Huh? You seem confused. The labor market could be a 'free market' but Rand Paul thinks this market works best with the heavy hand of government.

So how does this affect anything in the free market?

I thought it just affected Congress pensions and benefits.

thinking

 

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theredkay1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
There is a market for labor. Rand Paul wants to create financial penalties for certain movements in the labor market. The market does not see the need to penalize this group of people for moving around the labor market but Rand Paul wants it anyway.

The cost of changing jobs is increased for certain individuals. This raises the cost for employers or leads to suboptimal hiring choices. Raising the cost of new employees and increasing the liklihood of less qualified job hires is certainly a government imposition on the labor market.

Its just nice to see the right drop their pretend worship of the 'free market gods' and admit that sometimes direct government intervention into the market will improve the outcome. This is a very basic principle but a large group of people likes to pretend they dont believe it.

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
paulg_68 posted:
Yukishiro1 posted:
The money we're talking about is completely insignificant compared to the damage that having former congresspeople lobbying their colleagues does to the country.

So all lobbying of this sort is bad? If the teachers union employs former congress people to lobby, you oppose that?

thinking


Sure. To the same extent I oppose a corporation doing it.

Although what I'm talking about isn't necessarily just generic lobbying but more the "have your former colleague take you out to dinner" sort of stuff.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
rekday posted:
People on the government payroll working with government is the free market.

rolling_eyes

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
theredkay1 posted:

Its just nice to see the right drop their pretend worship of the 'free market gods' and admit that sometimes direct government intervention into the market will improve the outcome. This is a very basic principle but a large group of people likes to pretend they dont believe it.


Yeah, although that's sorta a straw man. Even most hardcore libertarians believe in antitrust legislation, for example.

Paul is, as usual, doing a miserable job of defending his positions, but I'm not sure they're necessarily anti-libertarian.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Yukishiro1 posted:
Sure. To the same extent I oppose a corporation doing it.

Not to the same extent, but it's good to see you acknowledging that they are equivalent.

coffee

 

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paulg_68 posted:
Yukishiro1 posted:
Sure. To the same extent I oppose a corporation doing it.

Not to the same extent, but it's good to see you acknowledging that they are equivalent.

coffee


wut

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
The people who treat the free market like a religion are 1% of fiscal conservatives and 90% of libtards.

coffee

 

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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Yukishiro1 posted:
paulg_68 posted:
Yukishiro1 posted:
Sure. To the same extent I oppose a corporation doing it.

Not to the same extent, but it's good to see you acknowledging that they are equivalent.

coffee

wut

You will quietly acknowledge that a thing is bad when your side does it, but you will actively call it out when the other side does it.

coffee

 

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Yukishiro1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
You're just frustrated I refused to be drawn out by your stupid partisan attack and can't gracefully admit defeat. grin

 

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theredkay1 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Yukishiro1 posted:
theredkay1 posted:

Its just nice to see the right drop their pretend worship of the 'free market gods' and admit that sometimes direct government intervention into the market will improve the outcome. This is a very basic principle but a large group of people likes to pretend they dont believe it.


Yeah, although that's sorta a straw man. Even most hardcore libertarians believe in antitrust legislation, for example.




Thats true, I didnt mean to imply this was the only time they have let the mask slip.

 

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paulg_68 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
paulg_68 posted:
The people who treat the free market like a religion are 1% of fiscal conservatives and 90% of libtards.

coffee

 

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Aerlinthian 
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Subject: Rand Paul offers amendment to Stock Act: If you become a lobbyist, give up your congress benefits
Don't be a willful retard theredkay1, elected people to civil service aren't a "labor market". rolling_eyes


Further, I would bet dollars to donuts that if this was offered by someone like Denis Kucinich that you would be for it.

 

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