Author Topic: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
JerkyDale 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Greetings Fellow DAoC'ers! I thought at long last I'd give Gaheris a try and it has been really nice! (1) People are so friendly, it reminds me of the old days! (2) I NEVER EVER EVER have to worry about getting perfed/backstabbed/poisoned! Lol, at any rate I digress. I was thinking of really making a concerted effort to get settled in Gaheris, but I'm not sure which kind of bot to have. I was going to roll a Spiritmaster for farming things, and my friend is going to roll a champion for tank support. I have played all three realms on the Ywain servers so i'm somewhat familiar with the druid/shaman/healer/cleric (mostly the cleric as ALbion is my home realm), and I was kind of leaning towards a cleric for the bot, since they have all the buffs you need plus they can heal better than a shaman. However I was thinking the druid attack speed and matter/heat/cold buffs might be better than the energy/body/spirit buffs. I'd greatly appreciate any input on whether a cleric/druid/shaman/healer would be "best". I was planning on having the bot be both a healer/buffer.

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
sham for the rr5 alone

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
For versatility, enchanter > SM
For keeps, SM > enchanter
For buffers, druid > cleric > shaman
For speed, bard > (other 2 don't matter)
For raids everywhere, heretics
For raids in Galladoria, Sidi, TG and Strength relics in NF, theurgists
For tanking, armsman > warrior > hero > hybrids (paladins can be the best tank in situations where the boss mob doesn't do significant magic damage)
For blocking, paladin > armsman > warrior > hero > warden (warden is on the same level as paladin, but most people don't know how to spec them properly)

These are all personal opinion, but the experience behind these opinions is vast happy

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
PasswordLLOTH posted:
sham for the rr5 alone
Immensely overrated. The amount of power toys available these days negates this argument easily.

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
power toys + omni regen > power toys

 

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Abominations 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
And Lose DI and BOF and PR with shaman over druid or cleric?

No Thanks, and If u run pally blockbot u get VR just like shaman can get for heals and like Saxona said theres enough power regen You do not need shaman rr5. Infernal Sleeves, Serenity, Staffs, Robes, Shields, etc

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
PasswordLLOTH posted:
power toys + omni regen > power toys
omni regen up every 10 minutes < DI, PR, haste for tanks and pets, instant heals, BOF (if you're the type that uses it)

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Abominations posted:
Infernal Sleeves, Serenity, Staffs, Robes, Shields, helm, cloak, gem, cudgel of undead
Just thought I'd change that for you. With the new summoner's hall items, new templates are going to have even more power toys. And even if you don't change your template, you now have Cudgel of the Undead which is a 50% power heal that can go in the main hand. You could have only your staff as a power heal in your template and still have 2 more power heals from dragon shield and this new cudgel.

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Saxona posted:
PasswordLLOTH posted:
power toys + omni regen > power toys
omni regen up every 10 minutes < DI, PR, haste for tanks and pets, instant heals, BOF (if you're the type that uses it)

damage mitigation has always been more important than powerful heals. di is stupid and mostly worthless. shamans get insta heals too and bof < a blockbot or again damage mitigation. shaman rr5 + friggs goes a long way towards constant regen. the only insta heal that matters for daoc is the group insta heal on a 10m timer(which shamans get) and pr isn't necessary on gaheris.
haste is celerity's retarded cousin(and a whore of a cousin at that with the realm buffbots) and pets are only there for keep doors/walls. tanks don't need haste because all they do is stand still and spam taunt.

this is why i played so well on the warden: pbt,rr5, insta group hot, and offensive heal proc spamming essence flames keeps a group up pretty damn well and when things got sticky i have a nice single target heal.
back to the original point: shaman rr5 doesn't use up an item timer. di bof and pr are a poor man's crutches.

 

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Abominations 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Think what you want, Shamans are the worst buff bot for doing high end stuff. Let me divulge:

You can do Dagda and Valhalla with a SM, Paladin, Druid, & Bard (If u have 4 accnts-not necessary)

Lets replace Druid with Shaman, it is very unlikely that you will be able to do Dagda and Valhalla with the 3 as said above probably impossible. DI is more then just a healing pool, any character healed by DI is granted that amount of "Agro" in which the healer will not get agro as fast. The minute the shaman uses VR5 or whatever thats 1500 for each grp member (3000hps for 3man or 4500hp for the 4man above) he will more then likely draw agro, die, you lose buffs, and then you will wipe.

For example, my druid does not even heal until all non heal spells are gone. I will use DI/BOF first (No druid agro), then Spiritmaster's RR5 (grp heal 3200 again no druid agro), then I will use Fragment of Excalibur (2000hp ablative melee dmg on relics Again no agro and absorbing 2000dmg), and finally Paladin's RR5 being 382hp every 3seconds for 15seconds to heal group (this agro again not on druid but infact on Paladin).

All while the above sequence of heals/dmg mitigation Paladin has heal chant going which is another 50hp/person agro to him. Druid then using baseline group heals only does not ever draw agro. You cannot do this with Shaman over Druid.

Thank you for playing!

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
hi my name is Protect and I serve a purpose in pve

and that's how easily your argument turns into profanity

that of course ignores the rest of the profanity coming from your post. i dont see how there being a paladin in a group makes a druid a better buffbot nor do i see how a paladin swings faster with your druid's haste or a pot or the npc buff.

it's funny you argue the druid offers some sort of damage mitigation to the group(which it doesn't) vs the shaman's rr5/friggs combo.

there's only one or two high end encounters on gaheris and relic keeps isn't one of them nor has it been for a long time. ml10 is one and i can't think of any other high end encounter.

its time for you to /release

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
PasswordLLOTH posted:
Saxona posted:
PasswordLLOTH posted:
power toys + omni regen > power toys
omni regen up every 10 minutes < DI, PR, haste for tanks and pets, instant heals, BOF (if you're the type that uses it)


damage mitigation has always been more important than powerful heals. di is stupid and mostly worthless. shamans get insta heals too and bof < a blockbot or again damage mitigation. shaman rr5 + friggs goes a long way towards constant regen. the only insta heal that matters for daoc is the group insta heal on a 10m timer(which shamans get) and pr isn't necessary on gaheris.
haste is celerity's retarded cousin(and a whore of a cousin at that with the realm buffbots) and pets are only there for keep doors/walls. tanks don't need haste because all they do is stand still and spam taunt.

this is why i played so well on the warden: pbt,rr5, insta group hot, and offensive heal proc spamming essence flames keeps a group up pretty damn well and when things got sticky i have a nice single target heal.
back to the original point: shaman rr5 doesn't use up an item timer. di bof and pr are a poor man's crutches.
How is a shaman better at damage mitigation than a druid? We're not talking about block bots, we're talking about buff bots. As far as shaman's getting an insta heal, your argument doesn't hold any weight. I'd rather have an insta heal, group insta heal, and DI than VR (which is pretty much useless below the third level anyway), especially at low rank. And you can't call rr5 + friggs 'constant regen' because the rr5 is only up every 10 minutes. And how is PR not necessary on Gaheris? There isn't always going to be a heretic around, and if you have to rez 2 people at the same time, 1 is going to be rez sick and useless for the ongoing fight without it. And why wouldn't you want haste on pets? Their swing speed isn't going to be capped by celerity alone.

Greg, you have a raging hard on for shamans, and face it, like your raging hard on for the same sex, it isn't main stream, so get over it.

 

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Abominations 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
[TOS] FIRST OFF Protect does NOT protect from unlimited healing. You have no freaking clue what you are talking about, taunt does not preclude the monsters from atacking the healer through the protect. Look into protect again fool and learn before speak.

 

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Mentalburn 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Shaman's utility doesn't even compare to that of a druid or cleric.

1) They have to use red specs inorder to cap, meaning you can't buff as many people.
2) Friggs is useless with higher spike damage, I'd rather have higher delve heals.
3) BoF/DI is damage mitigation, which a shaman CAN'T get as much as you would like to think.
4) Single/Group insta's on druid/cleric, shaman gets VR and you have to spec it to 5 for it to viable.
4) Haste + celerity = taking down doors/walls faster which means faster times on keeps.
5) End regen is a moot point from shamans, when you can run a bard/paladin or use end pots.
6) Druid has same timed buffs as shaman and better utility around the table.
7) Protect does absolutely nothing againist a group of higher lvl mobs. Tried and tested.



Name an advantage shaman's have over druid/clerics, so far I've seen none. So your points are moot.

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
trap card activated:

saxona
1) egg of youth or golm can cure res sickness. so does purge.
2) haste on pets is only limited to keeps
3) shaman rr5 really is that good

abom -
have you tried using guard?

mentalpissedkid-
1) lol you wont have a problem buffing 3 players with a shaman. there's this thing in perfector that makes your buff pool bigger. try using that next time
2) the shaman spec 25/26 heals hit for 500+ . play better and you wont have to heal as often
3) friggs and rr5 restore hp/mana/endo to everybody including the healer
4) vr5 is overkill tried and true
4) shaman rr5 = more power = more pbaoes for taking down groups of mobs or the lord
5) hes not running a bard or pally
6) no
7) thats when you learn to measure aggro with the strength of your pbaoe, to keep up a constant regen with friggs, and learn how to heal effectively. any decent player will know this.

pissed kid posted:
Name an advantage shaman's have over druid/clerics, so far I've seen none. So your points are moot.

rr5, endo, damage-add, vr5, dex-race, disease/dot, friggs.


nice try fellas but you've let your heads get so far up your own asses that you're profanity your face through your own mouth and made your own human cent-ipad.

as the OP stated hes going to play sm+bot with a champion friend. the main issue he will face in that trio is the lack of power which the shaman offers better than any other bot because of it's rr5.

3v1 and you all lost. you should learn to pan more


on a side note do you ever wonder why i spec my warden the way i do? it's because warden is a healing/blocking hybrid and should be treated as such. i've only used it in groups with that understanding that makes me stop guarding my pbaoe for 1-2seconds to toss the group some heals. i didn't have 50shield because the points could be used much better in higher regrowth. its about time you guys learn to think outside the box without forgetting the purpose.

 

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Mentalburn 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
mentalpissedkid-
1) lol you wont have a problem buffing 3 players with a shaman. there's this thing in perfector that makes your buff pool bigger. try using that next time
(shaman needs 47aug to cap dex, where as druid/cleric can do it with yellow base/spec allowing them to spec other lines)
[TOS] ml4 ability is passive, nothing about it to "use")

2) the shaman spec 25/26 heals hit for 500+ . play better and you wont have to heal as often
(or I could just heal for 1000+ with druid/cleric and have to heal "less often" as you put it)

3) friggs and rr5 restore hp/mana/endo to everybody including the healer
(~100hp heal every 4sec and rr5 10min use, could use 4 x 50% power regains in that amount of time)

4) vr5 is overkill tried and true
(only non-passive RA a shaman gets that is even worth a damn on Gaheris)
(where as cleric/druic have BoF + DI + PR + Single/Group instas)

4) shaman rr5 = more power = more pbaoes for taking down groups of mobs or the lord
(shaman rr5 = takes 30sec to get all 50%, power charge item = instant)

5) hes not running a bard or pally
(end pots)

6) no
(yes)

7) thats when you learn to measure aggro with the strength of your pbaoe, to keep up a constant regen with friggs, and learn how to heal effectively. any decent player will know this.
(Yeah... because I'm going to stop PBAoE/Heals and sit there waiting for the aggro table to shift, are you stupid or just dumb.. I think a mixture of both?)

[quote=[TOS]]

rr5 - (only usable every 10min, can use 4 x 50% power charge items in 10min)
endo - (30 charge end4 pots, without haste/celerity you'll never go OOE)
damage-add - (Haste is going to benefit you LONG before dmg add every will)
vr5 - (10min timer, where as druid/cleric has single + group + DI + BoF + PR)
dex-race - (356dex caps "most" important heals, which can be obtained with ~dex5 (10ra pts)
disease/dot - (druid has dot and cleric has smite, CL for diseases if you think it's important.
If you're having to spam AOE disease on mobs, get a better PBAoE they should have been dead by then.)

friggs - (ticks every 4sec for ~100, doesn't do [b][TOS] for spike dmg)[/b]
[/quote]



I said to list an "A D V A N T A G E", that a shaman has over druid/cleric which you still haven't done.

 

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Quazimortal 
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I can't believe you guys are arguing with Password... doh!

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Quazimortal posted:
I can't believe you guys are arguing(and losing) with Password... doh!

fixed~

also pissed kid is pissed hes wrong and im right

its okay though he doesn't know that power charges and rr5 can be used simultaneously its okay hes new to daoc

 

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Abominations 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Password, you do realize you have been told by at least THREE GOOD GAHERIS PLAYERS that shamans do not and will NEVER compare to a druid or cleric. You are still arguing and trying to prove your point.

I think the only point you proved was the one made by Saxona is the fact you have such a raging hard on for shamans you cant see past that. Learn to play this game then we can talk.

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
as soon as you called mental a good player i fell from my chair from laughter

you have a lot to learn trying to troll me though

 

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PentegarnTheCabalist 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Disclaimer

The actions and posts of the Gaheris VN boards do not reflect the disposition and attitudes of the Gaheris server as whole

/Disclaimer

Now, what is saying you can't have one of each type? Then you can switch between them depending on the situation. And there are situations that each buffbot does shine in

 

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Quazimortal 
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PentegarnTheCabalist posted:
Now, what is saying you can't have one of each type? Then you can switch between them depending on the situation. And there are situations that each buffbot does shine in


Hey now! What do you think you are doing bringing logic into the conversation for Pent? tongue

 

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Mentalburn 
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PasswordLLOTH posted:
Quazimortal posted:
I can't believe you guys are arguing(and losing) with Password... doh!

fixed~

also pissed kid is pissed hes wrong and im right

its okay though he doesn't know that power charges and rr5 can be used simultaneously its okay hes new to daoc


You think I'm pissed because you can't make a valid point, rofl were you dropped as a child? It's ok we all know that you are a sad lonely man via the real life.
Your only arguement is a class is better based SOLELY on it's 10min (5%/tick every 3sec) that takes 30sec to reach 50% rr5 ability. (Which is actually pretty pathetic)
My arguement is that a druid/cleric hands down without question brings "MORE" utility to a group, than a shaman ever will. End of story, there is no arguement to that.

PasswordLLOTH posted:
as soon as you called mental a good player i fell from my chair from laughter

you have a lot to learn trying to troll me though




I have more experience, versatility and knowledge of all aspects of this game than you ever will.
Keep doing what you do best, troll the VN boards because we all know you damn sure not only suck at life but this game as well.


P.S. You still haven't listed any "ADVANTAGES" a shaman has over druid/cleric. Just thought I'd point out seeing how you keep avoiding.

 

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JerkyDale 
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"Now, what is saying you can't have one of each type? Then you can switch between them depending on the situation. And there are situations that each buffbot does shine"

Thank you all for your various input. I must say I regret that it has come to what it has, but I appreciate that you all are trying to help and you all make good points. I think in the end what I have taken away is that I should roll/level one of each for various situations. Again thank you for your input and good luck in the game!

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
pissed kid posted:
You're only arguement is a class is better based SOLELY on it's 10min

fixed that for ya pal

no other main buffer can restore as much power to the group as the shaman can. that alone makes him hands down the best buffbot

 

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PentegarnTheCabalist 
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PasswordLLOTH posted:
pissed kid posted:
You're only arguement is a class is better based SOLELY on it's 10min

fixed that for ya pal

no other main buffer can restore as much power to the group as the shaman can. that alone makes him hands down the best buffbot


God I hope you were kidding with that correction.

If you are then laugh

If you are not then laugh and then cry

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Saxona posted:
Greg, you have a raging hard on for shamans, and face it, like your raging hard on for the same sex, it isn't main stream, so get over it.

 

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WalterzRockz 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
JerkyDale,

Basically I think Shamans are first choice, but I'm in the extreme minority. Healing is really overpowered on this server, so don't worry too much about cleric/druid, vs Shaman, Shaman comes in third here, no doubt but if your tank and PBAoER can play well or at least learn to, your healers won't get aggro that often, and Shamans can keep all three of the toons up np.

Clerics do have the nice AF buff, and the heal proc, but again they are not that huge a deal. where clerics and Druids really stand out is their RA's. BoF is pretty much a big deal. So that and the occasion when you will need an insta heal the druid and cleric are nice to have. But really you shouldn't need a insta heal that often. Shamans can spec one with RA's too btw.

While whatever bot you decide to play I'm sure you will be fine. Clerics and Druids get nice buffs, but I'd like to rate druids third. The kick ass buffs druids get benefit healers, and PBAoERs least, and tanks and their own pet most. Druids are a 1st choice if you have say a Warlock/Wizzy or Bain in your mix because the pet helps with siege a ton and the speed is pretty cool. But I digress you have an SM.

So get a cleric or a shaman. I prefer Shaman, because RR 5 is awesome. It's basically a full power bar of casting if you don't get interrupted too much on Boomer. Clerics are best though if your friend plays Pally for sure. But more importantly I'd recommend you don't play both Boom and heals. Try heals and tank, or tank and Boom. Your combo is the hardest of the three to try out. You won't just have a harder time taking keeps with heals and boom, but a slower one because stopping to boom, to heal, and vice-verse. Unless of course you have it cleverly tied in with some not so TOS abiding program in which case you are on your own anyway, you prefer it that way.

Good luck!

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
cleric can easily fit 10% block into their template

 

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PentegarnTheCabalist 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Now you are just being silly for the sake of being silly

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
only until your cleric blocks a huge attack and you lol

 

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Asber 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
I hate to validate Password's block argument, but way back when shamans had access to MoB and there was no +PvE block, I had MoB on my shaman. And he's right, watching my troll lift up his little Galladoria peanut shield and block Golestandt (the old level 80 version) three times in a row was pricelessly funny.
Is it in any way optimal? No. But it's funny.

And the weak link in OP's group is almost always going to be the Champion, so you need the bot that helps him most. At first glance, that means Shaman end regen, damage add, and yes, even the RR5 since Champ is unlikely to have /uses for power. But all of that is offense, and the Champ's weak spot is hit points. Which means the Champ needs defense. So your winner is the Cleric.

DI
BOF
Heal Proc
Spec AF
And hey, CL damage add

End regen potions for standard stuff, add power regen potions for the big stuff.

 

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Mykkael 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
I now know why some of you who haven't played DAoC in years still come to this forum.

My Lord, it's entertaining!

 

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PentegarnTheCabalist 
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You ain't kiddin'. This topic devolved into silly pretty fast, though there is good info hidden within. Just have to sort through the silly to find it

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
yeah nobody trolls as well as i do, thus the signature

 

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Quazimortal 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Quazimortal posted:
I can't believe you guys are arguing with Password... doh!


wink

 

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Warriorperson 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
PentegarnTheCabalist posted:
Disclaimer

The actions and posts of the Gaheris VN boards do not reflect the disposition and attitudes of the Gaheris server as whole

/Disclaimer

Now, what is saying you can't have one of each type? Then you can switch between them depending on the situation. And there are situations that each buffbot does shine in


This. I've got a RR11 druid and shaman. Now, I never use my shaman, but I could if I really wanted to! I made the shaman first, got him to RR11, decided to try out the druid when the new dragons came out and I started farming adols in the frontiers, never went back once I tried out the druid on keeps.

I do miss the shaman RR5 ability often, but I use the other toys on my druid far more than the Shaman's RR5, and the druid simply had more of them.

 

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kobenator 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
one of the best things about daoc is that the sum of a group can be far greater then its parts. because of that you can't look at just druid vs shaman vs cleric. you have to look at the whole group.

druids and clerics never had room in any of my groups. the big thing was always end, and getting end from another place wasnt worth what i gained with a druid or cleric. i could have run a druid or cleric for my keep groups because i liked a bard so i had end, but i preferred running power song or speed 6. sure power song and the sham rr5 isnt necessary with power toys, but for keeps the druid or cleric bring absolutely nothing, the convenience of not bothering with power toys is something. i tried a druid for the haste, but with warden celerity i had no noticeable difference breaking keep doors.

 

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Asber 
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Has it been that long since you've played? Bards can run two songs at once now. Crack and end for keeps, speed and end for travel. Unless you prefer helath regen for some reason.

 

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kobenator 
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yeah its been like two or three years.

i dont know if that really changes things though. id just leave speed and power on all the time. but when it comes to keeps its not as critical, it was basically dragons that resulted in my preference for shamans. although i used a healer speced for heals in the group i could have used a cleric or druid speced the same but i cant remember why i prefered the healer. i know i tried a cleric since i already had one with decent rr, i had some reason to create and template a healer. either way i wasnt bringing in a pally or bard so for buffs it had to be shaman.

 

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Dabrix29 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
where does a healer fall into this? Is celerity worth having if you mostly farm with a SM or Sorc and use a charmed pet? Or is celerity over rated?

 

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Kilduce 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
what the hell is going on up in here

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
pissed kids are getting pissed

 

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Holly_GoLightly 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
well, druid FTW imo, and anyone who doesn't agree can get someone else to heal for them happy

 

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Aroith 
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Adonis

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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Kilduce posted:
what the hell is going on up in here


Shamans suck are what is going on up in hur~

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
Aroith posted:
Kilduce posted:
what the hell is going on up in here


Shamans suck are what is going on up in hur~

 

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PasswordLLOTH 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
hey instead of being two lets be three

 

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Saxona 
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Subject: I like gaheris but I don't know which kind of bot to get!
I prefer to run with 4~

 

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