Talents 2.0

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Major change to class talent trees, and this is a new phase of development for the talent system.
The goal is to have you sit to another next to another combat rogue, and this combat rogue will actually have different talents than you do!
Character customization was the original point of talents in the first place but overtime cookie cutter builds dominated the scene.


New Model

Class Abilities are available to all specs in the class. All warriors learn heroic strike for example.
Spec Abilities are available to certain specs. Only Arms warriors learn Slam. Retribution and Protection paladin get Hammer of the Righteous, etc ...
Talents are optional skills/bonuses available to all specs. Any warrior can choose Throwdown, and you will have to pick between 3 different crowd control abilities on this level of talent.
Level 15 - You pick your first talent. For example, warriors have to pick between Juggernaut / Double Time / Warbringer and players will have to pick which mobility ability they want to pick depending on their playstyle.


Talent Philosophy

Access to stuff you never could before. If you were a subtlety rogue you knew you weren't going to get something like Killing Spree. And because talents are going to be all in the same tree, you're going to be able to combine them in a way that you never could before. For example, any rogue can have Shadowstep!
Several new, overpowered (feeling) talents will be added to the game.

Sprawl-zero1eye- posted:

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So far it sounds like I get one talent tree, and then I must pick one of three talents as I move down the tree. Could be cool...

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Spookysheep posted:

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Does anyone actually think the B team can do this correctly and not royally *#*$ it up?

Seriously?

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vn_vigilante66 posted:

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Didnt they just redo talents? And they are doing it again?

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MinionX-DW posted:

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That is a choice right there... Giving all my base abilities and saying "you get 6 choices and that's it" is a terrible system.

It's why when they dropped down the Talent points in Cata from Wrath everyone was POed.

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Zero_Washu posted:

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I did not see any crit immunity talents... so are they going to ditch crit from the game or move back to some stat on armor again?

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Elaok posted:

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Zero_Washu posted:

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I did not see any crit immunity talents... so are they going to ditch crit from the game or move back to some stat on armor again?

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You still choose to be a Prot anything at level 10 and you get your core abilities i bet that the passive is when you choose that tree


This new setup seems just like what Diablo 3 is doing :\

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The_Korrigan posted:

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Looks like they are dumbing down character development even more than they did in Cataclysm...

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The_Korrigan posted:

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Looks like they are dumbing down character development even more than they did in Cataclysm...

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MinionX-DW posted:

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They don't seem to understand, people like choices, I know "5% to Heroic Strike damage" doesn't sound great, But people like choices.

Giving you 6 Choices, and instead of letting you come up with your own choice is not a good idea in a MMO.

Simply look at Rift right now, There is a STUPID amount of specs you can do in that game...There is so many specs that they give you bloody 5 Specs to play with.

Look at Warlock/Necro in that game.

You have 33/33, 31/31, 35/31, 44/17,51/15,38/26 and i'm sure i'm missing one... and that's just TWO of the Souls in the Calling....

That is a choice right there... Giving all my base abilities and saying "you get 6 choices and that's it" is a terrible system.

It's why when they dropped down the Talent points in Cata from Wrath everyone was POed.

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Demorak posted:

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The funny part is, based on looking at the rogue tiers. The talents add absolutely nothing new to the game, they all look like the same ones Rogues have had forever. (save for maybe leeching poison?) So all they did was rework the system to span the extra levels without having to add anything new.

I didn't think they could dumb it down anymore than they did with Cata.

WTB my thorns Pally build with the old school talent trees again, please.

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Arcilite_I posted:

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Blizzard is (has been, for years) removing player choice for a SINGLE reason: balance

It is an unattainable goal when human players are involved, you would think they would realize this after how many years.

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Arcilite_I posted:

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Blizzard is (has been, for years) removing player choice for a SINGLE reason: balance

It is an unattainable goal when human players are involved, you would think they would realize this after how many years.

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MinionX-DW posted:

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They don't seem to understand, people like choices, I know "5% to Heroic Strike damage" doesn't sound great, But people like choices..

It's what made DAOC great, You had choices on your gear, its why there was a HUGE template community, You had choices on specs so some extent, RA's..

Blizzard seems to completely lost that people like CHOICES..

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Zero_Washu posted:

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I would prefer choices as they seem to be headed, where I have to choose between one of three variations of a thing. That way I can be my version of class X because I like a particular ability to function a certain way.

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Quazimortal posted:

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Zero_Washu posted:

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I would prefer choices as they seem to be headed, where I have to choose between one of three variations of a thing. That way I can be my version of class X because I like a particular ability to function a certain way.

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'Your' version won't really be 'your' version when ever single other person using the same class and spec as you has the exact same skills that you picked now will it?

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Sprawl-zero1eye- posted:

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Demorak posted:

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The funny part is, based on looking at the rogue tiers. The talents add absolutely nothing new to the game, they all look like the same ones Rogues have had forever. (save for maybe leeching poison?) So all they did was rework the system to span the extra levels without having to add anything new.

I didn't think they could dumb it down anymore than they did with Cata.

WTB my thorns Pally build with the old school talent trees again, please.

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Here is my current understanding.

When you create a character, you choose a class. In my case, Rogue.

When you reach level 10, you choose a specialization: Assassin, Combat, or Subtlety. You receive your signature abilities (like Mutilate, Dual Wield Spec, and Shadowstep).

As you level, you learn both Rogue specific abilities from your trainer (like Sinister Strike, backstab, et cetera), and specialization specific skills (the ones you used to get for talent points like Vigor, Blade Flurry, Hemo, et cetera).

At level 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, and 90, you get to pick a super special talents. Here is where you get to define yourself as different... kinda, but not really.

As far as I can tell, except for the 6 super special talents, you are exactly like the other Rogue/specs around you. Odds are, we will have cookie cutters even still.

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Sprawl-zero1eye- posted:

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3*3*3*3*3*3 = 729 different combos of slightly varying abilities that do the same thing just a little differently, or are marginally useless anyway.

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