sarnsereg
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Isn't that a problem? I feel it is. and it is exactly why i feel this expansion has failed us. on MMO champion there is a thing showing number of characters that have completed firelands... its under 150,000 characters.. there supposedly over 10,000,000 players....
thats only around 1% of the player population seeing game content... and that's just sad. I'd like to see numbers on LK raiding vs cata raiding because it seemed a whole lot more people did LK and I know i enjoyed it more when we could actually raid and progress through content fairly easily (yeah we had a few problem in LK on a couple bosses. Cata raids though have all been really agressive wiping on a lot of things.
i'm sure the easier loot and raiding will help some but still.. blizzard should be looking at these numbers and be ashamed of themselves for making everything so hard.
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Fedup23
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Fighting firelands with empty words
While the raiders get fat
and the poor stay poor
The rich get rich
And Blizz gets paid
to look away
As the 1% rules all of Azeroth.
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TruthyID
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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sarnsereg posted:
Isn't that a problem? I feel it is. and it is exactly why i feel this expansion has failed us. on MMO champion there is a thing showing number of characters that have completed firelands... its under 150,000 characters.. there supposedly over 10,000,000 players....
thats only around 1% of the player population seeing game content... and that's just sad. I'd like to see numbers on LK raiding vs cata raiding because it seemed a whole lot more people did LK and I know i enjoyed it more when we could actually raid and progress through content fairly easily (yeah we had a few problem in LK on a couple bosses. Cata raids though have all been really agressive wiping on a lot of things.
i'm sure the easier loot and raiding will help some but still.. blizzard should be looking at these numbers and be ashamed of themselves for making everything so hard.
The sample size was 2.7 million not the entire population. Still, the numbers are showing that only ~5% of the playerbase finished Firelands, even with the nerf.
I think Blizzard needs to accept the fact that most people aren't interesting in content that requires scheduling in advance. ICC was popular because people could get into a pug and do it whenever was convenient for them. The joint 10/25 lockout and the more difficult content have killed pugging so it's no surprise that participation in raiding is low.
The raid finder is a bandaid fix for this problem. However, the odds of grouping with 24 strangers (6 times as many as LFD) without getting any douchebags is effectively 0% so that's likely to end up just being frustrating in a different way than traditional raiding.
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_Warlucky_
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Lead Dev: We need some content that really lasts and takes a long time to complete so we don't have to issue as many expansions.
Dev1: Lets make it really hard and as a appeasement to casual players we will offer a LFG for raids.
Dev2: But this content isn't appropriate for PUGs, they will never finish it since it will be geared towards groups wiping at least 4 times before they get it.
Lead Dev: Screw em, I will write a blog and blame it on them for not dedicating their life to a guild.
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steveC91
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Blizzard good at fixing things that aint broke is the biggest problem.
Not only did they shaft the casual player base with the increased difficulty they managed to alienate those in semi hard core 25 man guilds by making the lock out the same and also the loot as 10 man.
As someone has said the new raid finder will be about as much fun as banging your head on a brick wall.
Who leads the raid ?
Raid leader says anyone know tactics ? and everyone says no !
If they dumb it down to the point where no skill at all is required and 5 can be afk it might work.
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Errtuu
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Fedup23 posted:
Fighting firelands with empty words
While the raiders get fat
and the poor stay poor
The rich get rich
And Blizz gets paid
to look away
As the 1% rules all of Azeroth.
Occupy Orgrimmar. Occupy Stormwind. Occupy Goldshire. GO!
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GutterSludge
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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TruthyID posted:
I think Blizzard needs to accept the fact that most people aren't interesting in content that requires scheduling in advance.
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Guttersludge
People just can't handle the truth.
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GutterSludge
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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_Warlucky_ posted:
Lead Dev: Screw em, I will write a blog and blame it on them for not dedicating their life to a guild.
Bonus
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Guttersludge
People just can't handle the truth.
NeMeFieD said:"Yea I Ucmed for 12 days straight.."
njwCSUS posted:I'm homosexual, so really, its ongoing sexual attraction to my father, not my mother.
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Slors
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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GutterSludge posted:
TruthyID posted:
I think Blizzard needs to accept the fact that most people aren't interesting in content that requires scheduling in advance.
I think people need to accept the fact that WoW really isnt a game anymore, its a time sink. The longer people keep playing this game the longer it will take the industry to rebound from it. Blizz saw $$$ and lost touch. Plenty of games before(some WoW copied) had suspect pve but still managed to produce a fun experience without requiring a month of non casual gameplay to be at that level. /rant off
WTB GW2!!
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Zero_Washu
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Kind of blows a hole in the who raider mystique, as in it is such a minority that catering to it only dooms the game.
Good going Ghostcrawler, you took all the fun out of the game.
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PallyDog
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Fedup23 posted:
Fighting firelands with empty words
While the raiders get fat
and the poor stay poor
The rich get rich
And Blizz gets paid
to look away
As the 1% rules all of Azeroth.
You should post that on Poetry Dump.
And I agree about FL. That's one thing I don't like about the Blizzard raid model. You are limited to how many you can take on a raid. And you need that many. In DAoC you could do Caer Sidi with a few groups if you wanted. It was tough, and would take forever but it was doable. And everyone got loot. OR you could take 100 people and mow through it and less of the raid got loot but it was still fun.
Blizzard says bring the player, not the class but then they make it hard to do so. They make it so you HAVE to have a certain level of gear in order to do things so you HAVE to go farm and grind and you can't just take all your buddies and go, you have to tell some that only so many people can go, you have to ell some they suck so they can't go, you have to tell some their gear isn't good enough so they can't go.
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Ugh_Lancelot
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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PallyDog posted:
Fedup23 posted:
Fighting firelands with empty words
While the raiders get fat
and the poor stay poor
The rich get rich
And Blizz gets paid
to look away
As the 1% rules all of Azeroth.
You should post that on Poetry Dump.
Nah, that would just be Spreading the Disease. (see what I did, there?)
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Spookysheep
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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The retards at blizzard need to get it through their head the raid content is wasted development time. I guess the need to lose another million and lost jobs to figure that out.
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I liek cheese
Pirates > Ninjas
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Fedup23
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Ugh_Lancelot posted:
PallyDog posted:
Fedup23 posted:
Fighting firelands with empty words
While the raiders get fat
and the poor stay poor
The rich get rich
And Blizz gets paid
to look away
As the 1% rules all of Azeroth.
You should post that on Poetry Dump.
Nah, that would just be Spreading the Disease. (see what I did, there?)
I knew someone would come up with it!! 
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Kriegprojekt
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Ive noticed a lot of guilds on Draka dont have the people ingame anymore to build a raid. I think the fact people left the game after Cata was released is one of the factors playing a part in why FL isnt being run by many people.
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tantallous
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
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Its what you just said, translated into guy speak and leaving out the unecessary parts
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Demorak
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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tantallous posted:
So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
Solution: Put more fking content out on a regular basis, like many other MMO's do with a fraction of the funding and the same quality.
The joint lock-out thing also screws with the boredom area. I NEVER ran out of stuff to do in Wrath with the different dungeon variations I could do. I could also bang out an alt in enough gear to do that stuff within a weeks time also, worst case scenario.
The Wrath model was awesome, it's what got me back into the game that the horrible BC raiding commitment killed for me.(Even that was funner than the Cata model though)
It's cool that they wanted to raise the challenge cap a bit with this expansion (not the lolunavoidabledamage portions), but you don't butcher the entirety of the model that kept your subscriber base growing to do it.
There is no excuse for the directions Blizzard has taken, the company is big enough and more than well enough funded to cater ALL play styles.........they are just greedy asshats that don't. 
/rant off 
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Marzuk
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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tantallous posted:
So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
Also every time they tweak something or nerf it, you get to hear about how its faceroll and welfare epics.
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Dums
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The mystery flavor
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Marzuk posted:
tantallous posted:
So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
Also every time they tweak something or nerf it, you get to hear about how its faceroll and welfare epics.
For someone in my position, the nerfs to firelands made every normal fight in there very, very easy. The heroic nerfs made some bosses a bit easier, but still challenging.
I wouldn't be surprised if these numbers end up being wrong, at least partially. 150k people killing Rag doesn't seem right.
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TruthyID
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Dums posted:
Marzuk posted:
tantallous posted:
So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
Also every time they tweak something or nerf it, you get to hear about how its faceroll and welfare epics.
For someone in my position, the nerfs to firelands made every normal fight in there very, very easy. The heroic nerfs made some bosses a bit easier, but still challenging.
I wouldn't be surprised if these numbers end up being wrong, at least partially. 150k people killing Rag doesn't seem right.
Already explained it once in this thread but I'll do it again.
MMO-Champion only looked at 2.7 million characters. The math used to get the 1.35% figure is based on two faulty assumptions. First they assume that MMO-Champ looked at every single toon available on the armory. This isn't the case and they state as much. Second, they are assuming that the 10 million current subscribers have one level 85 toon each. This is obviously not the case either.
MMO-Champion's numbers suggest that the rate of completion for FL is about 5% of level 85 characters, not subscribers but characters. It's not clear how that number translates to subscribers (based on the number of 85 alts) but it's a safe bet that the majority of players have not completed the content.
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Dums
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Subject:
So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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TruthyID posted:
Dums posted:
Marzuk posted:
[quote=tantallous]So.. They make stuff ppl can finish in a week, and then everyone complains they are bored with nothing to do. They make stuff you cant finish quickly, and everyone complains that its too hard and/or takes too long to do.
Also every time they tweak something or nerf it, you get to hear about how its faceroll and welfare epics.
For someone in my position, the nerfs to firelands made every normal fight in there very, very easy. The heroic nerfs made some bosses a bit easier, but still challenging.
I wouldn't be surprised if these numbers end up being wrong, at least partially. 150k people killing Rag doesn't seem right.
Already explained it once in this thread but I'll do it again.
MMO-Champion only looked at 2.7 million characters. The math used to get the 1.35% figure is based on two faulty assumptions. First they assume that MMO-Champ looked at every single toon available on the armory. This isn't the case and they state as much. Second, they are assuming that the 10 million current subscribers have one level 85 toon each. This is obviously not the case either.
MMO-Champion's numbers suggest that the rate of completion for FL is about 5% of level 85 characters, not subscribers but characters. It's not clear how that number translates to subscribers (based on the number of 85 alts) but it's a safe bet that the majority of players have not completed the content. [/quote]
I guess you have to look at this stuff with a grain of salt, then. Lots of variables.
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GutterSludge
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Not really.
5%...7%....3%....
10%???
All still entirely too low.
This "analysis" could have a huge margin of error and still drive the point home.
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Guttersludge
People just can't handle the truth.
NeMeFieD said:"Yea I Ucmed for 12 days straight.."
njwCSUS posted:I'm homosexual, so really, its ongoing sexual attraction to my father, not my mother.
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Spookysheep
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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GutterSludge posted:
Not really.
5%...7%....3%....
10%???
All still entirely too low.
This "analysis" could have a huge margin of error and still drive the point home.
THIS.
How the HELL can anyone even think about trying to play semantics games with the exact percentage. Its retarded.
If 90% of subscribers are not using the content, then its wasted.
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I liek cheese
Pirates > Ninjas
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tantallous
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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They are using it.. they just haven't finished it.. if you want to look at it that way then the people that aren't doing the content are the ones who have it finished, which is that % being discussed
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The_Korrigan
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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I've been raiding all content these last years, and I haven't killed a single boss in Firelands. I completely stopped sometimes during T11, after doing a few heroic modes...
Not that the bosses are bad, it's the same quality... and that's the problem. After several years of "the same", I'm just bored of it. I need something totally new to explore. Something that isn't World of Warcraft. And I bet many others are just like me.
I also know some, including in my guild, continue just because they are "gear addicts", something I've never been, so it was quite easy for me to stop when it was no longer fun.
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Unstruck
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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MMO-Champ updated that report with this:
MMO-Champion posted:
Firelands Changes Impact - Update
I may not have been clear enough when we posted the Firelands Graphs previously, so let me remind you that they are intended to show which changes made Firelands easier, not how many people raid.
Some people translated that to "1.35% of players saw the end game content!" and forgot that the sample was 2.7M characters, not 10 players, and someone smart pointed out that this % is probably around 15 or 20% at this point. (Which is pretty impressive for the end boss of the latest raiding tier)
I've no idea how that calculation was made, just sharing.
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Cawlin
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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So what are the rest of the "99%" going to do? Occupy Stormwind?
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Acao
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Cawlin posted:
So what are the rest of the "99%" going to do? Occupy Stormwind?
Isn't that what they do?
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Quazimortal
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Cawlin posted:
So what are the rest of the "99%" going to do? Occupy Stormwind?
Some of them will occupy Org as well.
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Shenron_
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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i will see what firelands looks like in 5 years or so. i saw black temple for the first time a few weeks back
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Zero_Washu
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Unstruck posted:
MMO-Champ updated that report with this:
MMO-Champion posted:
Firelands Changes Impact - Update
I may not have been clear enough when we posted the Firelands Graphs previously, so let me remind you that they are intended to show which changes made Firelands easier, not how many people raid.
Some people translated that to "1.35% of players saw the end game content!" and forgot that the sample was 2.7M characters, not 10 players, and someone smart pointed out that this % is probably around 15 or 20% at this point. (Which is pretty impressive for the end boss of the latest raiding tier)
I've no idea how that calculation was made, just sharing.
They were leaned on.
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CowboyPhil
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Plus there is one thing that MMO is not taking into account at all, what % of people aren't even trying. I mean I have 5 toons at 85 and only one have I even attempted FL on. It is not that I don't like raiding, but I don't like raiding on every friggin toon. I still think that instead of making all of the FL easy, they should spend less time on that and start making more dungeons or variable dungeons. Why are the dungeons exactly the same every time. WoW needs, variable dungeon layouts, with variable bosses and varible loot. This would make running that same dungeon over and over a little more intresting at least. I can not be that hard to program in some variables. Different mobs, different quantities, different locations.
I jus tthink this would take away a multitude of boredom of I go in, I go left, kill x mob turn right kill y mob.
At this point, with a good group I can run most dungeons on auto-pilot.
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Ugh_Lancelot
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Subject:
So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Zero_Washu posted:
Unstruck posted:
MMO-Champ updated that report with this:
MMO-Champion posted:
Firelands Changes Impact - Update
I may not have been clear enough when we posted the Firelands Graphs previously, so let me remind you that they are intended to show which changes made Firelands easier, not how many people raid.
Some people translated that to "1.35% of players saw the end game content!" and forgot that the sample was 2.7M characters, not 10 players, and someone smart pointed out that this % is probably around 15 or 20% at this point. (Which is pretty impressive for the end boss of the latest raiding tier)
I've no idea how that calculation was made, just sharing.
They were leaned on.
[edit] Even if 1.35% was used as the raw number versus total population, that would still only make it about 5.5% extrapolated. /shrug Still a tiny minority.
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Cawlin
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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If ignorance were painful, half the posters here would be on morphine drips.
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Demorak
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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CowboyPhil posted:
Plus there is one thing that MMO is not taking into account at all, what % of people aren't even trying. I mean I have 5 toons at 85 and only one have I even attempted FL on. It is not that I don't like raiding, but I don't like raiding on every friggin toon. I still think that instead of making all of the FL easy, they should spend less time on that and start making more dungeons or variable dungeons. Why are the dungeons exactly the same every time. WoW needs, variable dungeon layouts, with variable bosses and varible loot. This would make running that same dungeon over and over a little more intresting at least. I can not be that hard to program in some variables. Different mobs, different quantities, different locations.
I jus tthink this would take away a multitude of boredom of I go in, I go left, kill x mob turn right kill y mob.
At this point, with a good group I can run most dungeons on auto-pilot.
Blizzard is in the business of doing things cheaply now. They would most likely need to hire people that can actually code more than phasing or 'Don't stand in the fire boss mechanics', thus spending more money.
I'm still amazed with the resources this company has with WoW alone, how little it appears they do with it. I can't imagine what some MMO developers could pull off with their funding.
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PallyDog
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Demorak posted:
I'm still amazed with the resources this company has with WoW alone, how little it appears they do with it. I can't imagine what some MMO developers could pull off with their funding.
Seriously. They're not innovating. Why innovate? They're at the top atm. They won't worry about how they do things until they're challenged.
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-Peo-
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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PallyDog posted:
Demorak posted:
I'm still amazed with the resources this company has with WoW alone, how little it appears they do with it. I can't imagine what some MMO developers could pull off with their funding.
Seriously. They're not innovating. Why innovate? They're at the top atm. They won't worry about how they do things until they're challenged.
Exactly the problem. Couldn't have stated the problem better.
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Spookysheep
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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PallyDog posted:
Demorak posted:
I'm still amazed with the resources this company has with WoW alone, how little it appears they do with it. I can't imagine what some MMO developers could pull off with their funding.
Seriously. They're not innovating. Why innovate? They're at the top atm. They won't worry about how they do things until they're challenged.
Why innovate?
Hmm, maybe to get back that $15 million dollars per month they have no longer been enjoying for the past 6 months?
For starters...
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Sprawl-zero1eye-
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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"Innovate or die." --Bill Gates
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Sprawl-zero1eye-
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Acao posted:
Cawlin posted:
So what are the rest of the "99%" going to do? Occupy Stormwind?
Isn't that what they do?
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Demorak
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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PallyDog posted:
Demorak posted:
I'm still amazed with the resources this company has with WoW alone, how little it appears they do with it. I can't imagine what some MMO developers could pull off with their funding.
Seriously. They're not innovating. Why innovate? They're at the top atm. They won't worry about how they do things until they're challenged.
One day it will bite them in the ass harder than they can handle, not any time soon though.
My comment is more in the lines of the amount/type of content produced. At this stage in their development/lifespan and resource generation, they should have every damn thing automated to the point of churning out quality content on a monthly basis.
Expansions should be pouring out of their rear, like someone on the toilet after a Taco Bell binge.
They should be able to get content out for ALL styles of play, not just picking and choosing every 6 months to a year.
If they don't care to/can't innovate, then don't. But spew content out like no other company, so nobody could get bored because they won't run out of things to see or do.
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regulator_cracka
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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The 99% need to Occupy Azeroth!
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Elaok
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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I think this is the entire reason Raid Finder is being added its because they know the number of actual people raiding Firelands is low but i doubt its going to change much i really wish they'd start working on other stuff rather than Raids
its like they are being forced to do this so they can just make people go do the raids by making it so easy you just show up lol
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Bremen_Gaheris
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Elaok posted:
I think this is the entire reason Raid Finder is being added its because they know the number of actual people raiding Firelands is low but i doubt its going to change much i really wish they'd start working on other stuff rather than Raids
its like they are being forced to do this so they can just make people go do the raids by making it so easy you just show up lol
I have been following and reading up on the new "raid finder" and from what I can tell most people don't have a clue who and what it really is for. The feature is not for "scrubs" and "casuals" to be able to just show up at a raid. It is for semi-hardcore people to get together and pug raids. It will be epic fail and very little of the community will actually be able to take part in it.
Also, I am willing to bet that the gear requirements for using it are very high and will be the "too tall to ride the ride" sign for the masses. Another note, it is only for the newest raid from what I have read.
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kuide
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Wrong raid finder is for scrubs to gear up..there will be 2 levels above it,with better loot.
PvE is just to damn boring, once you kill a boss,you can sleep walk it the next 100 times,although people get excited about the numbers they do....I dont.
They could develop world pvp, with castles and quest zones that could be captured with ruthless rewards.Give players a choice.
RGB is pretty bad, same tactics most games...it's intense but so is bg's with 2 good sides fighting it out,and theres no wait time for that.
Cookie cutter specs for every class,are we really playing this game or is it playing us?
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Spookysheep
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Sprawl-zero1eye- posted:
"Innovate or die." --Bill Gates
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Sociop
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So only 1% of the player population has seen all of firelands and beat it.
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Zero_Washu posted:
Unstruck posted:
MMO-Champ updated that report with this:
MMO-Champion posted:
Firelands Changes Impact - Update
I may not have been clear enough when we posted the Firelands Graphs previously, so let me remind you that they are intended to show which changes made Firelands easier, not how many people raid.
Some people translated that to "1.35% of players saw the end game content!" and forgot that the sample was 2.7M characters, not 10 players, and someone smart pointed out that this % is probably around 15 or 20% at this point. (Which is pretty impressive for the end boss of the latest raiding tier)
I've no idea how that calculation was made, just sharing.
They were leaned on.
Or paid off.
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