Vault_News
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Daxxarri posted:
This is a topic we discuss a lot. We don't believe it has anything to do with game balance though. Rogues were also less popular than other classes at times when they consistently topped damage meters and dominated PvP. This isn't a trend that seems to rise and fall with current game balance. Overall, we've never seen a strong correlation between which class is considered overpowered and what players are playing. (Note: This is true overall, but if you move to smaller and smaller sample sizes, perhaps Arena teams above or below a certain rating threshold or raids above or below a certain level of progress, then you can see some correlations between power--real or perceived--and popularity.)
We do know that a lot of rogues appeared to reroll DK, at least when the class was first introduced. We also think rogues were more popular back in the day before flying mounts and instance-teleportation, where ganking someone out in the wilderness was more common. We saw a surge in the popularity of hybrid classes, especially druids and paladins, as running heroic dungeons became something nearly every player did instead of a more dedicated minority.
It's possible that some rogue mechanics which aren't as fun as they could be. This is a really subjective issue though, and it's trivial to find members of every class and spec declaring that their character is clunky and ill-conceived while some other class or spec appears sleek and shiny. We made some changes (i.e. stealth movement speed) to try and make some of the rogue mechanics more fun and this is the kind of thing we'll continue to keep an eye on.
Plenty of players love rogues though. We don't want to give the perception that the class is dying or anything like that. It's just less commonly played than say paladin, which is probably why you see so many paladin-related threads on all three forums.
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_Warlucky_
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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DPS que times as opposed to tank/healer que times. Duh
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TruthyID
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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_Warlucky_ posted:
DPS que times as opposed to tank/healer que times. Duh
This, plus they bring the least utility to a group.
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Shenron_
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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GutterSludge
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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I enjoy playing my rogue..
/shrug
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Trigeminal
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Here is my theory:
- They are melee in a game that favors ranged.
- They have one role (dps) and none other.
- They do not excel at their role (dps) in that almost any class can do the same or better damage.
- They only get pvp kills on poorly geared and poorly played opponents. Their pvp role now is support/control.
- I'm sure there are more but I'm tired.
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croaks35
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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TruthyID posted:
_Warlucky_ posted:
DPS que times as opposed to tank/healer que times. Duh
This, plus they bring the least utility to a group.
Ha more like the said in article that alot went to DK wondered where all the idiots that play DK come from sorry but old WoW 90% of the ppl who played a rogue sucked.No way did the move to a class like tank or healer.
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sarnsereg
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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lots of reasons.
the main is they are the only melee dps that can't do something other than DPS. while mages and locks are both ranged dps with no other options.... they are RANGED which means they are better off, plus they bring more utility to a raid than a rogue.
why play a rogue when you can play an enchancement shaman and provide more utility to a raid and also heal as an offspec? or a warrior or DK and have the ability to tank? or a druid or paladin and be able to both heal and tank as well?
if they'd given rogues heroism/blood lust or some sort of buff we'd see a few more.
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Riktor_before_IGN
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Above have mentioned many of the reasons why rogues in WoW do not function as smoothly as other dps classes but for a short answer as to why they have lost popularity over time I would agree with the above: DKs replaced Rogues in PvP and PvE.
Personally, I always found the combo system very silly and only more so when they added unique talents to fix its various shortcomings. Rogue stealth was pretty balanced around where it should be I thought, even in PvP. Then again, I rarely played a cloth class.
Rogues should have had the hunter's traps from Day 1. Traps should have been the rogue's primary AoE and/or severe debuff effect that would actually be noticed in a group environment. Probably the Diablo 2 assassin blueprint should have been adhered to more closely. They probably could use more options to improve mobility in WoW's fast paced combat, but the warrior has pretty much staked out that niche.
Hunter's should have had more unique buff effects or special interactions with their various pets that brought something unique to a group. Instead I find with your average pug huntard you might be better off just asking them to put the pet away and never bring it out.
In most fantasy RPG games that WoW is inspired by Rogues were your support or irregular fighters who did the noncombat stuff like opening locks and disarming traps, setting traps and preparing a battleground or ambush, and basically avoiding any sort of stand up toe to toe fight. Some go further and have various subclasses of rogues like Bards and such that bring alot more party utility at the cost of straight damage potential. WoW did not need nor want a disarming or buffing specialist to be a requirement and so made rogues lightly armored combat assassins that kill people by a 1000 papercuts and some nasty snot they put on their weapons.
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Kriegprojekt
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Anonymous posted:
Trigeminal posted:
Here is my theory:
- They are melee in a game that favors ranged.
- They have one role (dps) and none other.
- They do not excel at their role (dps) in that almost any class can do the same or better damage.
- They only get pvp kills on poorly geared and poorly played opponents. Their pvp role now is support/control.
- I'm sure there are more but I'm tired.
100% accurate.
- In PvP they are difficult to setup for stealth attacks because of all of the AoE attacks being thrown around.
- Almost zero utility.
- Burst damage isnt as "bursty" as they need to take down a player in PvP (see undergeared comment above).
Still - rogues are an absolute blast to play in PvE if you just want to do solo quests and fart around. Raiding, its very difficult due to the typically lower DPS than another DPS class.
Damn McAfree and their cookie deletion!
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mellaril
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Why are rogues the least played class?
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I'd like to see more benefit from Lockpick and Pickpocket. More locked chests and some decent loot. WotLk had a 100g Porecelain Bell as a fishing quest reward. Why not throw in a few high end vedor trash as a pickpocket reward? Toss a few more decent items into junkboxes. If they're using a Potion of Treasure Finding, let rogues picketpocket Tiny Treasure Chests.
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Spookysheep
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Why are rogues the least played class?
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Lets not forget that rogue armor and weapons become more and more retarded looking each tier, way worse than other classes.
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Groooovechampion
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Why least played?
para mi, senior:
- years long playstyle rape by the developers.
- better, innovating (ymmv) aspects of other classes.
- I'm no longer subbed as a career rogue like many others ;P (  )
- narrow-minded introduction of cookie cutter builds and other crap leading to point no.1.
- still no true open-TERRITORIAL pvp
- no warcraft
- other games proving how things can be implemented step by step without raping the class (or the subs ;P)
- oldschool devs/producers yet moving along while the bad apples stay and spread death and decay aoe.
- arrogant standpoint of blizzard most of the time although a wide majority says things otherwise
- other classes becoming extremly resilient (metaphorically and game-literally)
- wound poison changes , from stacks-application to single stack and then down to 10% efficient on heals that are some 5-digits large; and due to single stack, the anti-poison can be easily removed -_-.
- or the crap I had to put up with, farming rep day and night for an exalted-dagger with awesome stats at that time, just to find out that blizztard stealth-nerfed it to some crappy one - for no reason.
And that is not even the tip of the iceberg, bro.
And no, I still managed to kill things in pvp, but it was amazing what incredible force I had to throw in while others just had to press to magical buttons -- and even get away with it.
Fighting mages without the right spec was already brainless. Aside to frost armor, freeze root, iceblock and blink -- or how long that deepfreeze AoE 5sec stun + monster dmg was in the game...
Jesus crap, and Blizzard say they come with "near perfect" game design subjects?
Maybe I am taking things wrong.
At this point, I don't know why I didn't call my rogue Naruto earlier, regarding the few crappy abilities we when compared to the level of other new abilities on other classes.
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-Peo-
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Vault_News posted:
It's possible that some rogue mechanics which aren't as fun as they could be. This is a really subjective issue though, and it's trivial to find members of every class and spec declaring that their character is clunky and ill-conceived
I found this hilarious.
The reason you get a lot of people complaining about their class being clunky and ill-conceived is because...wait for it...
They ARE clunky and ill-conceived.
Occam's Razor? More like Occam's Bulldozer.
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Shenron_
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Why are rogues the least played class?
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Trigeminal
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Shenron_ posted:
do other classes beat rogues even at single target dps?
I have 4 relatively equally geared level 85s (350 to 355ish ilvl). My rogue is the lowest of the 4 on single target DPS... and no it is not because of a complex rotation :P I've yet to raid this expansion so YMMV once you get into 372 gear.
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Shenron_
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Why are rogues the least played class?
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Kriegprojekt
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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Trigeminal posted:
Shenron_ posted:
do other classes beat rogues even at single target dps?
I have 4 relatively equally geared level 85s (350 to 355ish ilvl). My rogue is the lowest of the 4 on single target DPS... and no it is not because of a complex rotation :P I've yet to raid this expansion so YMMV once you get into 372 gear.
I was one of the people who rolled a DK to play around with. Even with crappy blue/greens, my Frost DK could get about 15K DPS on a raid dummy. On my rogue, after the Sub changes, I could still only get about 8-9K DPS with better gear than my DK. The DK was so much better hands down utility-wise too. Hell, my crappy Frost mage was hitting 9K DPS at level 80 in garbage greens.
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formerly_addicted
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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the main reason imo:
PvE: their damage suck compared to other DPS Classes
PvP: they can not take damage and have only a few tricks to get away, once COS is down they are a free kill basicly
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Blisteringballs
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Why are rogues the least played class?
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I thought they were fun in pvp. Not the most effective but fun. In pve I felt like I was doing a lot of work for little results.
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sarnsereg
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Subject:
Why are rogues the least played class?
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I love my rogue, but it's just so much easier to dps as another class, especially ranged (which is why my main is a druid)
the fact that i am the most limited class as assassination. i HAVE to use daggers and nothing else. I HAVE to make sure i have my poisons on (and i've seen a blue recently respond to poisons being fine the way they are, which is a load of bull and i'll explain it later). i HAVE to be behind the target the majority of the time.... compare that to a mage/boomkin/lock where you can sit anywhere and press buttons and do damage. as ranged i lose a lot of dps by having to move and not being able to cast(or not cast as much/as powerful spells) but my rogue has to keep up and is out of range all the time.
how many other classes have those restrictions? maybe feral druids since they're wannabe rogues? they still don't worry about poisons or using a very specific weapon (i know they will once 4.2 hits and str doesn't give the same AP as agi for them) but no other class has to follow the rules so closely. and you only get 1 vanish per fight meaning that stealth, which is a strong suit and has half the rogue attacks, is simply useless in boss fights. but really, a rogue that isn't behind a boss loses half their skills, lose the poison and you have like 1 or 2 things you can do.
every other dps is much easier to play and not as restricted in fights.
as for the poisons, the blue made the remake "i remember when we had to make our own poisons" or sometihng to that effect implying it's easier now than back in vanilla or whenever they changed it.... that's still no excuse. poisons take bag space.. they removed arrows from hunters and shards from locks... yet rogues still need poisons... and like 5 or 6 kinds... why aren't poisons just spells? even if it just used a poison reagent it'd take 1 or 2 spots but i generally have 4 spots taken up. but really is a spell not just as easy to implement? i man, DK's have runeforging, they put it on and it's always there, they don't have those instances where halfway through a boss fight their spell wears off and then they can't do their main damaging attack anymore.
rogues can be fun, but in PvE they get beat out too easily from by essentially all other dps. in PvP they've added so much self healing to all the classes to really make it so you can kill anyone solo anymore.
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