In patch 4.1 we'll be introducing Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms, a new system intended to lower queue times. Call to Arms will automatically detect which class role is currently the least represented in the queue, and offer them additional rewards for entering the Dungeon Finder queue and completing a random level-85 Heroic dungeon.

Any time the Dungeon Finder queue is longer than a few minutes for level-85 Heroics, the Call to Arms system kicks in and determines which role is the least represented. In the case of tanking being the least represented role, the "Call to Arms: Tanks" icon will display in the Dungeon Finder UI menu where class roles are selected, and will also display on the UI when the queue pops and you are selected to enter a dungeon. Regardless of your role, you'll always be able to see which role currently has been Called to Arms, if any.

Call to Arms is meant to lower wait times by offering additional rewards for queuing as the currently least represented role. To be eligible for the additional rewards you must solo queue for a random level-85 Heroic in the role that is currently being Called to Arms, and complete the dungeon by killing the final boss. Every time you hit these requirements (there is no daily limit) you'll receive a goodie bag that will contain some gold, a chance at a rare gem, a chance at a flask/elixir (determined by spec), a good chance of receiving a non-combat pet (including cross faction pets), and a very rare chance at receiving a mount. The pets offered come from a wide variety of sources, and include companions like the Razzashi Hatchling, Cockatiel, and Tiny Sporebat, but the mounts are those specifically only available through dungeons (not raids), like the Reins of the Raven Lord from Sethekk Halls, Swift White Hawkstrider from Magister's Terrace, and Deathcharger's Reins from Stratholme.

This system is meant to address the unacceptable queue times currently being experienced by those that queue for the DPS role at max level. The long queue times are, of course, caused by a very simple lack of representation in the Dungeon Finder by tanks, and to some extent healers. We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little. While this system gives tanks and healers something extra, the incentive is being provided so that we can help players in the DPS role get into more dungeons, get better gear, and continue progressing.

While the gold, gems, flasks, and elixirs are OK incentives, we knew we needed something more substantial. We had briefly considered Valor Points and epics, but decided that wouldn't be working toward the goal of helping DPS players progress, and ultimately wouldn't keep tanks and healers in the Dungeon Finder system for very long. We settled on pets and dungeon-found mounts as they?re cosmetic/achievement items that players tend to try to get on their own, so why not change that up and offer them a chance to get some of those elusive pets and mounts in a way that also helps other players? Even if they don't get a pet or mount, or get one they already have, the gold and other goodies still feel rewarding enough that it won't feel like a waste of effort.

We think it's a pretty solid incentive to get tanks and healers queuing, give max-level players another way to collect the pets and mounts they so desire, and above all, to improve wait times for DPS players sitting in queues. In the case of lower level dungeons, it's actually not uncommon for DPS to be the least represented role, and so if this new system works out and we're pleased with the results, we may consider applying this same mechanic to lower level dungeons as well.

Boone-Eldar posted:

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If I can't roll through a Heroic in under 45 minutes like I could in WotLK I don't care what kind of rewards they give out.

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Spookysheep posted:

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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If I can't roll through a Heroic in under 45 minutes like I could in WotLK I don't care what kind of rewards they give out.

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The vast, vast majority agree, which is why blizzard is in panic mode.

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Bashiok posted:

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We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little.

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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Spookysheep posted:

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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If I can't roll through a Heroic in under 45 minutes like I could in WotLK I don't care what kind of rewards they give out.

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The vast, vast majority agree, which is why blizzard is in panic mode.

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Perhaps. I can only speak for myself as to why I no longer subscribe.

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HunterTalon posted:

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Actually there is nothing intrinsically wrong with the roles. The players are to blame for their own stupidity and ineptitude, but unfortunately as our service provider Blizzard is expected to come up with a fix for broken WoW players...

Sadly moving on to Rift/GW2/SWTOR/*insert upcoming title* will have no effect. The selfish, bad players that ruin PUGs in WoW will find their way to your new game too.

The only answer is to be a bad dps too so you find comfort in being part of the majority, or shoulder the Herculean task of carrying these nubcakes on your shoulders as one of the roles that are held accountable for the groups survival by the vocal majority.

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HunterTalon posted:

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Actually there is nothing intrinsically wrong with the roles. The players are to blame for their own stupidity and ineptitude, but unfortunately as our service provider Blizzard is expected to come up with a fix for broken WoW players...

Sadly moving on to Rift/GW2/SWTOR/*insert upcoming title* will have no effect. The selfish, bad players that ruin PUGs in WoW will find their way to your new game too.

The only answer is to be a bad dps too so you find comfort in being part of the majority, or shoulder the Herculean task of carrying these nubcakes on your shoulders as one of the roles that are held accountable for the groups survival by the vocal majority.

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HunterTalon posted:

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Actually there is nothing intrinsically wrong with the roles. The players are to blame for their own stupidity and ineptitude, but unfortunately as our service provider Blizzard is expected to come up with a fix for broken WoW players...

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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Spookysheep posted:

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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If I can't roll through a Heroic in under 45 minutes like I could in WotLK I don't care what kind of rewards they give out.

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The vast, vast majority agree, which is why blizzard is in panic mode.

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Perhaps. I can only speak for myself as to why I no longer subscribe.

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Vault_News posted:

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We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little.WoW Vault

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HunterTalon posted:

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Actually there is nothing intrinsically wrong with the roles. The players are to blame for their own stupidity and ineptitude, but unfortunately as our service provider Blizzard is expected to come up with a fix for broken WoW players...

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TruthyID posted:

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I was wondering when this post was coming. There's always a cadre of Blizzard apologists that shows up to place the blame on players.

The queue times are a reflection of how enjoyable the different archetypes are. People would rather wait 45 minutes to dps than instantly get in and tank because they enjoy dpsing so much more than tanking that the wait is worth it. Blizzard made significant changes to the way that tanks and healers work and the wait times in the LFD tool show that people don't enjoy the changes.

At the end of the day the dev team, and posters like Hunter, need to remember that WoW is a game and that people expect to have some fun in return for their $15/mo. The idea that we should play the game in a way that we don't enjoy to conform to the dev teams vision AND pay them for the privilege is totally ridiculous.

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HunterTalon posted:

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TruthyID posted:

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I was wondering when this post was coming. There's always a cadre of Blizzard apologists that shows up to place the blame on players.

The queue times are a reflection of how enjoyable the different archetypes are. People would rather wait 45 minutes to dps than instantly get in and tank because they enjoy dpsing so much more than tanking that the wait is worth it. Blizzard made significant changes to the way that tanks and healers work and the wait times in the LFD tool show that people don't enjoy the changes.

At the end of the day the dev team, and posters like Hunter, need to remember that WoW is a game and that people expect to have some fun in return for their $15/mo. The idea that we should play the game in a way that we don't enjoy to conform to the dev teams vision AND pay them for the privilege is totally ridiculous.

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I've always wanted to be a part of a cadre! Now if you describe my continuing antics as shenanigans my weekend will be complete, and it's only Friday!

I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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Bremen_Gaheris posted:

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So, why is everything apparently "going wrong" when PUGs are doing dungeons? And how is something being wrong with the dungeon design and philosophy the player's (paying customer's) fault?

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HunterTalon posted:

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I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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TruthyID posted:

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HunterTalon posted:

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I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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I would be more apt to believe you if this had been a problem as long as the LFD tool has been out but it hasn't been. The queues times have gone from 10-15 minutes in WotLK to 45 minutes or more in Cataclysm.

There are 2 main differences between then and now.

1. They redesigned the 5 man experience. Heroics take a hell of a lot longer so people are less likely to run more than one per day. Cataclysm heroics are a slog and are less fun than WotLK heroics. Once people have the gear they need out of heroics they're unlikely to return because they're not worth the effort, particularly when they're hitting the valor cap already.

2. They've redesigned the way that tanking and healing works in an effort to make it harder and as a result less people do it. Their effort to make the game more challenging made it less fun.

The playerbase hasn't changed, the game has. The increase in queue times is a reflection of people's dislike of the new design philosophy. It's not that people are stupid or bad or w/e other insult you want to fling at them, it's that they don't want to spend their free time doing something that isn't fun. We didn't experience this problem in WotLK because tanks and healers were more fun to play, in part because they didn't feel so impotent. Tanks and healers didn't get as much abuse either because the frustration level wasn't so high.

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hostagecat posted:

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TruthyID posted:

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HunterTalon posted:

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I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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I would be more apt to believe you if this had been a problem as long as the LFD tool has been out but it hasn't been. The queues times have gone from 10-15 minutes in WotLK to 45 minutes or more in Cataclysm.

There are 2 main differences between then and now.

1. They redesigned the 5 man experience. Heroics take a hell of a lot longer so people are less likely to run more than one per day. Cataclysm heroics are a slog and are less fun than WotLK heroics. Once people have the gear they need out of heroics they're unlikely to return because they're not worth the effort, particularly when they're hitting the valor cap already.

2. They've redesigned the way that tanking and healing works in an effort to make it harder and as a result less people do it. Their effort to make the game more challenging made it less fun.

The playerbase hasn't changed, the game has. The increase in queue times is a reflection of people's dislike of the new design philosophy. It's not that people are stupid or bad or w/e other insult you want to fling at them, it's that they don't want to spend their free time doing something that isn't fun. We didn't experience this problem in WotLK because tanks and healers were more fun to play, in part because they didn't feel so impotent. Tanks and healers didn't get as much abuse either because the frustration level wasn't so high.

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Pretty much this....

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TruthyID posted:

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HunterTalon posted:

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I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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I would be more apt to believe you if this had been a problem as long as the LFD tool has been out but it hasn't been. The queues times have gone from 10-15 minutes in WotLK to 45 minutes or more in Cataclysm.

There are 2 main differences between then and now.

1. They redesigned the 5 man experience. Heroics take a hell of a lot longer so people are less likely to run more than one per day. Cataclysm heroics are a slog and are less fun than WotLK heroics. Once people have the gear they need out of heroics they're unlikely to return because they're not worth the effort, particularly when they're hitting the valor cap already.

2. They've redesigned the way that tanking and healing works in an effort to make it harder and as a result less people do it. Their effort to make the game more challenging made it less fun.

The playerbase hasn't changed, the game has. The increase in queue times is a reflection of people's dislike of the new design philosophy. It's not that people are stupid or bad or w/e other insult you want to fling at them, it's that they don't want to spend their free time doing something that isn't fun. We didn't experience this problem in WotLK because tanks and healers were more fun to play, in part because they didn't feel so impotent. Tanks and healers didn't get as much abuse either because the frustration level wasn't so high.

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TruthyID posted:

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HunterTalon posted:

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I respect your opinion, but are you honestly saying that the protector and healer roles have always been sparsely populated in every game since 1975 is because those roles have never been correctly implemented so as to be fun? Be serious. Tanking is fun and healing is fun (ok this is subjective, I should say I find those roles fun)... the real reason people don't often fill those roles is because they get blamed when something goes wrong. Period.

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I would be more apt to believe you if this had been a problem as long as the LFD tool has been out but it hasn't been. The queues times have gone from 10-15 minutes in WotLK to 45 minutes or more in Cataclysm.

There are 2 main differences between then and now.

1. They redesigned the 5 man experience. Heroics take a hell of a lot longer so people are less likely to run more than one per day. Cataclysm heroics are a slog and are less fun than WotLK heroics. Once people have the gear they need out of heroics they're unlikely to return because they're not worth the effort, particularly when they're hitting the valor cap already.

2. They've redesigned the way that tanking and healing works in an effort to make it harder and as a result less people do it. Their effort to make the game more challenging made it less fun.

The playerbase hasn't changed, the game has. The increase in queue times is a reflection of people's dislike of the new design philosophy. It's not that people are stupid or bad or w/e other insult you want to fling at them, it's that they don't want to spend their free time doing something that isn't fun. We didn't experience this problem in WotLK because tanks and healers were more fun to play, in part because they didn't feel so impotent. Tanks and healers didn't get as much abuse either because the frustration level wasn't so high.

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TruthyID posted:

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I would be more apt to believe you if this had been a problem as long as the LFD tool has been out but it hasn't been. The queues times have gone from 10-15 minutes in WotLK to 45 minutes or more in Cataclysm.

There are 2 main differences between then and now.

1. They redesigned the 5 man experience. Heroics take a hell of a lot longer so people are less likely to run more than one per day. Cataclysm heroics are a slog and are less fun than WotLK heroics. Once people have the gear they need out of heroics they're unlikely to return because they're not worth the effort, particularly when they're hitting the valor cap already.

2. They've redesigned the way that tanking and healing works in an effort to make it harder and as a result less people do it. Their effort to make the game more challenging made it less fun.

The playerbase hasn't changed, the game has. The increase in queue times is a reflection of people's dislike of the new design philosophy. It's not that people are stupid or bad or w/e other insult you want to fling at them, it's that they don't want to spend their free time doing something that isn't fun. We didn't experience this problem in WotLK because tanks and healers were more fun to play, in part because they didn't feel so impotent. Tanks and healers didn't get as much abuse either because the frustration level wasn't so high.

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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Are people seriously so forgetful?

WOTLK heroics used to be as long when people were wearing green and ilvl187 blue at the start.

It just got to 10-15 mins at later part of the expansion when people outgear it with much better gear.

With a large portion of players in their ivl346 or higher gear, most Cata heroics take less than 30 mins to complete. With 4.1 patch, most people will be at 353 or higher, and will easily cut down the instance time by another 5 mins or more.

Even at this point, most heroic instances are cleared in exactly the WOTLK manner now, i.e AOE fest.

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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Are people seriously so forgetful?

WOTLK heroics used to be as long when people were wearing green and ilvl187 blue at the start.

It just got to 10-15 mins at later part of the expansion when people outgear it with much better gear.

With a large portion of players in their ivl346 or higher gear, most Cata heroics take less than 30 mins to complete. With 4.1 patch, most people will be at 353 or higher, and will easily cut down the instance time by another 5 mins or more.

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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[quote=TruthyID]

Game content needs to be challenging at the beginning of an expansion. This provides the players sense of achievement when they grow their characters.

During classic, it was the "hell, i spent 5 hours in BRD -- you guys having it easy"
During BC, it was "hell, i spent 5 hours in shadowlab -- you guys having it easy"
During WOTLK, it was "hell, I spent 5 hours in occulus -- you guys having it easy"

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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I wonder if we are all playing the same game.

I have 3 tank classes (Pally, Druid, DK). I usually do at least 2 random heroics (RH) per day, mostly as tank, but I do queue as healer for my pally/druid some days.

Over the last 4 months, I must have done over 150 RHs or more with total random strangers -- players with ungemmed, unchanted gear -- DPS doing less than 6K DPS, healers with 70k mana that OOM even on regular trash pull, and tank with 120K HP.

At Cata launch, the only 3 instances that I will even called them hard are Stonecore and Grim Batol(due to the very unforgiving mechanism), and ShadowFang Keep (people just can't interupts).

During first month cata, it's quite often that I have to sit through 15-20 players in these instances, and yet still unable to complete the place after 3-4 hours.

Four months down the road, with the nerf bat across the board, only Stonecore and Grim Batol can even be considered hard.

As a healer, the only fight that I OOM is Lost City last boss -- when you get players doing 6K DPS or less each.

Fortunately, there isn't really many new players in your RH player pools. Most of the time you met someone's alt who have done the instance and have some experience with the fight. Even my recent encounter with the 120K HP tank, he knew how to use his survival cooldown so that I (the healer) can keep him up.

I can only conclude that either you guys are extremely unlucky, or are just exaggerating much.

This vnboard forum seems to have transformed to a place for people who have lost interest with the game, or have quitted the game to hang out to bash whatever Blizzard is doing.

It's really that hard to move on to a new MMO or a new game genre eh?

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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This vnboard forum seems to have transformed to a place for people who have lost interest with the game, or have quitted the game to hang out to bash whatever Blizzard is doing.

It's really that hard to move on to a new MMO or a new game genre eh?

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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I wonder if we are all playing the same game.

I have 3 tank classes (Pally, Druid, DK). I usually do at least 2 random heroics (RH) per day, mostly as tank, but I do queue as healer for my pally/druid some days.

Over the last 4 months, I must have done over 150 RHs or more with total random strangers -- players with ungemmed, unchanted gear -- DPS doing less than 6K DPS, healers with 70k mana that OOM even on regular trash pull, and tank with 120K HP.

At Cata launch, the only 3 instances that I will even called them hard are Stonecore and Grim Batol(due to the very unforgiving mechanism), and ShadowFang Keep (people just can't interupts).

During first month cata, it's quite often that I have to sit through 15-20 players in these instances, and yet still unable to complete the place after 3-4 hours.

Four months down the road, with the nerf bat across the board, only Stonecore and Grim Batol can even be considered hard.

As a healer, the only fight that I OOM is Lost City last boss -- when you get players doing 6K DPS or less each.

Fortunately, there isn't really many new players in your RH player pools. Most of the time you met someone's alt who have done the instance and have some experience with the fight. Even my recent encounter with the 120K HP tank, he knew how to use his survival cooldown so that I (the healer) can keep him up.

I can only conclude that either you guys are extremely unlucky, or are just exaggerating much.

This vnboard forum seems to have transformed to a place for people who have lost interest with the game, or have quitted the game to hang out to bash whatever Blizzard is doing.

It's really that hard to move on to a new MMO or a new game genre eh?

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Sociop posted:

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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Are people seriously so forgetful?

WOTLK heroics used to be as long when people were wearing green and ilvl187 blue at the start.

It just got to 10-15 mins at later part of the expansion when people outgear it with much better gear.

With a large portion of players in their ivl346 or higher gear, most Cata heroics take less than 30 mins to complete. With 4.1 patch, most people will be at 353 or higher, and will easily cut down the instance time by another 5 mins or more.

Even at this point, most heroic instances are cleared in exactly the WOTLK manner now, i.e AOE fest.

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Hardly, the last two I attempted the groups could not even get past the first mob's and disbanded!

Cata heorics are like more like the last two ICC 5-mans only harder and to the day Cata was released the player base was still struggling with completing those particularly the last one. Or have you forgotten how many times you got that last one doing random and watched people leave as fast as the were porting in because the knew it was a fail waiting to happen?

Cata Heroics are flat out too difficult for the random pug player base in WoW to complete, it is as simple as that.

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Dums posted:

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Sociop posted:

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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Are people seriously so forgetful?

WOTLK heroics used to be as long when people were wearing green and ilvl187 blue at the start.

It just got to 10-15 mins at later part of the expansion when people outgear it with much better gear.

With a large portion of players in their ivl346 or higher gear, most Cata heroics take less than 30 mins to complete. With 4.1 patch, most people will be at 353 or higher, and will easily cut down the instance time by another 5 mins or more.

Even at this point, most heroic instances are cleared in exactly the WOTLK manner now, i.e AOE fest.

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Hardly, the last two I attempted the groups could not even get past the first mob's and disbanded!

Cata heorics are like more like the last two ICC 5-mans only harder and to the day Cata was released the player base was still struggling with completing those particularly the last one. Or have you forgotten how many times you got that last one doing random and watched people leave as fast as the were porting in because the knew it was a fail waiting to happen?

Cata Heroics are flat out too difficult for the random pug player base in WoW to complete, it is as simple as that.

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They're really not. We're only in the first tier.

When we're 3-4 tiers into Cataclysm, come back here and tell me that Halls of Origination or something is 'flat out too difficult'. You won't be able to.

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Sociop posted:

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Just like Wrath 5-man with Triumph and Frost gear we are in the first two tiers of Cata gear Justice and Valor. There is no difference, the last two ICC 5-man Heroics never got much easier and neither will Cata's.

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Spookysheep posted:

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Since,the posts here annoy you, is it it really that hard to move to a new forum eh?

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Exodus_The_Mage posted:

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I can only conclude that either you guys are extremely unlucky, or are just exaggerating much.

This vnboard forum seems to have transformed to a place for people who have lost interest with the game, or have quitted the game to hang out to bash whatever Blizzard is doing.

It's really that hard to move on to a new MMO or a new game genre eh?

Spookysheep posted:

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Since,the posts here annoy you, is it it really that hard to move to a new forum eh?

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Nah, you guys doing a great job here whining and bashing whatever Blizzard is doing.

It's great community service to help people quit WoW and get their life back.

Keep up the good work!

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GutterSludge posted:

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And what percentage of the population would you guess were "decked out in ICC 25 Heoric" gear at the end of Wrath?

5% ? Maybe?

Not knocking you, or your buddies..but what you are describing is not representative of the majority of the player-base...not by a long shot.

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GutterSludge posted:

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Waiting 45 min to an hour, just to wipe for an hour is a terrible mix, and has failure written all over it. It's more of a time issue than difficulty....and the end result is a disgruntled "normal, average" playerbase.

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Bashiok posted:

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We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little.

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Spookysheep posted:

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With all the panic mode posts blizzard has been putting out, my guess is most of them are choosing option b).

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Isoke posted:

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I'm typically fairly patient with developers in almost any game, but Blizzard (collectively -- not just the infamous GC) is starting to come across as really patronizing.

It's annoying as hell.

No, the "added responsibility" of healing is not what makes me avoid your stupid freaking Heroic queues. But thanks for telling me that's what the problem actually is, even though it's not at all how I, your customer, feel.

Idiots.

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Bremen_Gaheris posted:

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Isoke posted:

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I'm typically fairly patient with developers in almost any game, but Blizzard (collectively -- not just the infamous GC) is starting to come across as really patronizing.

It's annoying as hell.

No, the "added responsibility" of healing is not what makes me avoid your stupid freaking Heroic queues. But thanks for telling me that's what the problem actually is, even though it's not at all how I, your customer, feel.

Idiots.

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Exactly right. It is annoying and irritating to be talked down to like a child instead of a paying customer. I don't expect curbside, anytime night or day foot rub service from them for 15 dollars. But at least treat your customers/players with a modicum of respect.

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Blizzard_customer_service_hero(ine) posted:

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We did some investigation around the complaints of things being hard/tedious and found that the top two groups of people saying this are priest healers and DK tanks. We also found that of the specific incidents reported, 64% of the folks complaining were at a gear level that was well under what we consider optimal for the dungeon in question (aka DIQ). Additionally, we found that 91% of the complaints were centered around 2 instances, 61% of which were around 5 bosses in those two instances and 39% were around trash encounters in those instances. We think we have an idea why these cases are generating the most complaints but we'd like to compile more data. To that end, we now have a form you can fill out if you have serious issues with our instances. Please select the instance, difficulty level, your gear loadout (which you can easily import from loadouts we have recorded you wearing frequently over the last month) and spec and then provide us with a description of what you think was hard/difficult/not-fun in the selected encounter. We'll pull some numbers and publish the data so we are all clear on where the issues (or perception of issues) lie. We look forward to updating our customer expectations and keeping World of Warcraft the most entertaining game on the market.

Sincerely,
Not Ghostcrawler

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Sociop posted:

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Just like Wrath 5-man with Triumph and Frost gear we are in the first two tiers of Cata gear Justice and Valor. There is no difference, the last two ICC 5-man Heroics never got much easier and neither will Cata's.

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MinionX-DW posted:

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I use to be able to sign in on WOTLK, and do daily heroic on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid, and do it usually in around 1 hour.

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Ugh_Lancelot posted:

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MinionX-DW posted:

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I use to be able to sign in on WOTLK, and do daily heroic on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid, and do it usually in around 1 hour.

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Speaking of wearing helmets...

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MinionX-DW posted:

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Ugh_Lancelot posted:

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MinionX-DW posted:

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I use to be able to sign in on WOTLK, and do daily heroic on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid, and do it usually in around 1 hour.

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Speaking of wearing helmets...

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I'm not sure what you're saying?

that doing a heroics on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid (all 4 if that wasn't understand) is to long or to short.

Maybe I should offer you the helmet instead.

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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If I can't roll through a Heroic in under 45 minutes like I could in WotLK I don't care what kind of rewards they give out.

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MinionX-DW posted:

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that doing a heroics on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid (all 4 if that wasn't understand) is to long or to short.

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Boone-Eldar posted:

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MinionX-DW posted:

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Ugh_Lancelot posted:

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[quote=MinionX-DW]I use to be able to sign in on WOTLK, and do daily heroic on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid, and do it usually in around 1 hour.

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Speaking of wearing helmets...

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I'm not sure what you're saying?

that doing a heroics on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid (all 4 if that wasn't understand) is to long or to short.

Maybe I should offer you the helmet instead.

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Ugh_Lancelot posted:

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MinionX-DW posted:

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that doing a heroics on my Shaman/Warrior/Warlock/Druid (all 4 if that wasn't understand) is to long or to short.

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It wasn't understand. I am clearly now?

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