Author Topic: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Vault_News 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Nethaera posted:
There's a false perception that we don't want to change things or iterate on things regularly. This is not true. We are always looking at ways to improve the game and the systems within it. Finding the right solution though doesn't always happen as quickly as some would like, and when trying to account for human nature, things get a bit more difficult to predict. We can only provide the tools, see how things go, iterate on them, and see if things improve for you. But, these things take time and there's an awful lot of differing opinions out there.

No one is saying, "This is it, take it or leave it", we're simply saying, "This is our intention. Here's how we designed this to work/play out. Try it out and let us know how it goes."

We're still going to keep pushing to do better, to make things as balanced as possible, and to provide an epic and entertaining gaming experience. We just won't be able to do it overnight.

The Looking For Dungeon queue times are understood to be of issue for some people. If/when we find a better way to get you in to a dungeon quicker, we'll let you know.


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TepavCom 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Ha, long worded way of saying "please don't take this brush-off as a brush-off".


The solution for DF queue times is quite obvious:
If there are not enough Tanks queuing up, then form groups with the available DPS and Healer toons, and toss in a Tank-a-Bot to fight with them. Bots cure all!

 

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Shiba-X 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
I now have two toons that can " Tank " but I wont do it.

A) I dont know the dungys, Im a fresh 85 who just came back.

B) IF I was to queue it would be as a healer or DPS.. Simply because I could then learn the dungys at least some then move to tanking.



but really the biggest problem I have.. Are the people who play. If its not going smooth as a babys butt they bitch, moan, whine and complain. most of WoWs problem is directly due to the player base.

 

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NukeMage 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
So the real question is, how do we get more people to tank/heal?

Extra rewards in the form of jp, loot or gold?
Extra xp/faster leveling?
How to make it "more fun" without making it a /faceroll ?

 

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Northsidebill 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
"The Looking For Dungeon queue times are understood to be of issue for some people."

Some people? If you look at it like that then it gives you a good reason to never fix the problem. How about "issue for everyone but tanks", which is way way closer to the truth?

 

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Conceited 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Northsidebill posted:
"The Looking For Dungeon queue times are understood to be of issue for some people."

Some people? If you look at it like that then it gives you a good reason to never fix the problem. How about "issue for everyone but tanks", which is way way closer to the truth?


Yeah, "some people".

Not me, or the friends I queue with. Roll a tank, or roll with a tank.

The reason a lot of people don't tank is because of other players. So many of you are morons that make the experience so un-fun that they don't want to bother.

A prime example for me has been last few days. Had pro dps/heals for an entire night one night. Then another night we couldn't find anyone with half a clue or skill, made us not want to continue queuing up.

 

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Spookysheep 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Good ole' arrogant blizzard getting a little worried now.

 

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Zero_Washu 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Someone asked, how do we get more people to tank or heal?

My view, they broke the long working mechanics of the game too much to fix it without literally going back to square one. They won't do this because Cataclysm's changes were all to make their Arena Tournaments viable, less of the burst fest joke they were. They can't do it because of the time and money it would cost.

Why I didn't like tanking Cata content; I tanked every expansion and vanilla; is simply because too many dick move mobs. By that I mean mobs that just can do damage to you regardless of what your abilities are. Far too many are designed to ignore specific class traits. Used to be most special trash mobs could be faced to prevent group damage, not so much in Cata. Far too many have frenzy abilities or just spam casters who if you interrupt just cast again as if nothing happened.

Why I didn't like healing? Simple, the biggest nerf to ever be slapped on the players. Making spells cost 4x their mana does not make for a challenge, it makes for frustration. Having your character feel less capable every level they went up really made me feel that leveling was pointless. Who cares if I could do more content, I was less capable than the level before. Toss in the Arena oriented changes as to who can cleanse what or not and it just gets too annoying to care.

Even dps was annoying in this game. I spent all my tank classes in tank spec while leveling because of the gratuitous damage regular mobs had was more manageable especially being able to scrub crits off the charts. Having mobs that ignored the slowing effects of my casters; does every mob charge/jump now? This is worse than AC2's fix where mobs could go through trees, rocks, all the while hitting you with ranged attacks.

They already drove off too many tanks and healers to allow much of any fix to correct it.



FWIW : here are some heal numbers from the Shaman perspective, this is using a level 78 versus a level 85 with no gear on. Was not fun climbing from 80 to 85 and watching my mana pool go up by X but my spell costs go up many times faster

Chain Heal 2800-3200 healed for 771 mana at 78, at 85 it became 3400-3900 for 4404 mana. Earth shield, 1894 healed per hit, cost 733 mana and at 85 each orb healed 2443 but base spell cost was 4183 mana. Healing surge, the fast go to heal, at 78 cost you 1042 mana for 5800-6600 healed but at 85 it cost you 5946 mana for 7200-8200 healed.

 

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Arunne 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
"We're still going to keep pushing to do better, to make things as balanced as possible, and to provide an epic and entertaining gaming experience. We just won't be able to do it overnight."


This is the whole problem. They made heroics so epic that nobody wants to do it as a tank or healer. They dont want to nerf the dungeons, they dont want to buff the healing or tanks. So now they are sitting around trying to figure out how to fix this mess.

It may never happen....

 

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Alpha_Swift 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Does the DF queue only allow people within our Battlegroup or all PVE servers?

DPS queues are becoming so long that I if I can't find a guild group, I will usually log and try later.

 

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The_Korrigan 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Conceited posted:
The reason a lot of people don't tank is because of other players. So many of you are morons that make the experience so un-fun that they don't want to bother.
Exactly. Or the tanks just stick to guild groups where they can avoid the morons.
Personally, I don't feel like getting a ton of repair bills because of PUG idiots who don't know how to avoid fire patches.

 

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GutterSludge 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
repairs?

I could fully repair... i dunno..10,000 times and still have gold left over..

just saying.

 

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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Arunne posted:
"We're still going to keep pushing to do better, to make things as balanced as possible, and to provide an epic and entertaining gaming experience. We just won't be able to do it overnight."


This is the whole problem. They made heroics so epic that nobody wants to do it as a tank or healer. They dont want to nerf the dungeons, they dont want to buff the healing or tanks. So now they are sitting around trying to figure out how to fix this mess.

It may never happen....


The Heroics aren't the problem. They're harder than BC/Wrath, for sure, but I still find them pretty easy. The -only- time they get hard is when the players aren't paying attention. I'm guilty of this on rare occasion(stood in the sunbeam deal in Lost City, cause was watching something else).

Was in a Throne group last night, was a total fail because the priest healer sucked, bad. He even blamed it on us. He finally left, a druid came in, rest of the run went almost perfect.

 

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Riktor_before_IGN 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Just to reinforce how in demand tanks are at 85, I raised a worgen druid from 1 to 85 recently and after leaving the starting area spent the majority of my time queuing for all roles in random dungeons. I'd say about 75% of that time I was healing and the remaining 25% tanking. Once I qualified for Cata dungeons I believe I may have healed perhaps a handful of times but 99% of the time its been instant queues for bear tanking.

I have been tanking random heroics as a DK, paladin, warrior and now the druid as well, but I have to admit, about half the time at 85 the near instant queue popup will be an inprogress instance and I just have to grit my teeth. If you have not tanked lately, you probably can't begin to imagine how hard it is not to just leave queue knowing you are going to be spawning square in the middle of a total disaster.

Repair bills never bothered me, Money is utterly pointless in this game, but I have extremely limited patience for wasting my free time with people who don't even attempt to learn from their mistakes or improve their knowledge of these new areas.

I entered an inprogress H Deadmines last night as an obvious rage quit tank replacement in time to hear random DPS DK A-hole proclaim that he never wipes, the tank just sucked and he proceeds to deathgrip some CC immune ogres over while people are afk. So after kicking him unsurprisngly with some explanation of the bosses it was a pretty smooth run.

My gripe is not the difficulty of the new dungeons, hell it's the best thing about this expansion by far, my gripe is as others have said above with some of the players of this game. You have basically 2 types of people in Cata dungeons both regular and heroic now. A) People who have been there and know it, or at least ask and listen and learn it B) People, almost entirely DPS players, who don't know it, don't want to learn it, but think everyone else should carry them through it. You could make that work easily in WotLK, and still can even in the majority of regular Cata dungeons, you will just spend 30s or so waiting for your empty healer to drink after every fight. Heroics though, it's way too vital to follow a kill order, CC certain things, and do the dance with death around the various boss abilities for this attitude to work.

 

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JzeroVN 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
===
We're still going to keep pushing to do better, to make things as balanced as possible, and to provide an epic and entertaining gaming experience. We just won't be able to do it overnight.
===

They can't make it better overnight but sometimes it seems like they can screw it up overnight (almost). tongue

 

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IndridCole 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Shiba-X posted:
I now have two toons that can " Tank " but I wont do it.

A) I dont know the dungys, Im a fresh 85 who just came back.

B) IF I was to queue it would be as a healer or DPS.. Simply because I could then learn the dungys at least some then move to tanking.



but really the biggest problem I have.. Are the people who play. If its not going smooth as a babys butt they bitch, moan, whine and complain. most of WoWs problem is directly due to the player base.
I ran Grim last night with my Guild Leader, we both went as DPS. Now that I know the fights, after having read them and seen them in action, I'll go back and tank them.

 

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IndridCole 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Conceited posted:
Northsidebill posted:
"The Looking For Dungeon queue times are understood to be of issue for some people."

Some people? If you look at it like that then it gives you a good reason to never fix the problem. How about "issue for everyone but tanks", which is way way closer to the truth?


Yeah, "some people".

Not me, or the friends I queue with. Roll a tank, or roll with a tank.

The reason a lot of people don't tank is because of other players. So many of you are morons that make the experience so un-fun that they don't want to bother.

A prime example for me has been last few days. Had pro dps/heals for an entire night one night. Then another night we couldn't find anyone with half a clue or skill, made us not want to continue queuing up.
I have to agree with you. Why blame Blizzard if some people can't or won't learn to play? Why are people in so much of a hurry to show others how much they suck?(tad harsh) In otherwords it seems like people want faster cue times to ruin the experience for other people.

 

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steveC91 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
I am no great fan of atunements but there is a point that players should be competent on normal’s before they step into Hcs.
Maybe have to run them a specific number of times on normal to unlock HCs

Also raising the ilvl a bit might help because better gear = more room to make mistakes.

 

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Spookysheep 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
Well, since the thread is necro'd anyway grin


Blizzard's latest "solution" turned out even worse than we predicted. I'm already seeing non-stop complaints about the barrage of "tanks" in LFD queues, who, of course, have no tanking gear at all.

 

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GutterSludge 
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Subject: Dungeon Finder Queue Times
If only the game were skill based, and not gear based...

This problem would have never existed.

Ever.

 

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