slythetove
Title: Julie's Pool Boy
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Maxximuss you were so right
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I'm done trying to heal on the priest unless / until they make serious changes. I've experimented, gear changes, enchants, spec, usage, style etc etc. Not my first rodeo.
Man... you were right. It's horrid. PvE? Atrociously not fun. PvP? Wow... worst I've ever seen.
I'll see ya in a few days after the frustration and shock wears off. You can bet I'll be specced shadow.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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pattongb
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Ok who bought Sly's account on ebay?
-----signature-----
Rift - Having fun
WoW - Just cant do it anymore...
"WAR and AoC also showed that a strong, nerd-attracting IP can only get you so far
before the cognitive dissonance starts to wear off" - bOrngamer
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slythetove
Title: Julie's Pool Boy
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Maxximuss you were so right
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lol What?! I've always respected Maxx re: priests! Known him in game forever. I actually remember the Arathi Basin where I first met him, and was impressed for the first time by a priest.
He's one of the oldest priest players I know, and has always been one of the best. Always a valuable reference point for the state of priests. I never had mine at max level, so I would be able to get a good "feel" for the class just by talking with him.
We happened to chat about the state of priests in Cata over this past weekend before I hit 85 (he was already 85) and he was telling me his opinions on the state of things. He nailed it. My experience mirrors exactly what he warned me of.
I was actually hoping he was wrong this time!! 
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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pattongb
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Haha well the Sly I remember who posts here didnt seem like the type to not like something because it was challenging... 
Thought maybe ebay was in the equation, you know with the holidays and all.....
-----signature-----
Rift - Having fun
WoW - Just cant do it anymore...
"WAR and AoC also showed that a strong, nerd-attracting IP can only get you so far
before the cognitive dissonance starts to wear off" - bOrngamer
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jojo263
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Blizzard is going to have to make everything a AoE fest again it's way too late to go back to the way things were. Way too many people use the dungeon finder now to leave things the way they are.
-----signature-----
Get armed
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slythetove
Title: Julie's Pool Boy
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Maxximuss you were so right
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pattongb posted:
Haha well the Sly I remember who posts here didnt seem like the type to not like something because it was challenging...
Thought maybe ebay was in the equation, you know with the holidays and all.....
Sorry patton, same guy. This isn't challenge, it's broken.
If you aren't playing a priest healing randoms with LFD, and trying to PvP and heal in a PuG BG, I'm sorry but you have no idea what you're talking about in this case. No offense, but it's a fact.
I've not once in the entire 6 years I've played this game ever experienced such a bad state on any of my classes / roles. I'm not some guy who doesn't try to work with the issues. I've done all that. The design is terrible. It's causing healers to quit healing in droves. It makes the healer the sole point of blame for any issue with a group, and it's not fun. On top of that priests in particular are so bad that many priests are reporting being kicked as soon as they enter a dungeon with a reason of "priests suck" or "priest heals are bad".
That's not challenge.
The type of player in general who spent the effort to be 85 in under a week, who plays their class, who researches it, respecs, reglyphs, reforges, re-enchants, and re-learns is who I am. When I'm hating life, it will only be worse for the next wave of 85s.
They'll change it, and I pray soon and dramatically.
There are already reports of a stealth buff to priest mana regen, and here's a link where Blizzard basically admits their class design team already knows priests aren't working correctly.
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1531763402?page=5#82
"To be fair the priest issues are well known on the class design team. Mana regen probably needs a buff or mana regen in some way needs to be addressed for ... us."
This is not about challenge. This is about flaws in the design for healing and priest healing specifically.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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TinMan52
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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I trust that you are frustrated by change, but I'm always wary of a sky-is-falling-on-me / I quitting my class/spec for something more fotm type of post. I've listened to a number of trusted podcasts and seen youtube videos that prove that things aren't nearly as bad as they're being made out to be here.
Sometimes trying something different is good though, so I wish you the best with Shadow and hopefully things eventually become less frustrating for you as a healer.
-----signature-----
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kyrv
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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TinMan52 posted:
I trust that you are frustrated by change, but I'm always wary of a sky-is-falling-on-me / I quitting my class/spec for something more fotm type of post. I've listened to a number of trusted podcasts and seen youtube videos that prove that things aren't nearly as bad as they're being made out to be here.
Sometimes trying something different is good though, so I wish you the best with Shadow and hopefully things eventually become less frustrating for you as a healer.
I agree with you on the knee jerk "I quit this class" however Sly has played the class through and tried quite a few variations - I don't think that's entirely fair to lump him in with the ragequitters.
I'm not planning on healing anything remotely high end for now, seeing how this plays out. Fyi boring story, I was a priest healer in vanilla WoW, that was my original end game choice.
-----signature-----
CO, LOTRO, RoM, PWI, CoH
Dragon Age
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slythetove
Title: Julie's Pool Boy
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Maxximuss you were so right
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TinMan52 posted:
I trust that you are frustrated by change, but I'm always wary of a sky-is-falling-on-me / I quitting my class/spec for something more fotm type of post. I've listened to a number of trusted podcasts and seen youtube videos that prove that things aren't nearly as bad as they're being made out to be here.
Sometimes trying something different is good though, so I wish you the best with Shadow and hopefully things eventually become less frustrating for you as a healer.
I'm not saying "the sky is falling drama drama". You can see by my class list I could have taken any class to 85, and I still can. This isn't FoTM. I wanted to take the priest up to heal because the style was interesting at long last. I'm saying there is a real issue here. Blizzard knows it, and the people playing priests know it (even the ones who want to be cool by saying there's no issue L2P etc know it). It's the most glaring thing I've seen in 6 years of WoW regarding a class.
I realize that you don't know me as a player, so I appreciate the thought, and I know you don't really have any reason to believe me, but I've seen the videos and so forth as well.
First, they are the minority. Second, there are specific reasons why those people are ok with putting up with this. Third, they usually have guild groups, or at least people that know and do exactly the right things, and always they have better gear. They don't post videos of the average PuG run right after they hit 85. They ran those dungeons with their guild, got geared, then jumped in a pug and made a video. That means nothing about how the class is working objectively. DPS classes can jump into a heroic at ilvl 329 and perform their job without issue. You'll notice the folks in the videos are above that gear level before they make those videos.
I've had runs that weren't horrid because every player did everything right too. I'm not saying I couldn't make a video and pretend everyone else sucks. What I am telling you is unless everyone does it right every time the class fails. Anything goes wrong, the priest class isn't currently set up to deal with anything off near perfect. It's tedious and not fun. It's a real problem. There are pages of priests posting how they are getting kicked from groups before the first pull because the community's general experience with a priest healer has not been positive. After a week. That's a very noticeable symptom if you think about it.
I'm not even talking heroics. I'm talking gearing, and specing, and enchanting to heal and at 84 it was annoying but workable, and at 85 it's a nightmare. It's like having your balls cut off in one level. Disc was unplayable for healing, so I speced holy, and re-geared, and reforged, and re-enchanted, and while I can survive, it's like fighting for your life for no reason. PvP is even worse. It's pointless.
Then I hear people in my own guild tell me - "yeah I like pally or shaman healers, and druids are ok. All the priests can't seem to cut it." None of them have actually healed anything either.
If only it were just "frustrated by change". I wish. I play all the classes I play because I like variety and change, so... that's not it. I can offer you nothing but my word on that front. There is objectively a problem here, and Blizzard has actually stated the same as I pointed out earlier.
I do appreciate the good wishes for my shadow spec play though, and I hope for a speedy resolution so that the queue times for DPS don't reach 2 hours due to lack of healers.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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slythetove
Title: Julie's Pool Boy
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Just to illustrate, it's not me going "oh the sky is falling". They have already buffed priests according to this recent Blizz post.
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1532043235?page=77#1532
"Paladins seem much more in line with other healers (with the exception of priests, who we have since buffed -- hotfix updates on that coming this afternoon: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/1232869)."
Problem is / was very real. I hope this fixes it or at least helps. I want to heal on my priest without wanting to kill myself in real life.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
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Mayhem702
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Maxximuss you were so right
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My main is a priest, raided with it before the xpac. I'm currently leveling to 85 just questing and healing random dungeons here and there.
Unless the problems you are referring to are at level 85 in heroics i have yet to have any issues healing randoms, aside from my first run not having cure disease bound to the correct key and letting the tank die on that first boss in Vashj'ir.
so for me, until i read your post i didn't even realize there was a problem, not saying there aren't things that need to be fixed.
i dunno, maybe you went into these randoms groups expecting to fail because of everything you had already heard, and that changed your experience.
-----signature-----
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Shenron_
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Maxximuss you were so right
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gladiator was great
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Auenwing
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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Sly, I'm listening and appreciating the info you're posting. When you said you had to respec from disc to holy and just focused on keeping you and the tank alive (one of your previous posts on another thread), I paid even more attention. I've been in that place. It's ugly. (Some of us have played since vanilla, have healed in 40 and 25-man raids, have been the main tank healer in same. We're concerned.)
You're taking a seasoned approach, collecting data, experimenting. Sounds like you've done everything you can to make it work. That's not "I quit". That's "this is unreasonable".
My understanding is that some priests are struggling with shadow at 85 instances as well with mana issues.(edit: don't know if this is an adjustment problem or not.)
Like I said before Cata came out, I'm expecting 6 months of tweaking. That doesn't mean it won't be hellish in the meantime.
Let's see how much damage control Blizz can do before we have a healer shortage.
-----signature-----
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The weapon is only as good as the person wielding it.
Free advice is often worth what you pay for it: nothing.
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slythetove
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Mayhem702 posted:
My main is a priest, raided with it before the xpac. I'm currently leveling to 85 just questing and healing random dungeons here and there.
Unless the problems you are referring to are at level 85 in heroics i have yet to have any issues healing randoms, aside from my first run not having cure disease bound to the correct key and letting the tank die on that first boss in Vashj'ir.
so for me, until i read your post i didn't even realize there was a problem, not saying there aren't things that need to be fixed.
i dunno, maybe you went into these randoms groups expecting to fail because of everything you had already heard, and that changed your experience.
No, I didn't go in expecting to fail and hadn't really heard a lot about it. The problem also is absolutely not the same before 85. You are "currently leveling to 85". I didn't see a big issue either when I was leveling to 85. Not the same at 81 not even at 84. Only 85 is where you will fully see it. I don't know why, but it's true.
I healed the Lost City of Tol'vir at 84, and it really wasn't too bad. I healed it as disc and smite healed even about 25% of the time. I healed it right after dinging 85, and wished I could UNlevel. I'm dead serious. It was easier by far at 84.
Now that they've buffed mana regen you might not see it at all because you weren't 85 before the first buffs, but it is an 85 issue.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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Spookysheep
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Maxximuss you were so right
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One day we'll all look back and talk about "the great healer boycott of 2010"
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I liek cheese
Pirates > Ninjas
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slythetove
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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Auenwing posted:
Sly, I'm listening and appreciating the info you're posting. When you said you had to respec from disc to holy and just focused on keeping you and the tank alive (one of your previous posts on another thread), I paid even more attention. I've been in that place. It's ugly. (Some of us have played since vanilla, have healed in 40 and 25-man raids, have been the main tank healer in same. We're concerned.)
You're taking a seasoned approach, collecting data, experimenting. Sounds like you've done everything you can to make it work. That's not "I quit". That's "this is unreasonable".
My understanding is that some priests are struggling with shadow at 85 instances as well with mana issues.(edit: don't know if this is an adjustment problem or not.)
Like I said before Cata came out, I'm expecting 6 months of tweaking. That doesn't mean it won't be hellish in the meantime.
Let's see how much damage control Blizz can do before we have a healer shortage.
I appreciate the credit Auen.
I've heard the rumblings starting about shadow and mana issues, but as I have not personally done it in a dungeon at level 85, I can't comment on that yet.
Regarding priest healing, given the fact that we are already seeing knee jerk mana regen hotfixes to holy and disc priests I'm pretty sure Blizzard is running fire drills now. The healer queue going from 8 to 10 minutes to instant in just a few days is meaningful, and indicative. The forums are blowing up about healing, and even non-healers are sometimes the ones starting threads complaining and threatening to quit.
I will definitely be the first to post once my experiences change for the positive, but tonight I'm not even logging in. I need a break. It's that bad.
--Sly
-----signature-----
"a slap in the face" since 1975
85 Priest - 85 Hunter - 85 Mage - 83 Druid
81 Warlock - 80 Paladin - 80 DK
70 Rogue - 70 Warrior
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Elkabong08
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Maxximuss you were so right
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I am really glad I shelved my priest at level 70. My main is a LolRogue . We got jerked around pretty good in BC. They gave us haste, they took away haste, buff, nerf, buff nerf, ad nauseum. But all that did was effect Rogues. We did a little less DPS for a while, we changed our weapons, changed our specs, and eventually went back to doing pretty good single target DPS. The rest of the game went about it's merry way.
The priest issue is different. This is game changing. Major changes to healing and tanking should be thoroughly researched before being implemented. It affects the entire game and every class in the player base. The healing changes seem to be a knee jerk reaction to mistakes made in WotLK. Oh, the DPS needs to re LTP. Yeah, probably. But Blizzard, you TAUGHT them these bad habits in WotLK. At least you encouraged them. If this were any other game than the almighty WoW, Blizzard would be paying a huge price for these major swings and corrections.
Having said all that, it's still the best game out there (trust me, I've played them all recently) and I doubt most of us will be going anywhere. But I did expect better from this team.
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Spookysheep
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Maxximuss you were so right
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The entirety of the changes are going to end up being a failed experiment on blizzard's part.
WOTLK was so successful because of the dumbing down and ease of the game.
Going back to "hardcore" is not going to work and they will soon find this out.
I'm amazed they tried this experiment at all.
-----signature-----
I liek cheese
Pirates > Ninjas
.....................................
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jojo263
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Spookysheep posted:
The entirety of the changes are going to end up being a failed experiment on blizzard's part.
WOTLK was so successful because of the dumbing down and ease of the game.
Going back to "hardcore" is not going to work and they will soon find this out.
I'm amazed they tried this experiment at all.
Yup until then I'm just working the Auction house.. I loved wotlk I didn't get to play a lot but I was still able to get decent gear on a few other characters. instead of just one like I did up till the end of BC.
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Get armed
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Ugh_Lancelot
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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Spookysheep posted:
The entirety of the changes are going to end up being a failed experiment on blizzard's part.
WOTLK was so successful because of the dumbing down and ease of the game.
Going back to "hardcore" is not going to work and they will soon find this out.
I'm amazed they tried this experiment at all.
If they're really going back to "hardcore" then they're obviously going about it stupidly. At least in pre-4.0, it was complexity that made things hard, not pure numbers. If people just wanted raw numbers stacked against them, they could go play an RTS on insane mode.
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sarnsereg
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Maxximuss you were so right
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let's put it this way...
i am willing to sit in a queue for 45 minutes rather than heal and get an instant group
i think that says enough
-----signature-----
"...and they'll say "Hey, Look at him!, I'll never live that way". And that's ok they couldn't anyway..."
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regulator_cracka
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Maxximuss you were so right
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slythetove posted:
 I am gonna whine till they fix the game for me!
--Sly
Tis sad your little tirade will go unnoticed here.
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If you think my opinion is idiotic, re-read yours.
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JaredKorry
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Maxximuss you were so right
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regulator_cracka posted:
slythetove posted:
I am gonna whine till they fix the game for me!
--Sly
Tis sad your little tirade will go unnoticed here.
What there a point to this utterly useless, smart ass comment?
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Spookysheep
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Maxximuss you were so right
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JaredKorry posted:
regulator_cracka posted:
slythetove posted:
I am gonna whine till they fix the game for me!
--Sly
Tis sad your little tirade will go unnoticed here.
What there a point to this utterly useless, smart ass comment?
Is there a point to this utterly useless whine about what someone else is posting?
-----signature-----
I liek cheese
Pirates > Ninjas
.....................................
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huldu
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Wussies, all of you. No wonder they need to dumb down the game.
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"Boy, the next word that comes out of your mouth better be some brilliant *****' Mark Twain ****. 'Cause it's definitely getting chiseled on your tombstone."
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Auenwing
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Let's be clear for those who might have failed to understand: nobody is asking for a return to LK AoE walks in the park.
I believe the concern lies with Blizzard oversteering too far in one direction with the priest. Something that they've basically acknowledged.
Tuning that back to a reasonable level is a reasonable response.
This is pretty standard for most MMO's (and Blizz) in the constant nerf-buff cycle of adjustment(s) (especially if they "missed" during Beta testing.)
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The weapon is only as good as the person wielding it.
Free advice is often worth what you pay for it: nothing.
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Broken_Kayfabe
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Maxximuss you were so right
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Everything is fine, you do not question The Blizzard.
-----signature-----
Thanks, but it's been fun
Five more minutes then I'm done!
I've been saying that to myself since
...yesterday.
- from "Has anybody seen my corpse". Man Everquest rocked back in the day...
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azger
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Maxximuss you were so right
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This has nothing to do with dumbing down anything, it's about making sure the classes are working correctly. Pallys were over tuned and Priest are under tuned that is all. They made one fix to try and help out I'm sure we will see a few more. I don't think they will touch the instances until they get the classes fixed first.
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-MrBean-
Title: Now With Extra Baldness
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Subject:
Maxximuss you were so right
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azger posted:
This has nothing to do with dumbing down anything, it's about making sure the classes are working correctly. Pallys were over tuned and Priest are under tuned that is all. They made one fix to try and help out I'm sure we will see a few more. I don't think they will touch the instances until they get the classes fixed first.
Playing a pally before and after the nerf... I don't believe that palys were over tuned at all. Blizzard changed the mechanic of how we play to give us a new shiny thing called holy power. They wanted us to have an extra tab to manage and watch. And now, its a PITA to get that extra resource, and still maintain heals on a group without going OOM in a matter of seconds.
Remember, they added holy power. I didn't see anyone, anywhere ask for that.
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